Kliff comments on Murray

[GuernseyCard]

I'm blocking you.

You are just being a giant douche canoe.

Of course you are, snowflake!

 

[cardncubfan]

Go listen to Zierlein on Doug and Wolf today and MMQB podcast from yesterday.

FACT numerous sources have stated that Josh is not a good leader.

This is in no way a fact. Two talking heads on a radio show trying to drum up ratings does not equal fact. It's pure speculation on your part. Unless you have proof, which you do not.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Right on, I'll take that.

It's purely personal opinion on my part that Rosen's being criticized by a generation who doesn't understand people in his generation, which would be ironic in a world where we just hired a coach to deploy a football concept to defy NFL convention. I think the leadership will come... or will come when we surround him with like-minded talent and coaching.

In Murray I see the worst quality of leader - one who is disengaged. Some think Rosen's entitled because he's smug and came from a well-off upbringing, I see Murray as entitled because he knows he can bail at any time and someone's still going to drool over that athleticism.

At the end of the day, I'm just hoping this is all a smokescreen, but I've pretty much started to resign myself to Murray being the QB. This is going to be one of the first players in a long time though that needs to prove me wrong, and I start out negative about.

See Solar, I think this is the point the Krang is trying to make.

The stuff about Josh's attitude has been out there for a while, and keeps resurfacing. I'm not saying it's factual, but if it keeps coming up over and over, its becomes a legitimate concern. And, with all due respect, it's has more weight than the bolded part above, because we don't hear that from public sources.

Let me just state one more time for the record. Murray was on campus for two years at OU. Never a single word about bad behavior (save once he was late for practice), and never a single word about, or from, his father. Not one Solar.

Murray does not have a big personality, that's true. He's not a say, ?Brett Farve? type of leader. But neither is he an anti-hero, and if he leads by example on a day-to-day basis, that will work okay for me.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

This is in no way a fact. Two talking heads on a radio show trying to drum up ratings does not equal fact. It's pure speculation on your part. Unless you have proof, which you do not.

[emoji817]. Until sources are named, these are just the same as Casserlys rumors about Murray.

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[Krangodnzr]

This is in no way a fact. Two talking heads on a radio show trying to drum up ratings does not equal fact. It's pure speculation on your part. Unless you have proof, which you do not.

LOL Ok. We just been hearing over and over again that Rosen is a douche.

You dont want to believe the dozens of reports on it. The kid just removed all his Cardinals related pictures and when people called him out he said he was hacked.

Prosens = Team Hellen Keller

 

[Krangodnzr]

[emoji817]. Until sources are named, these are just the same as Casserlys rumors about Murray.

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Except....no one is really coming out to say these reports are false.

His own college coach didnt say these reports arent true.

Many people said Casserlys reports were false. Even Gil Brandt did, who has known Murray since he was a kid.

 

[Dr. Jones]

I can almost see the light now.......

Murray will be a Cardinal. Of this I am almost certain.

And I cannot wait for next season to start!!!!

 

[Krangodnzr]

See Solar, I think this is the point the Krang is trying to make.

The stuff about Josh's attitude has been out there for a while, and keeps resurfacing. I'm not saying it's factual, but if it keeps coming up over and over, its becomes a legitimate concern. And, with all due respect, it's has more weight than the bolded part above, because we don't hear that from public sources.

Let me just state one more time for the record. Murray was on campus for two years at OU. Never a single word about bad behavior (save once he was late for practice), and never a single word about, or from, his father. Not one Solar.

Murray does not have a big personality, that's true. He's not a say, ?Brett Farve? type of leader. But neither is he an anti-hero, and if he leads by example on a day-to-day basis, that will work okay for me.

Great post.

When there is smoke, there is fire. Rosen has been bashed over and over with few people coming to his defense. Why is that? Maybe the comments are true.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

Except....no one is really coming out to say these reports are false.

His own college coach didnt say these reports arent true.

Many people said Casserlys reports were false. Even Gil Brandt did, who has known Murray since he was a kid.

Has anyone been asked? I know Larry has, but you've already dismissed that.

