Is Kyler Murray the answer at QB for next year and beyond?

[kerouac9]

What's your measure of success here? You have Eagles and Ravens in the good side but they haven't won anything. Neither have the Niners.

But you have Steelers in the bad side with their no losing seasons in 20 years and consistent playoff appearances. Also Tampa, who built a great roster and parachuted Brady in to win a SB.

The line seems all over the place.

You can argue that the most successful teams of the past 5 years built good rosters and then dropped in the quarterback to get them over. Chiefs, Eagles, Bucs, Niners and Rams. The only consistently good team I can think of that drafted in a rookie QB in the last 5 years and became constant challengers in their division and next to automatic playoff team because of that QB is the Bengals with Burrow.

This is a simplistic view of course, there are other factors like coaching but I think it's easy to argue there is no single way to do it and the situation we find ourselves in with Kyler's contract rather ties our hands.

Purgatory as @DVontel has seemed to define it is anywhere between winning more than 5.5 games in a season and making a Conference Championship game. So I'm using his broad definition to define success here.

You should add Buffalo to your list of successful teams over the past five years, boyo. Josh Allen didn't arrive with much. Probably drop Miami in there, too.

I'm a Tomlin and Steelers fan, but they've made the playoffs twice in the past six seasons and haven't won a playoff game since 2016.

The Rams were in the Super Bowl three years before they won it, and had a young QB in Goff who they built around after going 4-12. They were 43-21 before Stafford arrived.

 

[wagon mound 464]

As per the republic Repulsive article:


"The Cardinals, unfortunately, have laid one egg after another in pursuit of coaches, systems and young players who can help lead the team.

The draft day differences go way beyond the inevitable comparison of Kyler Murray, No. 1 overall in 2019 and struggling, vs. Brock Purdy, last overall in 2022 and playing like an MVP.

Sunday’s numbers were flat-out embarrassing. And not just the $46 million that Murray makes vs. the $800,000 that Purdy gets.

(That’s funnier if you go per game. Murray gets about $2.7 million per game. For Purdy, it’s about $47,000. … It’s funnier still if you break that down to games Murray has played. If he plays in Arizona’s final three games, he’ll have made about $6.6 million per game.)"

 

[DVontel]

Purgatory as @DVontel has seemed to define it is anywhere between winning more than 5.5 games in a season and making a Conference Championship game. So I'm using his broad definition to define success here.

That’s not my definition of purgatory at all & you know that.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

As per the republic Repulsive article:


"The Cardinals, unfortunately, have laid one egg after another in pursuit of coaches, systems and young players who can help lead the team.

The draft day differences go way beyond the inevitable comparison of Kyler Murray, No. 1 overall in 2019 and struggling, vs. Brock Purdy, last overall in 2022 and playing like an MVP.

Sunday’s numbers were flat-out embarrassing. And not just the $46 million that Murray makes vs. the $800,000 that Purdy gets.

(That’s funnier if you go per game. Murray gets about $2.7 million per game. For Purdy, it’s about $47,000. … It’s funnier still if you break that down to games Murray has played. If he plays in Arizona’s final three games, he’ll have made about $6.6 million per game.)"

Comparing anyone's salary to Mr. Irrelevant is silly...Niners aren't any great geniuses for hitting on Purdy...they didn't even decide to acquire him until the last pick of the draft. If they truly believed in him as a prospect, wouldn't they have drafted him earlier?

 

[Crimson Warrior]

@Crimson Warrior Would have guessed Baker Mayfield would have 24 tds to 8 ints. While Kyler has 4 tds to 4 ints.
Tough times.

haha, well good for Baker. Absolutley loved him at OU. Loved him.

And I think what this demonstrates is that a "broken" QB can resurect their career, if they hang in there.

Do you have a lean for what kind of supporting cast Mayfield has around him in TB? Just between you and I, I think that's key for Murray. To have some WRs besides Zach Paschal to catch passes from.

 

[SoonerLou]

He’s simply broken both mentally and physically. Working for this organization can do that to people.

In reality Kyler's 2023 season was cooked the moment he tore his ACL, then when Bidwill hired Monti, Monti hired DC Gannon, and Gannon hired first time OC Petzing.

As an organization you do nothing to improve the skill position talent outside of injury riddled Michael Wilson.

