Matt leinart draft prediction

[Russ Smith]

Wanna bet? Rumor is Del Rio is pulling a Bellichek and will start Garrard. Leftwich is still hurt.

But if he were healthy he'd be starting.

 

[Russ Smith]

And they would have a lot less money under the cap and wouldn't have an opportunity at a 1st round round difference maker somewhere else on the field. Or a second round pick or whatever it would take to get Leinart.

Just like Eli, Leinart wouldn't be anything resembling a value for the Cardinals. Switching draft spots and giving up another plus the huge contract he would commmand as well as possibly holding out untilt he huge contract is negotiated...man, I just don't see how this looks attractive.

Depends, if we trade up to get Leinart yes less caproom, but if he fell to us and we took him the caphit is the same. nobody pays QB bonuses to the tenth pick in the draft.

Plus we have plenty of caproom.

 

[moklerman]

But if he were healthy he'd be starting.

Ask Bledsoe how much that means. Or Trent Green or Joe Montana or Tommy Maddox.

 

[Pariah]

Ask Bledsoe how much that means. Or Trent Green or Joe Montana or Tommy Maddox.

Dude, do you hate all QBs but Warner?

 

[clif]

If the team's record was all that mattered, Jason White would have been in the NFL. Heck, he put up better numbers than Leinart. Now, that's an extreme example but he had a bad knee and marginal arm too.

AH HA!! I knew this was coming. I'm actually surprised you didn't throw this little nugget out before.

Jason White (IIRC) blew out BOTH knees! He was a freaking statue for crying out loud. The guy had a great college career, but that was only after lobbying the NCAA for a 6th year of eligibility. There is very little if any comparison between his knees and Leinart's.

Also I do believe that the Sooners went to a more wide open passing type offense which is not generally run in the NFL so passing yards and all that of course will balloon.

As Russ has stated numerous times Leinart is running a PRO style offense and has been audibling in it for two years. I think Josh just started getting the green light to do that here in his 4th year in the NFL.

Let's also not forget that Pete Carroll is the DC for USC so you have to admit that Matt has been tutored and practiced against NFL type defenses for the past 4 years.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

moklerman's quickly becoming the 2005 version of That Guy.

 

[moklerman]

Dude, do you hate all QBs but Warner?

What are you talking about? You think if Garrard takes Jacksonville to the Super Bowl he won't keep that job? The guys I mentioned are all good qb's who lost their job due to circumstance, not necessarily to better qb's.

AH HA!! I knew this was coming. I'm actually surprised you didn't throw this little nugget out before.

How did I know someone would miss the point. I was pointing out that the college team's record isn't indicitive of how good the qb will be in the NFL(like someone stated as a reason Leinart will be good).

The more I've watched Leinart this year, the more I've been unimpressed. I thought he was better than Palmer after he won the Heisman but hadn't really seen him play too much. Now that I watched USC more closely, it's eveident to me that Leinart isn't a qb that the Cardinals would want to draft. Huge money, thinning out the depth of the team, no dividends for a year if at all.

 

[Russ Smith]

Ask Bledsoe how much that means. Or Trent Green or Joe Montana or Tommy Maddox.

So Garrard has won the job? Are you going out on a limb and saying that or just throwing out strawmen?

Cool in that case we can trade for Leftwich.

 

[clif]

How did I know someone would miss the point. I was pointing out that the college team's record isn't indicitive of how good the qb will be in the NFL(like someone stated as a reason Leinart will be good).

.

You're right. It is not the only reason, but I sure as well wouldn't be so fast to just write it off.

IMO he is exactly what we need. A guy that can be pin point accurate and can get the ball in the hands of our playmakers Fitz and Q. I don't need someone who will try to rush for 200 yards a game even though that would be nice. We have the offensive playmakers we just need someone poised enough to get it to them.

 

[moklerman]

So Garrard has won the job?

