Lombardi: Kolb Should lose his job

[az1965]

If he is taking orders from Larry that is not a good thing either! Yeah keep throwing it to him and when he doesn't make amazing catches on your inaccurate balls then the other team probably will be catching alot of them. Sorry but Skelton's best asset seems to be his poise which is nice but does not a star make. If he can clean up his accuracy and ability to read a D he may do well with time. Will he get the time... not so sure.

He reads the D pretty well. And if you haven't noticed, Skelton has thrown to others and revived what seemed to be a lost WR in Andre Roberts. He does have some issues with his accuracy but I think that can be cured with more playing and practice with the first offense.

 

[Fiasco]

He reads the D pretty well. And if you haven't noticed, Skelton has thrown to others and revived what seemed to be a lost WR in Andre Roberts. He does have some issues with his accuracy but I think that can be cured with more playing and practice with the first offense.

Clearly some of his passes are flat out inaccurate. Some of those "inaccurate" passes are going to be rectified by improving timing with the receivers.

 

[THESMEL]

Kolb deserves another chance, Skelton is still developing , 2 consequtive safeties against the Rams? running out of bounds for sacks instead of tossing it away.

We are all but out of it this year, We have to find out more about Kolb before this offseason. But feel siure that Skelton is on schedule and developing into a starting NFL QB.

 

[Fiasco]

Why do we have to find out more about kolb and not Skelton.

Only 1 of the 2 has been improving over time.

If we go back to kolb and get more school girl scrambling we just wasted valuable reps for Skelton.

 

[Phrazbit]

Kolb deserves another chance, Skelton is still developing , 2 consequtive safeties against the Rams? running out of bounds for sacks instead of tossing it away.

We are all but out of it this year, We have to find out more about Kolb before this offseason. But feel siure that Skelton is on schedule and developing into a starting NFL QB.

Really? You're going to kill him for that? He has done that once, while we see Kolb run himself into a 10-15 yard sack virtually once per possession.

 

[Totally_Red]

Kolb deserves another chance, Skelton is still developing , 2 consequtive safeties against the Rams? running out of bounds for sacks instead of tossing it away.

We are all but out of it this year, We have to find out more about Kolb before this offseason. But feel siure that Skelton is on schedule and developing into a starting NFL QB.

KK might deserve another chance. But until Red Skelton actually loses a game, he should be the starter IMO. I don't expect him to pull a rabbit out of his hat and actually beat SF, but I do expect him to keep his cool and keep showing improvement. I don't necessarily have that expectation with 5-year veteran Kevin Kolb.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

2 consequtive safeties against the Rams?

Double Deuce !

 

[moninghaly]

Here, here.

 

[JCSunsfan]

KK might deserve another chance. But until Red Skelton actually loses a game, he should be the starter IMO. I don't expect him to pull a rabbit out of his hat and actually beat SF, but I do expect him to keep his cool and keep showing improvement. I don't necessarily have that expectation with 5-year veteran Kevin Kolb.

Let Kolb sit next game and see what Skelton has got. Why not? We are not going anywhere this season anyway. The jury is still out on who will be the QBOF. Kolb might benefit from sitting and watching Skelton unashamedly thow it to Larry in double coverage.

If Kolb wants the starting job back, he is going to have to improve and fight for it. That's how football works.

If I am Whiz, that's how I would handle it. I would say, "John Skelton has played very well for us and is making great improvements in his play. We believe he deserves another start to show us what he can do." Just leave it at that, game by game.

 

[TJ]

Let Kolb sit next game and see what Skelton has got. Why not? We are not going anywhere this season anyway. The jury is still out on who will be the QBOF. Kolb might benefit from sitting and watching Skelton unashamedly thow it to Larry in double coverage.

Kolb should sit one more game, especially against a stout defense like the 9ers. First, you don't want him to go against their defense recovering from a bum foot and try and make miracles happen while risking further injury, especially when the season is lost.

Second, why not let Skelton start once more? If anything, his decent play has given him the right to test his skills against one of the best in the NFL. Hell, Kolb got to play against Baltimore and Pittsburgh, why not give Skelton a fair shot and put him against a team that would give him a true litmus test?

If Kolb wants the starting job back, he is going to have to improve and fight for it. That's how football works.

This statement would be applicable if Kolb lost his job. He didn't. He's injured and the team is following common procedure and having the back up play until he recovers. This isn't Matt Leinart v. Kurt Warner, although the public perception appears to be just as polarizing.

