Michael Vick

[Cheesebeef]

Last week the excuse for Vick was that he had terrible recievers. Peerless Price, the most sought after free agent receiver, the year he signed with Atlanta, caught two deep balls for TD's yesterday. After the second, Jim Mora grabbed Price on the sidelines and jostled him around like: "see, I told you we'd get the ball to you EVENTUALLY!" "Get your attitude out of the dumper."

These are the problems caused by a player like Mike. The personnel problems will continue where ever Vick plays quarterrunningwideoutback.

Mora conceded after the game, that the coaching staff was telling him to "just run it" quite a few times against Denver. So on designed bootlegs, and roll out pass plays that get the ball to receivers and running backs down the field, the coaches were telling Vick to "look to run first."

They must figure if the only way to make him effective at QB is to have him run it, even though he risks injury, at least they can win playing this way, and if he does get hurt ... they can put in the real quarterback currently riding the pine.

The guy throws for 250 yards and 2 TDs and this is the best you can come up with? The team is also 6-2. What Atalnta really needs is a QB who canput up tons of yardage in garbage time and seal the game with an interception for a TD dropping his team into a first place tie with the Chargers - give me a break Lex.

 

[BACH]

Never been a Vick fan, but watched the Falcons - Broncos game last night and I was impressed. Vick has always relied too much on his atlethic ability, but yesterday was the perfect mix of being a pocketpasser, throwing on the run and the "old" scarmbling Michael Vick. Perfect gameplan from the Falcons staff IMO. Vick was awesome!!!

 

[ChandlerCard]

I have him on my FFT, and he's killin' me. He's had one good game, and 3 games with negative points. Theres no other starting QB's available, so I'm stuck. He better light the donkeys up manana

He's on my team also, and I sat him yesterday in favor of Joey Harrington. Not bad, but his inconsistency is killing me again; he did better than Harrington yesterday.

 

[Southpaw]

Last week the excuse for Vick was that he had terrible recievers. Peerless Price, the most sought after free agent receiver, the year he signed with Atlanta, caught two deep balls for TD's yesterday. After the second, Jim Mora grabbed Price on the sidelines and jostled him around like: "see, I told you we'd get the ball to you EVENTUALLY!" "Get your attitude out of the dumper."

These are the problems caused by a player like Mike. The personnel problems will continue where ever Vick plays quarterrunningwideoutback.

Mora conceded after the game, that the coaching staff was telling him to "just run it" quite a few times against Denver. So on designed bootlegs, and roll out pass plays that get the ball to receivers and running backs down the field, the coaches were telling Vick to "look to run first."

They must figure if the only way to make him effective at QB is to have him run it, even though he risks injury, at least they can win playing this way, and if he does get hurt ... they can put in the real quarterback currently riding the pine.

Very interesting and it could be reality. Win now baby seems to overwhelm football. I think it takes running QBs about 3 years to figure it out. It is a quick way to a short career. I don't buy the bad receiver excuses. Crumpler, Price, Finneran, Jenkins, Dunn ain't too bad.

Stewart, Cunningham, Young, Culpepper, McNab, Plummer, Fiedler.

 

[abomb]

Had this discussion with a buddy a while back and I threw in Randall Cunningham. Looking back at Cunninham's career stats, he was no where near the "vick-type" runner I remembered, but his passing numbers were insane. For me, I would rather have a drop-back pocket passer.

A-Bomb

 

[Lex]

Beef-

Boy, do I wish we had a quarterback that could LOSE a game that caused us to FALL into a tie for first place ...

Wait ...we DID have that guy. Then we FINALLY got rid of him and haven't won a road game since.

 

[Russ Smith]

Beef-

Boy, do I wish we had a quarterback that could LOSE a game that caused us to FALL into a tie for first place ...

Wait ...we DID have that guy. Then we FINALLY got rid of him and haven't won a road game since.

When did Jake lose a game to make us fall back into first place? Were we ever in first place with him?

Seriously go ask some Denver fans what they think of him they're all talking about who should replace him. Some are calling for Kanell as ridiculous as that is. Jake is in the same position Josh is, playing for a contract, he's doing a lot better job of it than Josh is, but if they decide his option is too big to pick up, he'll be gone after this year in Denver.