The people in Murray's camp were asked. Also, if Brandt is a family friend, wouldn't you expect him to defend Murray, regardless?

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[Krangodnzr]

Has anyone been asked? I know Larry has, but you've already dismissed that.

The people in Murray's camp were asked. Also, if Brandt is a family friend, wouldn't you expect him to defend Murray, regardless?

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Lincoln Riley, his college coach, and local Norman radio personalities. All his teammates have too.

Murray is a quiet, humble kid from all accounts.

 

[cardncubfan]

LOL Ok. We just been hearing over and over again that Rosen is a douche.

You dont want to believe the dozens of reports on it. The kid just removed all his Cardinals related pictures and when people called him out he said he was hacked.

Prosens = Team Hellen Keller

Where are these reports? Why hasn't any of Josh's ex teammates from UCLA come out saying he was an ass? Everything I've read has been just the opposite. You're believing all of the predraft bs from last year. Talk about blind. Seems like you just want to discredit Josh just to pimp KM. We have a very good QB prospect in JR. No need to waste picks on a million to one shot with KM. Odds are KM will fail. You can tell by his interviews his heart isn't in it imo.

 

[Dr. Jones]

I don't care about circumstantial evidence towards attitude. Yes or no...... We will never know for sure.

He had the most dominating season in college football last year, with historically high numbers in almost every normal and advanced category.

Not thinking he is the #1 QB or even #1 player at this point based on positional importance, and overall dominance is laughable IMO.

I'm done trying to convince people. The camps are formed..... now we just need to see what plays out.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Where are these reports? Why hasn't any of Josh's ex teammates from UCLA come out saying he was an ass? Everything I've read has been just the opposite. You're believing all of the predraft bs from last year. Talk about blind. Seems like you just want to discredit Josh just to pimp KM. We have a very good QB prospect in JR. No need to waste picks on a million to one shot with KM. Odds are KM will fail. You can tell by his interviews his heart isn't in it imo.

Believe what you will.

Josh Rosen is soooooo committed that he removed all his Cardinals pictures a few weeks ago.

There is a reason the Cardinals are universally linked to Murray even though they have Rosen. Why do YOU think they are?

 

[Solar7]

But no one who KNOWS Murray is saying this.

Uniformly, everyone says hes quiet and a nice kid.

Gil Brandt says hes an amazing kid. Teammates. Coaches. Everyone. You as a person who has never spoken to him thinks "he is entitled". Have you ever heard any or even whispers, that he is this way? No you havent.

Cleveland flat out passed on Rosen because of character.

I'm not saying Murray is a fundamentally bad teammate or person. What I'm saying is that it's really really easy to not show any negativity when your team is winning. It's from what I see in his awful interviews, him kicking the can down the road for weeks on the decision to even play the game, and a baseball career right in his grasp. How's he going to handle adversity when the team is six losses in, all hopes of the playoffs are pretty much lost, and it's all on his back because he's "the guy?" I've seen nothing to show me that he's going to stand up, take ownership, and move forward. He quit on A&M, he quit on the A's, that's enough for me.

Also, if you want whispers, Casserly heard he was a terrible interview at the Combine. I haven't kept up with every single nugget, so I'm sure there's a few more out there.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

Lincoln Riley, his college coach, and local Norman radio personalities. All his teammates have too.

Murray is a quiet, humble kid from all accounts.

My question, though, was who has been asked about Rosen? Larry, we know was asked.

Regarding Murray, his defenders were all asked about him when Casserly made his comments.

Maybe more of Rosens teammates and coaches simply need to be asked about him. I bet you'd find he has many supporters. Other than Larry, we also know Kirk loves him...he even shared stories of them recruiting each other for college.

So, again, until these accusers go on the record, they are just rumors to be dismissed.

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[Solar7]

See Solar, I think this is the point the Krang is trying to make.

The stuff about Josh's attitude has been out there for a while, and keeps resurfacing. I'm not saying it's factual, but if it keeps coming up over and over, its becomes a legitimate concern. And, with all due respect, it's has more weight than the bolded part above, because we don't hear that from public sources.