Nothing about the offseason seemed like he cared about making Kyler better. More about getting assets for 2024. And I like the guys involved (outside of Bidwill), but this was the fear.

A non Sean Payton/Demeco Ryans (People here were high on the 49ers assistant) hire was going to have a brutal 2023 season.

I feared Kyler returning and looking like Deshaun Watson on the Browns. And thats exactly what he is. He's not a fit. And he's not a guy who can play well without good talent.

Kyler will be back. However, this feels like he's a contract they are stuck with and just biting the bullet for 2 years until they off him.

 

[kerouac9]

I feared Kyler returning and looking like Deshaun Watson on the Browns. And thats exactly what he is. He's not a fit. And he's not a guy who can play well without good talent.

Huge OOF here.

 

[SoonerLou]

haha, well good for Baker. Absolutley loved him at OU. Loved him.

And I think what this demonstrates is that a "broken" QB can resurect their career, if they hang in there.

Do you have a lean for what kind of supporting cast Mayfield has around him in TB? Just between you and I, I think that's key for Murray. To have some WRs besides Zach Paschal to catch passes from.

Im probably overreacting. However, I fear Kyler might follow the Baker route and be on another team in 2 years.

I'd say that because Monti didnt go out of his way to make things any easier for Kyler when he returned. His focus was about 2024/maybe 2025?

If we sign a big time FA AND draft MHJ then I think it'll work out. Im not sure Monti thinks we'll compete next year anyway so he might give a rookie and evaluate for a year. So we'll see.

 

[BirdGangThing]

Kyler isn't physically broken - hella rusty sure but each game back should be knocking some of that rust off

Only consoling thoughts I can come up with it's not just a result of the rustyness - but also the learning something new while being surrounded by intentionally designed incompetence

 

[unseenaz]

With who though? Drake Rosen? I’d probably feel better drafting the toothpick that @SoonerLou is always hyping.

Kyler is best option because there’s not another option that beats the slightly above-average option we have now. Kyler gets one year with MHJ and a likely elite TE. And if he’s not a true star QB by then? Arrivederci!

Tank the next 3 years and compile enough picks to draft Manning.

 

[SoonerLou]

Huge OOF here.

More and more Im starting to believe every QB is a system QB (outside of a select few).

I mean off field issues aside. How does Deshaun Watson just look washed all of sudden?

We know and remember games where Kyler clearly didnt play well but he was influential in moving the offense/not the RBs doing the heavy lifting.

Every action seems like setup for the eventual replacement. Even though I know they tell us they want him back for now and into the future.

 

[kerouac9]

I mean off field issues aside. How does Deshaun Watson just look washed all of sudden?

I think that elite athletes are creatures of habit -- being able to grind day after day after day on tiny adjustments is one of the things that allows them to be elite. Everything I understand about Brady and Peyton Manning is they're dudes just obsessed with football and finding tiny edges to get better.

Watson kind of broke that habit and was away from the game for a year and a half. I don't think you can just lock that back in, even if you're at QB school or whatever.

 

[BritCard]

I think that elite athletes are creatures of habit -- being able to grind day after day after day on tiny adjustments is one of the things that allows them to be elite. Everything I understand about Brady and Peyton Manning is they're dudes just obsessed with football and finding tiny edges to get better.

Watson kind of broke that habit and was away from the game for a year and a half. I don't think you can just lock that back in, even if you're at QB school or whatever.

There is a mental element to it as well. See Tiger Woods. As soon as he hit the headlines in a negative way (like Watson) he was just never the same. It's like it shattered something that he needed to be elite.

 

[forever red]

Kyler Murray would start for the all NFL flag football team . But he is not the answer as an NFL franchise QB. He is horribly inaccurate, won't throw over the middle of the field either because he can't see the receivers or because he knows he can't make the throws. He lacks the courage needed to go for that extra yard when his team needs the yards for the first down. He lacks the intelligence and calmness when in the pocket and when he scrambles rarely finds a receiver down field and when he does can't get the ball to him accurately. He's not a leader of men and not someone anyone follows. Bottom line it is time to move on. If we don't we will continue to wallow in mediocrity

 

[CardsFan88]

As per the republic Repulsive article:


"The Cardinals, unfortunately, have laid one egg after another in pursuit of coaches, systems and young players who can help lead the team.