Maybe we'll sign him again and make you happier?

 

[kerouac9]

They must figure if the only way to make him effective at QB is to have him run it, even though he risks injury, at least they can win playing this way, and if he does get hurt ... they can put in the real quarterback currently riding the pine.

You know that the only way that Denver has mustered to keep Jake effective is to have him run, take bootlegs out of the pocket, risk injury, etc., right? Jake's numbers from the pocket and on the scramble are night and day.

Any QB can get injured on the next play, whether he's in the pocket or not.

 

[Lex]

Russ-

That post was a reply to Beef when he referred to Jake losing with "garbage stats" at the end of yesterday's loss.

Denver fans on a web site can be just as stupid as us? I'm sure that's true. The Donkeys did make the playoffs last year, the first time that's happened since Elway right?

Jake is just like Josh, playing for a contract next year? Why don't you just say Jake is a career backup, will be lucky to make a roster, will get the veteran minimum ... oh, that's right, you said that about Jake two years ago.

 

[Lex]

Kerouac-

There's a difference between rolling out, and bootlegging in an offense that's designed to do exactly that, and asking a quarterback in a west coast quick pass offense, to "look to run first."

 

[kerouac9]

Kerouac-

There's a difference between rolling out, and bootlegging in an offense that's designed to do exactly that, and asking a quarterback in a west coast quick pass offense, to "look to run first."

If defenses are going to give you the rushing lane, why wouldn't you? On the WR pass that Fitz was supposed to run against Seattle, don't you think that his instructions were "look to run first"?

The important part is that the Falcons came away with the W and may clinch the NFC South by Thanksgiving. How overrated.

 

[Tangodnzr]

Not being a Falcon fan, I am not up to speed on all the subtle nuances of everything going on there.

With what limited knowledge I do have, I tend to think that a point Russ has brought up in the past, is indeed a key issue....installing the "west coast" type offense there.

I don't think most good "west coast" passing teams happen overnight.
Not just due to the QB but the whole system, regardless of the specific hybrid variety, is generally based on timing and execution by the whole offense.

Look at how long it has taken Holmgren to get his hand picked QB (Hasselback, back in Green Bay) comfortable and the offense running as "planned".

The situation in Atlanta now reminds me of when Trestman was brought in here. to install it using Jake.
It was not a system that fit well with Jake's individual talents.
Same same with Vick.
Now I don't really know if, given time, Vick can become an effective "west coast" QB, (He well could be, given time) but to expect that system to produce immediate, consistant results IMO has elements of unreality.

I do think Vick's chances of being effective in that system are better than Jake's. But once again, maybe the "system" needs to be "hybridized" a little more to account for Vick's undeniable unique talents.

Either that, or entirely chucked for something much different. (say the more 'vertical' passing game..ala what Green supposedly tries to run.
I think that anyone who questions what a uniquely talented individual Michael Vick is....has rocks in their head.

 

[Duckjake]

I'm an Al Davis kind of fan. Just win baby. All Vick has done is go 18-10-1 as a starter including 9 wins in his last 12 starts.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think that anyone who questions what a uniquely talented individual Michael Vick is....has rocks in their head.

we are in total agreement here.

 

[Russ Smith]

Russ-

That post was a reply to Beef when he referred to Jake losing with "garbage stats" at the end of yesterday's loss.

Denver fans on a web site can be just as stupid as us? I'm sure that's true. The Donkeys did make the playoffs last year, the first time that's happened since Elway right?

Jake is just like Josh, playing for a contract next year? Why don't you just say Jake is a career backup, will be lucky to make a roster, will get the veteran minimum ... oh, that's right, you said that about Jake two years ago.

No I said Jake wouldn't have teams lining up for him, he had 2 offers, Denver and Chicago. But yes Jake got WAY more money from Denver than I expected, of course most of that money is due AFTER this year in roster bonuses and escalation of contract.