Let me just state one more time for the record. Murray was on campus for two years at OU. Never a single word about bad behavior (save once he was late for practice), and never a single word about, or from, his father. Not one Solar.

Murray does not have a big personality, that's true. He's not a say, ?Brett Farve? type of leader. But neither is he an anti-hero, and if he leads by example on a day-to-day basis, that will work okay for me.

See my last post. It pretty much covers this. It doesn't have to be "bad" behavior. He doesn't have to assault someone or do drugs to have the wrong character for the game. He's going to have to face media scrutiny and be prepared to navigate it. Every QB does. Even your boy Russel Wilson.

 

[Krangodnzr]

So, again, until these accusers go on the record, they are just rumors to be dismissed.

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This is where I differ. Why dismiss persistent talk that he is not a good teammate.

Fitzgerald talked up Mike Floyd! Mike Floyd! Larry is awesome but he seems to be the type of person who says nice things about everyone.

 

[Krangodnzr]

See my last post. It pretty much covers this. It doesn't have to be "bad" behavior. He doesn't have to assault someone or do drugs to have the wrong character for the game. He's going to have to face media scrutiny and be prepared to navigate it. Every QB does. Even your boy Russel Wilson.

But there is no evidence except for your perception of him.

Introverts can come off as ***** sometimes because they arent warm, friendly people. Murray by all accounts is a nice kid. Doesnt party.

 

[Solar7]

But there is no evidence except for your perception of him.

Introverts can come off as ***** sometimes because they arent warm, friendly people. Murray by all accounts is a nice kid. Doesnt party.

Man, again, I don't think you're reading my posts. I'm not saying that I think he's a dick. I think he is unprepared for any adversity and will turn tail whenever it suits him. You say I have no evidence, but I literally pointed out two organizations in sports he has up and moved on from. The kid refused to put on a showing at the combine, did a watered down throwing workout in his own comfort zone, and here we are.

I know you're just gonna handwave again and say "well that's just Kyler doing what's best for Kyler," but that doesn't matter to me. I need the Cardinals to do best for the Cardinals.

This guy has tantalizing on the field play, but there are a tremendous amount of warts you and the rest of the Murray backers are just completely refusing to acknowledge. They're just "eh, not a problem!"

 

[BigRedRage]

Yeah ok bud. Ignore all of the comments about Rosen being a douche going back a long time.

And today two separate media sources say they heard Cardinals employees say that Josh isnt a good guy in the locker room. That's not grasping at straws, that's listening to informed opinions.

so emotional

He never came off as a douche to me.

 

[RON_IN_OC]

Except....no one is really coming out to say these reports are false.

His own college coach didnt say these reports arent true.

Many people said Casserlys reports were false. Even Gil Brandt did, who has known Murray since he was a kid.

Look at all of this Rosen hate from his College Coach...hahahahahaha If you are going to take what Murray's HC says about him as Gospel, well, here you go.



https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...-josh-rosen-nfl-draft-misconstrued/481469002/


Former UCLA coach Jim Mora said Monday that he believes his comments about quarterback Josh Rosen and the NFL draft have been misconstrued.

Mora has drawn headlines over the past week for saying that he believes USC product Sam Darnold would be a better fit for the Cleveland Browns with the No. 1 overall pick than Rosen, who played for Mora at UCLA. Mora then told Sports Illustrated on Sunday that Rosen is a millennial who "needs to be challenged intellectually so he doesn’t get bored," while also calling him "without a doubt ... the number-one quarterback in the draft."

On Monday afternoon, the former Atlanta Falcons and Seattle Seahawks head coach further clarified his comments on NFL Network and heaped more praise on Rosen.

"Listen, I have been very clear, very consistent and, I believe, very complimentary toward Josh Rosen. I don't think I've made a statement in the negative about him," Mora said on the network's "Up To The Minute" program. "This is a tremendous young man who is a great player. He is dedicated to the game. I've tried to be very clear about how I feel. It's interesting that a statement that one player may be a better fit for one team than another can be construed as negative."

Mora said on NFL Network that he exchanged text messages with Rosen over the weekend about his comments and understands that they have forced the quarterback to "answer questions that maybe he shouldn't have had to answer." Mora added that Rosen has "a great sense of humor" when asked about a tweet Rosen sent Monday, apparently referencing Mora's comments to Sports Illustrated.




