Knicks & Suns Trade Q for KT

[green machine]

For me, trading Q comes down to this:

When JJ got hurt in the playoffs, that was Q's chance to step up. Not only did he fail to do so, but he got worse.

Granted, it's his first playoff experience. But he didn't have to be a main option at all, and he virutally disappeared.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I'd take it. If we sent a pick, I doubt it's this year's #21.

it would flat out SHOCK me if it was this year's #21 and i'd be against it. if it was just a later year's pick (which is gonna be real low for a while) i'm okay with the trade. if we get their pick it's gravy.

 

[Mainstreet]

IMO, sending Q for Kurt Thomas alone would not be a fair trade for the Suns. To make it even palatable NY would have to send a #1 with him. If Kurt were more than a journeyman big man I could understand. Also look at the age differences. I'm sure Q has more trade value than KT.

 

[SweetD]

This all could be a ploy as well to get Denver to bite on a trade for Nene.

 

[Yuma]

IMO, sending Q for Kurt Thomas alone would not be a fair trade for the Suns. To make it even palatable NY would have to send a #1 with him. If Kurt were more than a journeyman big man I could understand. Also look at the age differences. I'm sure Q has more trade value than KT.

I agree. I am nervous about all the chatter we are sending the pick.

 

[Mainstreet]

This all could be a ploy as well to get Denver to bite on a trade for Nene.

Now this trade I would do.

However, the earlier alleged quotes from Q make it sound like a done deal.

 

[Yuma]

This all could be a ploy as well to get Denver to bite on a trade for Nene.

Hey, our second pick and Jake V. for Nene! Seriously, I don't think you can make an NBA veteran like Kiki Vandewiegh fall for that. He's smarter than Isiah, imho.

 

[SweetD]

Now this trade I would do.

However, the earlier alleged quotes from Q make it sound like a done deal.

Q hasn't said were he is going, just the Suns were looking into trading him.

 

[Mainstreet]

Hey, our second pick and Jake V. for Nene! Seriously, I don't think you can make an NBA veteran like Kiki Vandewiegh fall for that. He's smarter than Isiah, imho.

How about our #1, Voshkuhl and Q for Nene. I don't know if the salaries work but I would be tempted.

 

[Yuma]

Q hasn't said were he is going, just the Suns were looking into trading him.

Richardson said Colangelo told him that the deal was made to help make financial space with the contract extension of Amaré Stoudemire and re-signing of Joe Johnson forthcoming this summer.

That sure sounds like a "specific" trade to me. The article was about NY. So I would assume it was the Thomas trade!

 

[Mainstreet]

Q hasn't said were he is going, just the Suns were looking into trading him.

You mean I could have wasted my whole day for nothing but rumors.

 

[Yuma]

Picture this, we are playing San Antonio next year in the WCF. Who do you want guarding Nazr Muhommed down low and fighting for boards: Kurt Thomas or Nene? I think I want Kurt hammering away in the trenches instead of Nene.

 

[Yuma]

You mean I could have wasted my whole day for nothing but rumors.

At least we know from the quote above "Richardson said Colangelo told him that the deal was made to help make financial space with the contract extension of Amaré Stoudemire and re-signing of Joe Johnson forthcoming this summer." So some kind of deal was made. Maybe a Ball Park frank? "Hey, Q is buying a ball park!"

 

[Cheesebeef]

as long as it's not this year's first pick that we'd be sending, I couldn't give a rat's ass. Kurt Thomas is a great piece to add to the puzzle and Q's 3 point shooting can be replaced easily.

Once again - all those who continually overrate our players - Q and Voskhul and the pick ain't gonna get Nene - too much upside on a big man.

 

[Chaplin]

as long as it's not this year's first pick that we'd be sending, I couldn't give a rat's ass. Kurt Thomas is a great piece to add to the puzzle and Q's 3 point shooting can be replaced easily.

Once again - all those who continually overrate our players - Q and Voskhul and the pick ain't gonna get Nene - too much upside on a big man.

Disagree there--Nene's upside is almost all used up. He'll be nothing more than servicable in the future. He's in a system where he should be flourishing, but isn't. You can only blame the high altitude for so long...