The draft day differences go way beyond the inevitable comparison of Kyler Murray, No. 1 overall in 2019 and struggling, vs. Brock Purdy, last overall in 2022 and playing like an MVP.

Sunday’s numbers were flat-out embarrassing. And not just the $46 million that Murray makes vs. the $800,000 that Purdy gets.

(That’s funnier if you go per game. Murray gets about $2.7 million per game. For Purdy, it’s about $47,000. … It’s funnier still if you break that down to games Murray has played. If he plays in Arizona’s final three games, he’ll have made about $6.6 million per game.)"

Or you could look at it as from the start of the game to the middle of the 2nd quarter Murray made more than Purdy will make in the whole season.

 

[CardsFan88]

More and more Im starting to believe every QB is a system QB (outside of a select few).

I mean off field issues aside. How does Deshaun Watson just look washed all of sudden?

We know and remember games where Kyler clearly didnt play well but he was influential in moving the offense/not the RBs doing the heavy lifting.

Every action seems like setup for the eventual replacement. Even though I know they tell us they want him back for now and into the future.

Well if this is the case, it's looking like Monti selected an OC that isn't a fit, which also calls into question his judgment.

It was after all one of the biggest competency tests of the offseason. Selecting an OC with a system that can fit with Murray. (unless public words aside, they're going to get a guy one way or another that fits their system)

 

[kerouac9]

I'd rather Kyler Murray have that money than Michael Bidwill. I have no problem with Kyler getting as much as Michael and Keim were willing to give him.

 

[football karma]

More and more Im starting to believe every QB is a system QB (outside of a select few).

this is really close to my theory --

a QBs effectiveness is a function, in large part, of how well the other 10 guys around him are playing.

 

[cardpa]

There are just so many little things that drive me batty with Murray. For instance on one play I believed was a first down play Murray got flushed out and ended up running out of bounds 2 yards behind the LOS instead of throwing the ball away making the second down longer. A good QB tosses the ball OB and leaves his team with a 2nd and 10 instead of a 2nd and 12. Even the announcers mentioned it.

He still seems unable to throw receivers open and needs to have the receiver open to throw the ball to them. The pick six is a perfect example.

 

[kerouac9]

For instance on one play I believed was a first down play Murray got flushed out and ended up running out of bounds 2 yards behind the LOS instead of throwing the ball away making the second down longer

We had to burn another timeout because we couldn’t get set in time

 

[Stout]

There are just so many little things that drive me batty with Murray. For instance on one play I believed was a first down play Murray got flushed out and ended up running out of bounds 2 yards behind the LOS instead of throwing the ball away making the second down longer. A good QB tosses the ball OB and leaves his team with a 2nd and 10 instead of a 2nd and 12. Even the announcers mentioned it.

He still seems unable to throw receivers open and needs to have the receiver open to throw the ball to them. The pick six is a perfect example.

Oh, that play had me wanting to toss a remote through the TV at him. Simply stupid and absolutely no excuse for it. Smart, aware players don't make that play--and routinely at that.

 

[Red Dawn]

Tank the next 3 years and compile enough picks to draft Manning.

No way the Manning family lets him play for the Cards lol

 

[Cheesebeef]

We had to burn another timeout because we couldn’t get set in time

and then he held the ball too long on the next play to take a sack. Those back to back plays, the delay penalty and taking the sack when he had time, killed that drive.

 

[wagon mound 464]

Kyler Murray would start for the all NFL flag football team . But he is not the answer as an NFL franchise QB. He is horribly inaccurate, won't throw over the middle of the field either because he can't see the receivers or because he knows he can't make the throws. He lacks the courage needed to go for that extra yard when his team needs the yards for the first down. He lacks the intelligence and calmness when in the pocket and when he scrambles rarely finds a receiver down field and when he does can't get the ball to him accurately. He's not a leader of men and not someone anyone follows. Bottom line it is time to move on. If we don't we will continue to wallow in mediocrity

Red,,, I fully agree. Too small and will run out-of-bounds instead of picking up another four or five yards going forward. Afraid to take a hit.
I like Josh Allen always going for those extra yards on his runs. Balls, he has.

 

[Chopper0080]

After the game I watched Kyler play vs the 49ers and with this roster, I think Maye can replicate that in year 1.