Still not convinced? Here are more comments from his teammates:

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You can find more for yourself, here: https://www.dailynews.com/2018/04/2...osen-and-kolton-millers-nfl-draft-selections/


Here are the comments from Kirk, I mentioned earlier: https://www.sports360az.com/2018/04/cardinals-kirk-rosens-relationship-goes-back-to-high-school/

“We were real close during recruiting,” Kirk said. “We were both talking about going to UCLA together early off in our recruitment process. We actually took our official visits to UCLA together and spent a lot of time at the Opening and things like that. He was always a good friend of mine. We stayed in touch throughout college.”

Kirk had nothing but high praise for the Cardinals newest quarterback.

“He’s an awesome player,” Kirk said. “In my opinion, he’s the best quarterback in this draft. Being able to have him here and knowing that we’re going to be able to build a relationship, and obviously score a lot of touchdowns, and catch a lot of passes from him, I’m just excited for him and excited to have him.”



So, until these rumors of people not liking him go on the record, the above is what we have to go on. Truth is, you can find positives and negatives on EVERYBODY!!!!

 

[Krangodnzr]

Look at all of this Rosen hate from his College Coach...hahahahahaha If you are going to take what Murray's HC says about him as Gospel, well, here you go.



https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...-josh-rosen-nfl-draft-misconstrued/481469002/


Former UCLA coach Jim Mora said Monday that he believes his comments about quarterback Josh Rosen and the NFL draft have been misconstrued.

Mora has drawn headlines over the past week for saying that he believes USC product Sam Darnold would be a better fit for the Cleveland Browns with the No. 1 overall pick than Rosen, who played for Mora at UCLA. Mora then told Sports Illustrated on Sunday that Rosen is a millennial who "needs to be challenged intellectually so he doesn’t get bored," while also calling him "without a doubt ... the number-one quarterback in the draft."

On Monday afternoon, the former Atlanta Falcons and Seattle Seahawks head coach further clarified his comments on NFL Network and heaped more praise on Rosen.

"Listen, I have been very clear, very consistent and, I believe, very complimentary toward Josh Rosen. I don't think I've made a statement in the negative about him," Mora said on the network's "Up To The Minute" program. "This is a tremendous young man who is a great player. He is dedicated to the game. I've tried to be very clear about how I feel. It's interesting that a statement that one player may be a better fit for one team than another can be construed as negative."

Mora said on NFL Network that he exchanged text messages with Rosen over the weekend about his comments and understands that they have forced the quarterback to "answer questions that maybe he shouldn't have had to answer." Mora added that Rosen has "a great sense of humor" when asked about a tweet Rosen sent Monday, apparently referencing Mora's comments to Sports Illustrated.

Right....he said all of this AFTER people started criticizing him for not standing up for his guy when given the chance.

Still not convinced? Here are more comments from his teammates:

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You can find more for yourself, here: https://www.dailynews.com/2018/04/2...osen-and-kolton-millers-nfl-draft-selections/


Here are the comments from Kirk, I mentioned earlier: https://www.sports360az.com/2018/04/cardinals-kirk-rosens-relationship-goes-back-to-high-school/

“We were real close during recruiting,” Kirk said. “We were both talking about going to UCLA together early off in our recruitment process. We actually took our official visits to UCLA together and spent a lot of time at the Opening and things like that. He was always a good friend of mine. We stayed in touch throughout college.”

Kirk had nothing but high praise for the Cardinals newest quarterback.

“He’s an awesome player,” Kirk said. “In my opinion, he’s the best quarterback in this draft. Being able to have him here and knowing that we’re going to be able to build a relationship, and obviously score a lot of touchdowns, and catch a lot of passes from him, I’m just excited for him and excited to have him.”



So, until these rumors of people not liking him go on the record, the above is what we have to go on. Truth is, you can find positives and negatives on EVERYBODY!!!!