 

[elindholm]

Disagree there--Nene's upside is almost all used up.

I agree. I'm mystified that anyone thinks Nene would help this team more than Kurt Thomas right now. Five years down the road is a different story, but the Suns' timeframe is shorter than that.

 

[Mainstreet]

Picture this, we are playing San Antonio next year in the WCF. Who do you want guarding Nazr Muhommed down low and fighting for boards: Kurt Thomas or Nene? I think I want Kurt hammering away in the trenches instead of Nene.

I think I would take a Nene (with another year under his belt) or some other big man.

Anyway, we'll all probably know later tonight or tomorrow.

I'm going to sign off after throwing my 2 cents into the mix (which is not worth too much I'm sure) and try to trust the Suns management and new ownership.

Go Suns.

 

[coloradosun]

We could have had the exact same player if Diagu fell to us. Kurt Thomas is only 6'9!!!!! Why did we mess with the team. This reminds me of what Dallas would do every year and kill there chemistry.

I think you are trying to equate chemistry with contentment. I can name three players that are going to be happier. Amare, won't have to spend as much time guarding centers, Marion, won't have to spend as much time guarding PFs' and JJ1, who now will be seen as the 3pt specialist.

I am begining to visualize Kurt Thomas as what Antionio McDyess provided Amare with at the end of 2004. That team was beginning to have success and what ever D'A had drawn up for that lineup now can be used with KT. If Thomas is as good as jumpshot as Dice this could be a good move, I just don't remember him being that consistent with the 15 foot range.

 

[KloD]

I saw this on a Knicks fan site: "You notice Phoenix always dumps their bad contracts on us?"



Knicks fans

 

[Cheesebeef]

Disagree there--Nene's upside is almost all used up.

I agree. I'm mystified that anyone thinks Nene would help this team more than Kurt Thomas right now. Five years down the road is a different story, but the Suns' timeframe is shorter than that.

That's not what I'm saying - I'd much rather have Thomas than Nene right now - but big man run on their potential for YEARS - Nene's only going into his 4th year and people are so hungry for bigs that they'll continue waiting on potential even when it seems irrational. I mean look at the deals Calvin Booth, Darius Miles, Adonal Foyle and likely Steven Hunter got or will get. No one wants to be Portland and give up a Jermaine O'Neal.

His "uspide" might almost be used up - but I bet it's still more salivating to most teams (right or wrong) than Kurt Thomas.

 

[Joe Mama]

Or, the Suns are dumb enough to give it. Think about the picks the Suns gave to Utah. It seems sometimes, the Suns use draft picks like toilet paper (please excuse the expression).

Obviously I would like the deal better if it was the Phoenix Suns receiving a draft pick, but regardless I still think this is a good trade for Phoenix. It doesn't hurt their offense at all. It might even help because Q only shot 39% from the field and averages 40.6% for his career whereas Thomas shot 47% last year and 48.4% for his career.

I keep listening to Gambo talk about how this is going to make it harder for Amare Stoudemire to score in the paint. Obviously despite his New York ties he hasn't spent enough time watching Kurt Thomas. teams would gamble with Q. That's why he ended up with a lot of open shots. If he made several of them opposing teams would stop leaving him so much, but for every big game Q had this season there were one or two where he shot 30% or worse. If teams leave Kurt Thomas he will hurt them with a consistent midrange jump shot.

The Utah Jazz had the Phoenix Suns by the balls in that Tom Gugliotta trade. They knew that the Suns had to dump Googs to get under the luxury tax. They reamed the Suns in that deal, but it was a deal phoenix had to make, and I really don't think they had any other options.

I'm with cheese on this one. The draft pick was just icing on the cake. I think even if the Suns do have to give up a highly protected draft pick its a good deal for them.

Joe

 

[Yuma]

Obviously I would like the deal better if it was the Phoenix Suns receiving a draft pick, but regardless I still think this is a good trade for Phoenix. It doesn't hurt their offense at all. It might even help because Q only shot 39% from the field and averages 40.6% for his career whereas Thomas shot 47% last year and 48.4% for his career.