More appropriately, Kolb is going to have to prove he is healthy and learning from his mistakes once he takes the field again.

If I am Whiz, that's how I would handle it. I would say, "John Skelton has played very well for us and is making great improvements in his play. We believe he deserves another start to show us what he can do." Just leave it at that, game by game.

"game-by-game" is how this team has failed over the course of its time in Arizona. In 2003, it was Blake and McCown. 2004 it was McCown and King. 2006 it was Warner and Leinart. 2010 it was Anderson, Hall and Skelton.

You don't treat the QB position like a seesaw. Pick one guy at the beginning of the season and stick with him.

Additionally, I would not consider Skelton as playing "very well." There are positive aspects to his game and there are glaring concerns that show he is still an unfinished product. If Skelton was setting the field on fire then yes a change should be considered, but at this point, the QB controversy only exists in the minds of the fans thinking we've had the panacea in our back pocket this entire time.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Additionally, I would not consider Skelton as playing "very well." There are positive aspects to his game and there are glaring concerns that show he is still an unfinished product.

I wouldn't consider Skelton as playing "very well" either, but there ARE positive aspects to his game and unfortunately for the overwhelming majority of the season there haven't been really any positive aspects of Kolb's game since week 1 against an awful panthers D and his glaring concerns IMO are MUCH bigger than Skelton's, especially considering he's been in the league much longer.

If Skelton was setting the field on fire then yes a change should be considered, but at this point, the QB controversy only exists in the minds of the fans thinking we've had the panacea in our back pocket this entire time.

only in the minds of the fans? maybe that would be true if the only people talking about this were the people on this board, but the media's, both locally and nationally, are talking about it too which makes it more than just cardinals fandom thinking they've got lightning in a bottle (which no one here really does anyway) To surmise it's not a legit discussion after a two game winning streak that occurred along with a QB change (note: that's not to say Skelton's THE reason we're winning) when the previously starting QB had been as relatively awful as Kolb had been the previous 6 weeks of consecutive loses while seemingly getting worse as every week doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

 

[TJ]

I wouldn't consider Skelton as playing "very well" either, but there ARE positive aspects to his game and unfortunately for the overwhelming majority of the season there haven't been really any positive aspects of Kolb's game since week 1 against an awful panthers D and his glaring concerns IMO are MUCH bigger than Skelton's, especially considering he's been in the league much longer.



only in the minds of the fans? maybe that would be true if the only people talking about this were the people on this board, but the media's, both locally and nationally, are talking about it too which makes it more than just cardinals fandom thinking they've got lightning in a bottle (which no one here really does anyway) To surmise it's not a legit discussion after a two game winning streak that occurred along with a QB change (note: that's not to say Skelton's THE reason we're winning) when the previously starting QB had been as relatively awful as Kolb had been the previous 6 weeks of consecutive loses while seemingly getting worse as every week doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

This Lombardi article is really the first Ive heard nationally about a "controversy" and the local media reports have been either lukewarm or unconvincing about a change. Either than that, it's simply been Skelton holding the fort until Kolb can return.

Trust me, I am just as underwhelmed about Kolb's performance as the next man; however, it would take a monumental effort from Skelton to seriously consider a change (and by serious, I mean from the coaches).

As it stands, Kolb is the starter for the team and we all have to deal with it. But you give Kolb the opportunity to come back and learn from his mistakes because he is signed to be the long-term answer and to quit on him 1/10th into the length of his contract would be imprudent from both a football and business perspective. Most football guys will tell you Kolb has a brighter upside than Skelton and perhaps the solution is more exposure in the offense and a true offseason. But like the Leinart v. Warner debates, fans are going to take a hard stance and not be persuaded.

Any die-hard knowledgeable Card fan would know what it's like to play the QB carousel and the horrors that have come from it, so my belief is to let Kolb play the season out and see how he progresses. If he shows signs of failure again early next season, then it is fair to say it is not a systematic issue with Kolb, but rather one of skill and performance and it would be reasonable at that point to consider alternatives. I still believe Kolb can be our QBoF and the only way we'll be able to know definitively is if he is afforded the full offseason he wasn't given this season. Does not matter if he's been in the league one or four years. As a QB, learning a new offense, especially Whiz's, is like saying you're moving from Phoenix to Anchorage and expecting to be completely adapted to the climate by the time you get there.

Bottom line: big picture, be patient, season is over anyway.