You guy's don't even read the post do you? IF...IF...IF Garrard and Jacksonville win the Super Bowl and Leftwhich is injured on the sideline during that time, Garrard will stay the starter (in my opinion).

moklerman's quickly becoming the 2005 version of That Guy.

If anyone thinks being critical of a college qb's chance of success in the NFL is any way similar to thinking Shaun King is a good qb has another think coming.

 

[Russ Smith]

AH HA!! I knew this was coming. I'm actually surprised you didn't throw this little nugget out before.

Jason White (IIRC) blew out BOTH knees! He was a freaking statue for crying out loud. The guy had a great college career, but that was only after lobbying the NCAA for a 6th year of eligibility. There is very little if any comparison between his knees and Leinart's.

Also I do believe that the Sooners went to a more wide open passing type offense which is not generally run in the NFL so passing yards and all that of course will balloon.

As Russ has stated numerous times Leinart is running a PRO style offense and has been audibling in it for two years. I think Josh just started getting the green light to do that here in his 4th year in the NFL.

Let's also not forget that Pete Carroll is the DC for USC so you have to admit that Matt has been tutored and practiced against NFL type defenses for the past 4 years.

White had ACL surgery on both knees, one of them twice I think. He was literally bone on bone, anybody who drafted him in the first round would have been fired.

Very good college player but to my knowledge Leinart's knee is nothing like White's. I don't even know that he's had surgery I can't find anything online that says he's had knee surgery. It's just the brace is an obvious thing but I don't think his knees are close to White's.

I went to HS with a kid who played QB and had multiple concussions in HS. He got one in basketball, he got one walking through the halls someone opened the library door, hit him in the head, concussion. He had to quit football prior to his senior year because the doctors said concussions become progressive you get them easier, and the effects last longer. This was 1983 so consider that but they told Steve Young the same thing.

That's what scares me about Leinart I just fear he's one of those unlucky guys who has that problem.

 

[Russ Smith]

You guy's don't even read the post do you? IF...IF...IF Garrard and Jacksonville win the Super Bowl and Leftwhich is injured on the sideline during that time, Garrard will stay the starter (in my opinion).
If anyone thinks being critical of a college qb's chance of success in the NFL is any way similar to thinking Shaun King is a good qb has another think coming.

You said nothing about the Superbowl in the post I replied to, just lumped in Leftwich with other Wally Pipp's.

And you yourself said Maddox wasn't a starter caliber NFL QB so I'm not sure why I should be surprised he got replaced?

 

[john h]

He won't pull an Aaron Rodgers free fall but I'm going to predict right now that Leinart won't go 2nd and might not even be the first QB drafted.

Something is wrong with this kid it's about the 4th time this year I've seen him either look like he has a concussion(which he might) or is sick. No velocity, I agree with Keith Jackson who said he took a lick earlier in the game and then the 2nd hard one late in the half.

I really think NFL scouts are going to look at him and say 2 arm surgeries, and beginning to look like he can't take hits without getting woozy, and he'll slide.

Great player but this is just too many times this year where he just looks like he is punch drunk or something.

Kipper and his cronies have Leinhart,Young, and Bush going in the first three picks. He said the oder would depend on Houston. I think this has to be dead on and cannot imagine any other sceniero. These three guys may not even go to any NFL workouts or play in any bowl games. They are a lock pretty much to be in the top three. NO and TN need a QB and Houston may very well take Bush.

 

[john h]

But what about that LenDale White kid? He MAY, I repeat MAY, be worthy of the number 10 pick.

Kipper has him in middle of first round and a strong RB that will do well in the NFL>

 

[ajcardfan]

Kipper has him in middle of first round and a strong RB that will do well in the NFL>

Damn. I'm going to have to watch that show a lot more closely when my kids have it on. I never knew he broke down the draft!

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[MaoTosiFanClub]

moklerman's quickly becoming the 2005 version of That Guy.