I keep listening to Gambo talk about how this is going to make it harder for Amare Stoudemire to score in the paint. Obviously despite his New York ties he hasn't spent enough time watching Kurt Thomas. teams would gamble with Q. That's why he ended up with a lot of open shots. If he made several of them opposing teams would stop leaving him so much, but for every big game Q had this season there were one or two where he shot 30% or worse. If teams leave Kurt Thomas he will hurt them with a consistent midrange jump shot.

The Utah Jazz had the Phoenix Suns by the balls in that Tom Gugliotta trade. They knew that the Suns had to dump Googs to get under the luxury tax. They reamed the Suns in that deal, but it was a deal phoenix had to make, and I really don't think they had any other options.

I'm with cheese on this one. The draft pick was just icing on the cake. I think even if the Suns do have to give up a highly protected draft pick its a good deal for them.

Joe

What the average fan didn't realize in that Utah trade was there was no way we could have used all those first round picks with the guaranteed contracts. Heck we were trying like the dickens to avoid the luxury tax! It helped us to dump those picks. It isn't exactly like Utah took over the league with those picks, either!

 

[devilalum]

Obviously I would like the deal better if it was the Phoenix Suns receiving a draft pick, but regardless I still think this is a good trade for Phoenix. It doesn't hurt their offense at all. It might even help because Q only shot 39% from the field and averages 40.6% for his career whereas Thomas shot 47% last year and 48.4% for his career.

I keep listening to Gambo talk about how this is going to make it harder for Amare Stoudemire to score in the paint. Obviously despite his New York ties he hasn't spent enough time watching Kurt Thomas. teams would gamble with Q. That's why he ended up with a lot of open shots. If he made several of them opposing teams would stop leaving him so much, but for every big game Q had this season there were one or two where he shot 30% or worse. If teams leave Kurt Thomas he will hurt them with a consistent midrange jump shot.

The Utah Jazz had the Phoenix Suns by the balls in that Tom Gugliotta trade. They knew that the Suns had to dump Googs to get under the luxury tax. They reamed the Suns in that deal, but it was a deal phoenix had to make, and I really don't think they had any other options.

I'm with cheese on this one. The draft pick was just icing on the cake. I think even if the Suns do have to give up a highly protected draft pick its a good deal for them.

Joe

If you're going to compare these 2 players shooting percentage you need to factor in 3 point field goals.

33% from the 3 point line is the same as 50% from the 2 point line.
Q's adjusted shooting percentage was 50% for the year.

Thomas made only 2 of 4 3 point attempts all year so his shooting percentage for the year is still 48%.

This is why the Suns centered their offense aroung the 3 ball.

I don't know if this is a great move or not but the shooting percentage comparison is not a good one.

 

[elindholm]

Richardson's points-per-shot is probably slightly higher. (Anyone have the exact number?)

However, I think that Thomas will be a threat if left unguarded from 15 feet. First of all, he's a better free-throw shooter than Richardson, and that's often a pretty good indicator of how reliable someone's mid-range game is. Secondly, his overall FG% is pretty high, and evidently he doesn't go to the basket much, since he never shoots free throws. Someone already posted that close to 90% of his shot attempts were jumpers and that he made an unusually high percentage of them for a big man.

Also, the point about having a defensive rebounder to ignite the running game, made by one or two people in this thread, is an excellent one.

 

[B-Dogg]

Suns would also get conditional pickBy Chad Ford
ESPN Insider


The Phoenix Suns and New York Knicks are in serious talks about a trade that would send Quentin Richardson and a conditional future first-round pick to the Knicks for Kurt Thomas two league sources said.

However, both sources claim that the trade hasn't been completed.

The trade, if it is consummated, would be a good one for both teams. Thomas can provide the Suns more toughness in the paint. He also can play center, allowing the Suns to move Amare Stoudemire back to his natural position at the four. The deal would also clear some cap space, long term, for the Suns, who must re-sign Joe Johnson this summer.

The Knicks have a log jam at the four and have been trying to move Thomas for a month. Richardson will be a good fit in the Knicks offense. He'd give Stephon Marbury a good shooter to kick it to on penetration. He'd also give the Knicks a swing man who can post up and rebound.

This is confusing the espn article title states the suns get a conditional pick and the article says the Knicks get it...