 

[Cheesebeef]

This Lombardi article is really the first Ive heard nationally about a "controversy" and the local media reports have been either lukewarm or unconvincing about a change. Either than that, it's simply been Skelton holding the fort until Kolb can return.

Trust me, I am just as underwhelmed about Kolb's performance as the next man; however, it would take a monumental effort from Skelton to seriously consider a change (and by serious, I mean from the coaches).

As it stands, Kolb is the starter for the team and we all have to deal with it. But you give Kolb the opportunity to come back and learn from his mistakes because he is signed to be the long-term answer and to quit on him 1/10th into the length of his contract would be imprudent from both a football and business perspective. Most football guys will tell you Kolb has a brighter upside than Skelton and perhaps the solution is more exposure in the offense and a true offseason. But like the Leinart v. Warner debates, fans are going to take a hard stance and not be persuaded.

Any die-hard knowledgeable Card fan would know what it's like to play the QB carousel and the horrors that have come from it, so my belief is to let Kolb play the season out and see how he progresses. If he shows signs of failure again early next season, then it is fair to say it is not a systematic issue with Kolb, but rather one of skill and performance and it would be reasonable at that point to consider alternatives. I still believe Kolb can be our QBoF and the only way we'll be able to know definitively is if he is afforded the full offseason he wasn't given this season. Does not matter if he's been in the league one or four years. As a QB, learning a new offense, especially Whiz's, is like saying you're moving from Phoenix to Anchorage and expecting to be completely adapted to the climate by the time you get there.

Bottom line: big picture, be patient, season is over anyway.

I just don't buy the idea that we have to waste TWO years on Kolb. that's not the NFL. If he gets back in there and continues to stink the guy stinks. that's two systems he will have played mediocre (at best) to horribly in, on teams with actual talent. The idea that the Cardinals systems (both offensive and defense) are so far more complicated and ahead of the curve over the entirety of the NFL where other players are able to come in and make major adjustments (Alex smith, Hasselback, even a rookie like Andy Dalton for example in the short off-season with completely new systems thrust upon them and being successful in them) doesn't hold a lot of water for me.

I'm somewhat fine with Kolb coming back in when healthy if Skelton starts to falter to see what he can do the rest of the season, but if he continues to be atrocious like had been the previous 5 weeks down the stretch, it would be incredibly stupid IMO to hand him the reigns next year and just call his performance this year a wash because of the lock-out.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Does anyone really think the Bidwills will give Kolb $7 million just to be a backup next season? Skelton will inevitably struggle at some point since he hasn't exactly set the world on fire so far in his career. At that point Kolb will be playing for his job.

 

[Pariah]

Does anyone really think the Bidwills will give Kolb $7 million just to be a backup next season? Skelton will inevitably struggle at some point since he hasn't exactly set the world on fire so far in his career. At that point Kolb will be playing for his job.

Sure he will; he's a young, raw player. But, I'd rather take "at some point" as opposed to "has consistently" in terms of struggling QBs.

JMHO

 

[Cheesebeef]

Does anyone really think the Bidwills will give Kolb $7 million just to be a backup next season? Skelton will inevitably struggle at some point since he hasn't exactly set the world on fire so far in his career. At that point Kolb will be playing for his job.

they're giving Bradley 6 million to be the back-up to Paris Lenon... if Kolb continues to fall on his face and run backwards like a chicken with his head cut off and we start losing once he gets back in there, they'll be hard pressed to not at least open camp with a legit QB competition next year.

 

[Cheesebeef]

the big issue I have with the Skelton v. Kolb comparison is that i've really yet to see ANYTHING from Kolb since week 1 that makes me think he's got tools to succeed. He can make plays with his feet... but doesn't. He's not all that accurate. He's unbelievably not clutch. And he's got ZERO pocket presence whatsoever. As opposed to Skelton, who's still making a bunch of mistakes, isn't incredibly accurate but at least has shown the ability to make big plays down the stretch, has pretty damn good pocket presence and does make plays with his feet.

I just can't hang my hat on anything Kolb does and that's what scares me the most about him and the fact that Skelton at least has a couple attributes that a QB needs is what makes me wonder if Skelton doesn't deserve a legit shot regardless of injury.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

they're giving Bradley 6 million to be the back-up to Paris Lenon... if Kolb continues to fall on his face and run backwards like a chicken with his head cut off and we start losing once he gets back in there, they'll be hard pressed to not at least open camp with a legit QB competition next year.