Jake did lose with garbage stats, 236 of those yards came in the 4th quarter trying to comeback from a deficit he helped create. I believe they scored 17 off his picks including a quick 7 on the one they ran back for a TD.

now I absolulutely think he's their best QB, but that's because their backups are horrible.

As to why Denver really lost, wasn't just jake, the other reason was one I predicted last week, per their fans the holding calls were coming left and right because of the George Foster chop block and all the focus on it during the week.

I don't recall saying Jake would get the veteran minimum but I did think he'd get a fraction of what he wound up getting. He's still playing better than I thought he could, but he's on a pace for 20 picks, nearly lost a fumble yesterday and as one Bronco fan said "that 80 yarder to Smith was the 2nd time this year he's actually hit a WR in stride."

Of course maybe they're just dumb too and don't recognize a great QB when they have one?

 

[Southpaw]

Just imagine the voice of John Facenda booming out the following over the Fulton County P A system

Now coming into the game to replace the injured Michael Vick

# 8 Matt Schaub
Position: QB
Height: 6-5
Weight: 237
Born: 06/25/1981
College: Virginia
NFL Experience: Rookie

 

[BACH]

Not being a Falcon fan, I am not up to speed on all the subtle nuances of everything going on there.

With what limited knowledge I do have, I tend to think that a point Russ has brought up in the past, is indeed a key issue....installing the "west coast" type offense there.

I don't think most good "west coast" passing teams happen overnight.
Not just due to the QB but the whole system, regardless of the specific hybrid variety, is generally based on timing and execution by the whole offense.

Look at how long it has taken Holmgren to get his hand picked QB (Hasselback, back in Green Bay) comfortable and the offense running as "planned".

The situation in Atlanta now reminds me of when Trestman was brought in here. to install it using Jake.
It was not a system that fit well with Jake's individual talents.
Same same with Vick.
Now I don't really know if, given time, Vick can become an effective "west coast" QB, (He well could be, given time) but to expect that system to produce immediate, consistant results IMO has elements of unreality.

I do think Vick's chances of being effective in that system are better than Jake's. But once again, maybe the "system" needs to be "hybridized" a little more to account for Vick's undeniable unique talents.

Either that, or entirely chucked for something much different. (say the more 'vertical' passing game..ala what Green supposedly tries to run.
I think that anyone who questions what a uniquely talented individual Michael Vick is....has rocks in their head.

Did you see the game yesterday?

I totally agree that trying to fit a certain player into a box that doesn't fit him is a mistake, but I think the Falcons gameplan was briliant yesterday, because they adjusted the West-Coast system to Vick abilities.

 

[john h]

no thanks. IMO he is nothing but a glorified RB playing QB.

Obviously this was posted before yesterdays victory by the Falcons. Vick passed for over 200 yds and ran for over 100 ydrs and was the star of the game. We should be so lucky as to get a Michael Vick.

 

[Redsz]

It was one game. He has been up and down all year.

 

[kerouac9]

It was one game. He has been up and down all year.

And yet the Falcons are 5-2 and are going to clinch their division by Thanksgiving. And Vick has won or closed out three of those games essentially by himself. Not bad for a kid that is still learning the NFL game, frankly.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It was one game. He has been up and down all year.

at least he's had ups. He's played very well in four of their seven games - all of them victories.

 

[Ryanwb]

at least he's had ups. He's played very well in four of their seven games - all of them victories.

They've actually played 8 games and he failed to throw a TD in four of those games. Kerowack is such a Vick homer it's unreal

 

[kerouac9]

They've actually played 8 games and he failed to throw a TD in four of those games. Kerowack is such a Vick homer it's unreal

Dude, what part of 6-2 is so hard to understand? Their the only team in their division with a winning record. Vick has scored 7 TDs this season. He has a solid QB rating of 83.6. He dismantled a Top 5 offense last week. Do you really think that the Falcons would be 6-2 with Josh McCown or Jake Delhomme under center? Please.

 

[Redsz]

So the Falcons defence has nothing to do with the Falcons sucess? To attribute all those victories to Vick is crazy.

 

[O]

So the Falcons defence has nothing to do with the Falcons sucess? To attribute all those victories to Vick is crazy.

defense = BIM

I've been waiting to do that.