Leinart Contract/Negotiations Discussion

[Sandan]

Yes, Rolle, Dockett and Dansby all missed a few days.

My point is that Wendal "The Bust' Bryant was prior to the current front office setup and that is the difference.

Since MB and RG have been in control we haven't seen extended holdouts.

 

[40yearfan]

The organization is better at these types of things than they were five years ago, but that's not saying mcuh and unlike some people I'm not going to applaud them for being par for the course.

And I'm sure no one in the organization will loose any sleep because of your lack of applause.

 

[arthurracoon]

Ash is saying that from reading Green's body language (on his interview), he was confidant that leinart would be signed soon

 

[O]

If I remember correctly Antrell held out eleven days last year.
The boards got pretty ugly, even calling out his mother.

 

[kerouac9]

Since MB and RG have been in control we haven't seen extended holdouts.

Nidan, you and I both remember that the holdout for Antrel was longer than expected, and became somewhat acrimonious. That was on your boy's watch, and for a player that we depended on contributing. Condon has now been on record complaining about how especially difficult it has been dealing with the Cardinal management when it comes to this contract.

Condon's other client, Jay Cutler, missed breakfast at his camp.

By the way, the Cardinals' salary cap wasn't bloated because of bad rookie contracts. It was bloated because of Jake Plummer's ridiculous contract. Funny how after he and David Boston left, the Cards' salary cap was uber-healthy (having to extend contracts to get to the league minimum payroll). Think how the Cards' salary situation would be now if Rod Graves hadn't stupidly extended players that are now off the team (L.J. Shelton, Raynoch Thompson), buried on the depth chart (Fred Wakefield, Marcel Shipp), or dead weight on the roster (James Hodgins).

You can say that Graves has been adequate in the performance of his limited duties, but the real turnaround for this franchise was when Green came on board, not Rod Graves.

 

[D-Dogg]

If I remember correctly Antrell held out eleven days last year.
The boards got pretty ugly, even calling out his mother.

Yeah, some people tend to look for reasons to jump off of buildings, even when there are none.

 

[kerouac9]

Leinart is taking a bit of a beating on ESPN.com's Page 2 Daily Quickie;


• Rumored to be involved with Paris Hilton. (Have to say: At this point, Leinart looks like a bigger skank. At least Paris doesn't hold out.)

Man, the Quickie is well behind on his news than. Matt Pinfield of VH1 was reporting last weekend that Paris had taken a 12-month vow of chastity. Don't believe me? Click here.

 

[Sandan]

K9 you are shooting wide of the mark here, I wasn't pimping RG

I was pointing out the exagerations in their arguments that the Cardinals can't sign draft picks and have a history of that problem. Then using this exageration to suggest the sky is falling.

My point was that until MB & RG took over we had a lot of problems in selecting picks, signing them and eventualy keeping them for a second contract.

We have not had any significant problems in these since RG & MB took over. That includes the selecting phase, which has vastly improved since DG arrived, DG was selected by RG & MB.

The point isn't that RG is doing a wonderful job. The point to the post is that using historical references as to what happened prior to RG & MB taking over are irrelevant to what is happening today, as are references to what happened when BB jnr was in charge. So I could care less what happened with Jake, or David 'Nipple Ring" Boston.

As for some of the others why do you think they brought in DG, geeze. but again that wasn't my point, this is not about RG

 

[BACH]

By the way, the Cardinals' salary cap wasn't bloated because of bad rookie contracts. It was bloated because of Jake Plummer's ridiculous contract. Funny how after he and David Boston left, the Cards' salary cap was uber-healthy (having to extend contracts to get to the league minimum payroll). Think how the Cards' salary situation would be now if Rod Graves hadn't stupidly extended players that are now off the team (L.J. Shelton, Raynoch Thompson), buried on the depth chart (Fred Wakefield, Marcel Shipp), or dead weight on the roster (James Hodgins).

Not true!