Damn. Pariah beat me to it.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

Public Announcement

I'd really like to comment further on this thread, but since the Cardinals have been a horrible team for the last fifty years and the Rams have been barely mediocre, I have to submit to the wise knowledge of moklerman. Because remember everybody, if anyone tells you that "you're a Cardinals fan and they suck" it disproves any point you're trying to make.

 

[Russ Smith]

Kipper and his cronies have Leinhart,Young, and Bush going in the first three picks. He said the oder would depend on Houston. I think this has to be dead on and cannot imagine any other sceniero. These three guys may not even go to any NFL workouts or play in any bowl games. They are a lock pretty much to be in the top three. NO and TN need a QB and Houston may very well take Bush.

Right but Leinart was a lock #1 before the year began and lock #2 a week ago. if he goes 3 behind Young, that IS slipping. If he doesn't, hey I'm wrong again.

 

[NEZCardsfan]

Well Russ, I guess you're just trying to prove my points. What round was Warner drafted in? Okay, if you think Leinart and Warner are so similar you completely agree that he should NOT be an overpriced first rounder. Thanks, I appreciate your support.

Let's just lump all your Warner insults into one response: You're a CARDINALS fan! You have no right to "try" and insult a super bowl winning, 2 time MVP. Warner will always have those things so until someone on the Cardinals even get's close please stop with your crapola. If you can't make a point without trying to insult me or my favorite current player, then don't bother trying. It won't work.

The mods should just delete this post. You never have one single basis for any thread you make. Your only existance on this board is to tell us how much better Kurt Warner is than us.

I can't believe I even read one of your threads......with you claiming that Gino Torreta was a southpaw and all.

 

[LVCARDFREAK]

Young's OL was looking pretty good last night. Had less pressure on him than Leinart did. I mean, I dunno. I agree with Matt that 'SC had the better team last night, and Vince Young is a great college player, but I don't think he'll be a great pro. Honestly, I don't think he'll be a good pro.

Hard to invest a $20 million bonus in a guy who told ESPN last night that the secret to his success was that Mack Brown & Co. stopped coaching him.

I am not sure why you say that? What makes you think he wont be a great pro? All signs point to him being a very good NFL QB. I mean his passer rating, completion %, his wins, command of the team and playbook, strong accurate arm, atheltic ability etc.

I know about the hitch in his motion and frankly it matter very little. He can pass the ball and is much more accurate a passer than Vick, or Cunningham or anyone else he has been compared too. He has played top notch competition and won at that level and wasnt surrounded by the likes of a White or Bush like Leinhert leans on.

It is funny how people get latched onto other players and start hating on a guys for no apparent reason.

It is also hard to invest $20million on a guy who claims after gettig beat they "are still the better team" while he shrugs off past reporters while knocking a microphone out of his face...talk about no class....

 

[moklerman]

You said nothing about the Superbowl in the post I replied to, just lumped in Leftwich with other Wally Pipp's.

Actually, what I said is:

Leftwhich is another example. Jacksonville's a good "team". That's why they just kept on winning when Garrard stepped in. Byron's good, but Arizona wouldn't be where Jacksonville is if they had drafted him.

The point made in that thread was completely different than the one where I mentioned qb's how lost their job to injury to qb's who had a lot of success and/or won the Super Bowl. The post about Garrard was about how Leftwich wouldn't be Leftwich (in my opinion) if he had gone to the Cardinals so it's sadisitc to torture yourself in thinking that "if only we'd done this or that in the draft".

Damn. Pariah beat me to it.

Yeah, there's a core little group of you guys that seem to like patting yourself on the backs and insulting someone who doesn't agree with your visions of what's best for the Cardinals. I would take it more personally if I thought any of you were actually commenting on what I've written but it seems that once your opinions are established you don't bother to read someone's post, you just "know" what they're going to say.

Because remember everybody, if anyone tells you that "you're a Cardinals fan and they suck" it disproves any point you're trying to make.