It's nice that people congratulated him. I would expect as much. I guess we have to agree to disagree on this because the rumors are still out there and from my experience in life, when there are persistent rumors, there is something to those rumors.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Man, again, I don't think you're reading my posts. I'm not saying that I think he's a dick. I think he is unprepared for any adversity and will turn tail whenever it suits him. You say I have no evidence, but I literally pointed out two organizations in sports he has up and moved on from.

QB transfers are VERY common in college football. Murray was made the starter, they changed back to Kyle Allen, and went back to Murray. According to the third QB, Sumlin kept making changes WITHOUT talking to either QB directly. At the end of the year, Murray was going to be the starter and Kyle Allen was going to transfer but at that point in time, Murray had been jerked around so much that he decided to transfer even though he was losing a year of eligibility. This account was given by the third QB who characterized it as being a situation where the coaching staff wasn't communicating with the players. Kids are now taking things into their own hands and managing their own careers. Your characterization of "quitting" on the team shows a poor understanding of the situation.

As for the A's, up until the end of the season, he didn't think the NFL was an option. You can spin it how you like, but Murray was guaranteed a roster spot on the A's roster and he still stuck with his #1 love, football. That's not quitting on a team, two sports stars have to make this decision all of the time.

The kid refused to put on a showing at the combine, did a watered down throwing workout in his own comfort zone, and here we are.

Sure, not participating in the combine is a bad look, but I expect to see this more and more from top prospects. What the Murray camp is basically saying is that he is a QB, not a WR, not a RB. That's why he didn't do any of the athletic testing.

As far as the reviews I heard about his Pro Day, what some scouts saw, was a guy who has absolutely amazing fundamentals. Murray is so good at resetting his feet and he throws with his entire body (lower body and arm) and does so consistently.

I know you're just gonna handwave again and say "well that's just Kyler doing what's best for Kyler," but that doesn't matter to me. I need the Cardinals to do best for the Cardinals.

This guy has tantalizing on the field play, but there are a tremendous amount of warts you and the rest of the Murray backers are just completely refusing to acknowledge. They're just "eh, not a problem!"

Tremendous warts? I don't see tremendous warts. I see a few issues (height, weight, lack of adversity) and the rest is being made a big deal of by people who can't get past his size so they are making a big deal over small things.

Even then, Kyler Murray has been 5'9-5'10ish his entire career and it hasn't stopped him from being GREAT at every level he has played at. What I see is a totally unique player who is good at all things you ask a QB to do. I was Anti-Murray until I broke down every element of the argument against him and I saw it for what it is, the fear of taking a risk and the fear of the unknown.

Why I'm more confident that Murray will work out? His fundamentals at the QB position are outstanding. He has a very good arm and throws with accuracy and leads his receivers on throws, hitting them in stride. He has been a winner at every level and a high achiever at every level. He is a world class athlete, which is displayed on film. Watch him running against Alabama, and you see that he outclasses the elite athletes at Alabama.

I get it, he's short, but we have three modern examples of QBs (Wilson, Brees, and Mayfield) who are short and have succeeded. From what QBs have said, QBs rarely see over the line and throw it that way, the majority of the time QBs are seeing lanes between linemen.

 

[juza76]

About Murray:

An advanced stats dive in the Sports Info Solutions Rookie Handbook has Murray rated the highest in six different categories at the position. That includes things like on-target percentage (basically the percent of catchable throws), pass yards per attempt, and plain old passer rating. Pro Football Focus rates Murray the best at completion percent against pressure and second in total adjusted completion percentage. If your eyes don’t tell you Murray is a legit quarterback, the numbers do

 

[cardncubfan]

Believe what you will.

Josh Rosen is soooooo committed that he removed all his Cardinals pictures a few weeks ago.

There is a reason the Cardinals are universally linked to Murray even though they have Rosen. Why do YOU think they are?

A reporter found a clip from a college game where KK was talking up his opponent & made a story out of it. From there it blew up giving all of the talking heads something to discuss predraft. The Cards used this to their advantage to drive up the trade value of the #1 pick to a QB needy team. Keim knew what he was doing when he answered the Josh is our QB right now. He wouldn't have said the ''right now'' part if he was going to ditch JR for KM. It was a comment with purpose.