Kyler Murray Debate Thread

[MrYeahBut]

I love this, 100 pages in this thread!

 

[Russ Smith]

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So on a laptop that's pretty small. is that the rate of misses meaning bad throws, or misses in guys were open and didn't get the ball?

 

[kerouac9]

So on a laptop that's pretty small. is that the rate of misses meaning bad throws, or misses in guys were open and didn't get the ball?

It says misses are uncatchable passes when the target is open. I wonder how large the relative sample sizes are here.

 

[Russ Smith]

It says misses are uncatchable passes when the target is open. I wonder how large the relative sample sizes are here.

Thanks. The Richardson one makes much more sense now.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

You’re arguing with something Stout never even said.

Bidwill being awful has nothing to do with Kyler being a bad QB. We all know Kyler being a bad QB is his own fault. It’s no “Kyler defense”.

Kyler being bad on his own does not mean Bidwill is not a bad owner when history has shown for many, many years that he is.

Man I know this has to be difficult for you type.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Very easy, actually.

Probably was difficult for you to understand my man.

Yeesh I was being sympathetic to your having been let down by kyler. But whatever.

 

[DVontel]

Yeesh I was being sympathetic to your having been let down by kyler. But whatever.

I’m sorry.

I thought you were being a smart-ass. Really, I apologize.

 

[BirdGangThing]

if we told kyler he'd be starting behind tune next year would he demand to be released or would he stay and collect that pay?

idk but the answer to this question would tell us even more about kyler murray

 

[slanidrac16]

I’m sorry.

I thought you were being a smart-ass. Really, I apologize.

Hmm.. I remember you saying something about comprehension….

 

[AZCB34]

if we told kyler he'd be starting behind tune next year would he demand to be released or would he stay and collect that pay?

idk but the answer to this question would tell us even more about kyler murray

Would you be surprised if he asked to be traded this offseason without Tune even being mentioned? I’m not saying it will happen but I wouldn’t be shocked

 

[602 Native]

So on a laptop that's pretty small. is that the rate of misses meaning bad throws, or misses in guys were open and didn't get the ball?

It shows misses where the WR was open and the amount of yards overthrown when missed.

Basically our WR are not open and when they are open very few overthrown balls for K1.

The other side to that coin is we don't throw long passes as well.

Either way our passing offense is abysmal.

 

[kerouac9]

Basically our WR are not open and when they are open very few overthrown balls for K1.

That's not what the chart says at all.

 

[602 Native]

That's not what the chart says at all.

You must be registered for see images attach

You should probably read the chart again.

 

[kerouac9]

You must be registered for see images attach

You should probably read the chart again.

Your conclusions are wrong

 

[DVontel]

Hmm.. I remember you saying something about comprehension….

When I know im wrong, I own up to it at least & apologize.

You need to learn from that.

 

[slanidrac16]

When I know im wrong, I own up to it at least & apologize.

You need to learn from that.

I don’t need to do ****.

 

[Devilmaycare]

I don’t need to do ****.

You need to watch the language.

 

[BritCard]

Your conclusions are wrong

Yeah the graph is how often Kyler misses an open receiver WHEN TARGETED.

Considering how many of Kyler's attempts are under 7 yards it's not surprising he's not missing them. It also doesn't account for yards missed on open receivers that are not targeted.

 

[slanidrac16]

You need to watch the language.

Got it

 

[Solar7]

Yeah the graph is how often Kyler misses an open receiver WHEN TARGETED.

Considering how many of Kyler's attempts are under 7 yards it's not surprising he's not missing them. It also doesn't account for yards missed on open receivers that are not targeted.

Glad someone said it.

I check in on the Cardinals subreddit from time to time and the amount of people arguing that Kyler's QBR is great, or pointing out stats like this are clearly not watching the games or are being willfully ignorant. Colt McCoy could also throw low percentage throws that don't result in first downs, or fall down any time a player is within 5 yards of them. It doesn't equate to actually playing well at QB.

 

[kerouac9]

Glad someone said it.

I check in on the Cardinals subreddit from time to time and the amount of people arguing that Kyler's QBR is great, or pointing out stats like this are clearly not watching the games or are being willfully ignorant. Colt McCoy could also throw low percentage throws that don't result in first downs, or fall down any time a player is within 5 yards of them. It doesn't equate to actually playing well at QB.

Kyler and Colt throw high-percentage passes short of the sticks. I mentioned this earlier in the season and got shouted down.

But I don’t think that chart illustrates that, either. I think it’s supposed to show how many yards a QB is leaving on the field by errant passes. You hope your QB strikes a balance between completing a lot of passes and being aggressive looking for big plays.

Kyler right now is What if Alex Smith Ran Five Times Per Game and it’s awful. Keim attempted to account for this by adding a bunch of YAC guys but it didn’t work. They couldn’t stay healthy and Kyler couldn’t consistently put the ball in a place where they could catch and run.

 

[602 Native]

Your conclusions are wrong

What is wrong? Our wrs are rarely open and our passing offense is abysmal. We also don’t go down field a lot. None of those things can be disproven.

 

[Solar7]

What is wrong? Our wrs are rarely open and our passing offense is abysmal. We also don’t go down field a lot. None of those things can be disproven.

Or Kyler actively admits he saw guys open and didn't go to them, like McBride last week.

 

[602 Native]

Or Kyler actively admits he saw guys open and didn't go to them, like McBride last week.

Yay for pointing out missing a receiver. None of that changes the above or the chart.

 

[kerouac9]

What is wrong? Our wrs are rarely open and our passing offense is abysmal. We also don’t go down field a lot. None of those things can be disproven.

I agree with your assertions above, but the data set you posted doesn’t do much to support this particular thesis.

You’re seeing a lot of equally or more plausible interpretations with Kyler’s unwillingness to make deep passes that the chart also supports, because the chart doesn’t say what you want it to.