Bradley is toast next year, if we hadn't already paid him we would be gone. My guess is that if Kolb struggles when he returns to action then we cut him, draft a QB, and let this hypothetical QB and Skelton fight it out.

Skelton while not great has done some good things this year. He definitely has some bad throws but when the offense moves it seems like it flows like it did in the Warner days gaining big chunks of yards down the field especially down the seams. And I don't think it's a coincidence that Andre Roberts has seemingly reappeared now that Skelton is back there. I really wonder what he would look like with a full offseason.

I just can't hang my hat on anything Kolb does and that's what scares me the most about him and the fact that Skelton at least has a couple attributes that a QB needs is what makes me wonder if Skelton doesn't deserve a legit shot regardless of injury.

Agreed. Kolb looks like one of those QB's that can manage but not win games if he knows the system and doesn't piss and moan in the clubhouse. So a great backup. My guess is he goes back to Philly and backs up Vick at some point but we aren't paying the dude to hold a clipboard.

 

[Phrazbit]

To the question of if there is a QB controversy. Does anyone really think Kolb would be "doubtful" this week if not for Skelton's 2 victories? Not a chance. Orginally he was a game day decision against St Louis, now 3 weeks after the injury he had progressed to "doubtful" despite claims that his foot is much better.

The team is dragging their feet on Kolb's toe and it has more to do with wins and losses than it does with QB health.

So yes, I dont see anyway we are not in a QB "controversy".

 

[Phrazbit]

I just can't hang my hat on anything Kolb does and that's what scares me the most about him and the fact that Skelton at least has a couple attributes that a QB needs is what makes me wonder if Skelton doesn't deserve a legit shot regardless of injury.

Exactly.

This is why I have no hope of Kolb ever becoming decent. Because he has no strengths at all to his game. Even Derek Anderson (who was abominable) you could at least say "but he sure does have a cannon". Kolb's skill-set appears to be nothing by varying degrees of weaknesses.

 

[Stout]

TJ, the biggest problem with Kolb isn't a system problem. Were he simply struggling to find open receivers and unsure how to go about his reads, then I would be confident he may eventually be able to get over those problems. No matter what anyone says, it isn't a system problem that he ignores the pocket and runs around in a way that makes it impossible for him to succeed. They may have taught more scrambling in Philly, but they didn't teach utter pocket stupidity, and they didn't teach him to scramble OUT of a play. That is ALL on him, and is not a system problem in the least.

 

[Mulli]

TJ, the biggest problem with Kolb isn't a system problem. Were he simply struggling to find open receivers and unsure how to go about his reads, then I would be confident he may eventually be able to get over those problems. No matter what anyone says, it isn't a system problem that he ignores the pocket and runs around in a way that makes it impossible for him to succeed. They may have taught more scrambling in Philly, but they didn't teach utter pocket stupidity, and they didn't teach him to scramble OUT of a play. That is ALL on him, and is not a system problem in the least.

Well said.

 

[chickenhead]

It just seems like he hasn't shown any 1) quick release, 2) ability to hang in the pocket, or 3) escapability. Even one of those things can make up a little bit for the others. Back in camp it seemed like he was athletic and had a good arm. Seems like the first ability is being mis-applied and the second isn't seeing the light of day.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

the big issue I have with the Skelton v. Kolb comparison is that i've really yet to see ANYTHING from Kolb since week 1 that makes me think he's got tools to succeed. He can make plays with his feet... but doesn't. He's not all that accurate. He's unbelievably not clutch. And he's got ZERO pocket presence whatsoever. As opposed to Skelton, who's still making a bunch of mistakes, isn't incredibly accurate but at least has shown the ability to make big plays down the stretch, has pretty damn good pocket presence and does make plays with his feet.

I just can't hang my hat on anything Kolb does and that's what scares me the most about him and the fact that Skelton at least has a couple attributes that a QB needs is what makes me wonder if Skelton doesn't deserve a legit shot regardless of injury.

Agree with all of this. The PR and ESPN hype on Kolb was just unfathomable. For anyone before this year to assert anything with certainty about Kolb was extremely premature.

The most laughable part about all of this? Comparing his career arc to Aaron Rodgers. Try Matt Moore.

 

[JCSunsfan]

It takes a year to understand and feel comfortable in Whiz's offensive system (at least thats what the pundits are saying). Skelton is earning his chance. If he excels against the Niners, its going to be hard to go back to Kolb. But you can bet the starting QB job will be open for grabs in next summer's training camp.