Raynoch and LJ were the two exact guys that got extented to reach minimum wage. Both contracts were made with very little signing bonuses, because the "signing bonuses" were paid with an extreme base salary in year one. Because of that both player could be cut with basicly no impact to the cap.

Wakefield's salary is very close to minimum wage BTW, so his salary doen't have much affect on the cap either.

You might have a point about Shipp and Hodgins, but IMO it's hard to blame Graves for Shipp's injuries or Hodgins not fitting the coaching philosophy of the new coach.

 

[kerouac9]

Because how they manage the cap is ameasure of future success.

In past years we have been real bad, that has turned around these last couple of years.

So, you're saying that this isn't a tacit defense of Rod Graves, the person who's job has basically become negotiating contracts and managing the salary cap? Really?

And we're not talking about Joe Banner-cap management here, nidan. We're talking about a guy in Rod Graves who basically took over a roster at the bare minimum, signed a bunch of bad players, fired a coach, and drafted one good player, and then has extended all of one contract. Graves will really earn his money (if he's still around) in four years, when Fitz, Rolle, Anquan, etc. are all coming up for their extentions.

The heat is expressly on Rod Graves right now, nidan. And he has yet to get a first round pick into camp on time during his tenure. Even Bill Sr. managed to get guys like Boston and Thomas Jones into camp on time once in a while. Graves is 0-4 now.

 

[abomb]

Man, the Quickie is well behind on his news than. Matt Pinfield of VH1 was reporting last weekend that Paris had taken a 12-month vow of chastity. Don't believe me? Click here.

I'll do you one better. She has been photoged dry humping her ex (not Matt) as of the past few days. Poor Matt.

 

[Sandan]

The point is K9, you are going straight for my jugular in regards to Rod Graves.

I was just pointing out the FACT that the Cardinals have not had major issues with draft picks for several years now. That is a fact and if you can't deal with that it is your problem.

If you want to go trash Rod Graves, fine but please get off my back about it right now because I wasn't explicitly talking about Rod Graves and I fail to see right now why I would need to defend him. So far all we have is Leinart holding out for 1 day and all the indications are that his agents are asking for an unrealistic contract.

The point here is ONE DAY, hardly time to throw anybody under the bus.

 

[abomb]

The point here is ONE DAY, hardly time to throw anybody under the bus.

 

[kerouac9]

If you want to go trash Rod Graves, fine but please get off my back about it right now because I wasn't explicitly talking about Rod Graves and I fail to see right now why I would need to defend him. So far all we have is Leinart holding out for 1 day and all the indications are that his agents are asking for an unrealistic contract.

The point here is ONE DAY, hardly time to throw anybody under the bus.

Really?! Seriously? That's what "all the indications are"? We both know who runs the contracts, and who we're complaining about when contracts aren't done. When you take up for management in these negotiations, we all understand who you're taking up for.

Go back in the thread and see who mentioned RG first.

 

[Sandan]

You really need to realx a little K9.

The point is, once again, it is only 1 day so far hardly time to jump of a bridge. Secondly, the Cardinals have signed their first round picks with a limited hassle over the last few years. Both of these FACTS, suggest that we will probably get this done soon.

If we get into next week I will start to get more concerned.

As for 'indications'. Well given recent history I find it hard to believe the the Cardinals are not offering a slotted contract, hence it's possible the issue is the Leinart camp's expectations.

It might require nothing more than some rewording of the contract. I mean let's be realistic. Sure his agent left town, but he is based in LA, he could have breakfast in LA and be back here in time for a lunch meeting, I ahve done the same in reverse.

Right now it looks like they have some work to do and a signing isn't imminent but that could all change in a day or so.

 

[Mitch]

You really need to realx a little K9.

The point is, once again, it is only 1 day so far hardly time to jump of a bridge. Secondly, the Cardinals have signed their first round picks with a limited hassle over the last few years. Both of these FACTS, suggest that we will probably get this done soon.

If we get into next week I will start to get more concerned.

As for 'indications'. Well given recent history I find it hard to believe the the Cardinals are not offering a slotted contract, hence it's possible the issue is the Leinart camp's expectations.