That's it, don't try and stand on your own, get everyone to pat you on the back for how clever you are. Have I started an attack on anyone? Did I refute anyone's opinion based on their fandom of the Cardinals. Please post quotes if you don't mind. No, I gave back what I was given and asked that it stop. For some strange reason it keeps being brought up...?

with you claiming that Gino Torreta was a southpaw and all.

Hey, I admit it when I'm wrong but I would have bet my bottom dollar that Toretta was a lefty. I don't know who I was thinking of. It's got nothing to do with the point I was making, but you're right, Gino was a righty. The point was that he was a Heisman winner who was part of a dominant college team and then a total bust in the NFL. Left handed was just a coincidence that I thought ironic considering the correlation I was trying to make between the two. Any Miami Hurricane experts out there, cuz I can't figure out who I'm thinking of that was a lefty? I was sure that it was someone from Miami but who knows now.

The mods should just delete this post. You never have one single basis for any thread you make. Your only existance on this board is to tell us how much better Kurt Warner is than us.

That's so laughable I don't even know if I should acknowledge it. I've gone to great lengths to explain and illustrate my points of view. Right or wrong, I think you're way off base claiming I'm just some blowhard talking down to Cardinals fans. If you truly believe that then I can only assume you haven't read, understood, seen or some combination of those most of my posts.

 

[Russ Smith]

Moklerman, throwing out Toretta, or other weak QB's on great teams is kind of irrelevant. Toretta and Dorsey were in the same boat and guess what, even in college, while they were winning all those games, NFL people and scouts were ROUTINELY saying they are not good NFL prospects.

Those same people are NOT saying that about Leinart. They have reservations, but they had reservations about every other QB in the last 10 years. Those guys clearly demonstrated they lacked fundamental things necessary to star at QB in the NFL, Leinart apparently hasn't done that or nobody would be talking about him as a top 3 pick.

Go back and find us one "expert" who was projecting Torretta as an NFL star and that comparison might have some validity, right now it's just a strawman.

 

[JeffGollin]

I agree. I can't put my finger on it, but I'm just not impressed with him as a prospect.
I agree, but not absolutely. There have been guys like Leinert who have turned out to be busts, and others who have turned out to be terrific.

My take on Leinert is that he lacks a cannon for an arm and has average feet, but is heady, extremely accurate, has a pretty quick release and makes good decisions. He's also been blessed with a terrific surrounding cast that's enabled him - unlike many other young QB's - to develop good habits executionally (i.e. on weaker teams, it's hard to learn not to throw off your back foot when 3 guys are continually in your face on every passing play).

To me, the question comes down to: Given his profile, does Leinert project more as a Joe Montana or as a Cade McNown? Answer: "We'll see."

Re the exchange of barbs between Mocklerman and other Cardinal fans on this board: Mocklerman, you set this all up by initially coming on extremely strong and absolute about how bad Leinert is. Only history will bear out whether you're right or wrong. But the response by the regulars on this board was predictable. (You live by the sword, you die by the sword).

 

[NEZCardsfan]

That's so laughable I don't even know if I should acknowledge it. I've gone to great lengths to explain and illustrate my points of view. Right or wrong, I think you're way off base claiming I'm just some blowhard talking down to Cardinals fans. If you truly believe that then I can only assume you haven't read, understood, seen or some combination of those most of my posts.

Sorry, I don't read your posts. I skim them. You kill your credibility when you start claiming Gino Torretta was a southpaw and had a 34 game winning streak. It's called Google....do a little research. You just look like you are making stuff up.

 

[ajcardfan]

Sorry, I don't read your posts. I skim them. You kill your credibility when you start claiming Gino Torretta was a southpaw and had a 34 game winning streak. It's called Google....do a little research. You just look like you are making stuff up.

And, he claimed Leinart started for two years, not three. Stupid mistakes like that make people think you don't know what the hell you're talking about.