It might require nothing more than some rewording of the contract. I mean let's be realistic. Sure his agent left town, but he is based in LA, he could have breakfast in LA and be back here in time for a lunch meeting, I ahve done the same in reverse.

Right now it looks like they have some work to do and a signing isn't imminent but that could all change in a day or so.

Nidan: Don't worry...you are right. Rod Graves changed the climate for contract negotiations in Arizona even before Green arrived. Graves gets zero credit and yet, if the truth be told, he is the integrity of the organization. He's above board...and a very effective negotiator...who managed to convince the Bidwill's to get with the modern era.

 

[kerouac9]

I'm really not concerned about Leinart getting in on time. I don't think that there's any reason to be concerned until he's missed a week of camp, so Graves gets a free pass on this one until August 7.

That being said, to suggest that contract negotiations have not been a problem for first-round picks during the Rod Graves area is a gross mis-statement of the facts. Just because a player doesn't hold out into the regular season doesn't mean that he's not a holdout. The two weeks that Antrel Rolle held out was a week to long for my tastes.

The indications of who's "at fault" for this holdout among the legitimate press are about even. I'm still optimistic that Leinart will be tossing passes two offensive series into the first preseason game.

 

[CorporalCardinal]

Wow, this thread shifted from a rational discussion of why Leinart may be holding out and what it might take to get him in camp to a "my opinion is better than yours" point and scream fest. Come on guys, it's been ONE day, I expected Leinart to be a holdout for the first few days if not the first week of camp. Calm down, you're not in the front office or in Leinart's camp hoping to get some money. Just relax, let them do what they are going to do and be happy that we have EVERYONE ELSE in camp learning their roles and hope for no injury problems in camp and preseason.

Leinart will sign sooner or later (hopefully sooner), but it's nothing to lose your mind over. Warner is in camp and IS our starter for this season, Leinart and Navarre will just be there to learn and soak up the "wisdom of experience."

simmerdownnow!

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

And I'm sure no one in the organization will loose any sleep because of your lack of applause.

You're obviously right, because if they truly did care about fans getting pissed off about draft picks being in camp on time they probably would have remedied the situation a long time ago.

And as I pointed out eariler this thread - I'm not worried about Leinart for now, but if he's not in by the scrimmage then it's time to start biting your nails. I'm just not going to compliment the Cardinals for their draft picks "only missing a few days of camp" when most of the NFL seems to get it done on time,

 

[Evil Ash]

You're obviously right, because if they truly did care about fans getting pissed off about draft picks being in camp on time they probably would have remedied the situation a long time ago.

And as I pointed out eariler this thread - I'm not worried about Leinart for now, but if he's not in by the scrimmage then it's time to start biting your nails. I'm just not going to compliment the Cardinals for their draft picks "only missing a few days of camp" when most of the NFL seems to get it done on time,

Actually around half of the 1st rounders this year missed time. Leinart is noticed more because a) he's a big name player and b) the Cardinals started camp later then others.

 

[Cheesebeef]

good lord - nothing ever changes on this board, does it?

 

[spanky1]

Condon is based in KC not LA

 

[ajcardfan]

Condon is based in KC not LA

He is part of "Creative Artists Agency". Their main office is in Beverly Hills. I do think Condon still lives in the KC area.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creative_Artists_Agency

 

[Renz]

good lord - nothing ever changes on this board, does it?

It's like Groundhog Day!

 

[Cheesebeef]

He is part of "Creative Artists Agency". Their main office is in Beverly Hills. I do think Condon still lives in the KC area.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creative_Artists_Agency

not only is it based in LA, it's the biggets and most successful of the 4 Hollywood agencies. I always thought it was weird that Leinhart (well, maybe not, seeing as his reputation in LA was as a wannabe rockstar) went with CAA - I had never heard of any NFL player do that before. At least not for representation for the NFL, anyways - Condon's got a bunch of clients though, right? Anyone know when he went ot CAA?