Pelicans at Suns 3-19-15

[Cheesebeef]

watching that throwback thursday intro just makes me weep for how little i give a crap about the Suns.

 

[sunsfan88]

Bledsoe looks like he is out of breath almost all the time. He has tire legs, and he doesn't run nearly as much as Nash or Goran did.

And this is something Hornacek has been saying to the press since last season. He constantly has to remind Bledsoe to "run, run, run" because he walks it up too much.

Idk, for someone as athletic and strong as he is, he gets tired really quick. Maybe lose some muscle and work more on stamina and cardio?

 

[FArting]

Funny tweet by Paul Coro

https://twitter.com/paulcoro/status/578812931384553472

 

[elindholm]

It's kind of funny that the Suns won by holding an opponent to 72 points, and yet the story line is how they suck for not scoring more than 74.

 

[slinslin]

For years BC687 complains about the Suns gimmick run and gun high scoring style.

They win an ugly game with defense that would make the Detroit Pistons proud and what happens? Oh BC687 complains about true PG'ness now.

 

[BC867]

For years BC687 complains about the Suns gimmick run and gun high scoring style.

They win an ugly game with defense that would make the Detroit Pistons proud and what happens? Oh BC687 complains about true PG'ness now.

I never complained about the "Suns gimmick run and gun high scoring style."

In fact, your reference to only that overlooks other traits such as strength in the post, rebounding, etc.

My specific and recurring gripe has been about the gimmick of them playing light at heavier positions. Lack of balance.

Whether it be 212 lb. Alvan Adams playing Center stationed at the top of the key or Channing Fry stationed at the 3-point line.

Or three Point Guards, forcing Dragic to Forward from Point Guard. Or Markieff Morris, who said he is a light Power Forward playing Center.

Run and gun high scoring offense is fine (and fun) as long as it doesn't preclude the other skills of basketball.

The Suns ever since Bledsoe joined Dragic, then Thomas, then Knight have been a 1-trick pony. That's the problem. The only reason it changed vs. the Pelicans is because Knight was not available.

 

[Phrazbit]

The Suns ever since Bledsoe joined Dragic, then Thomas, then Knight have been a 1-trick pony. That's the problem. The only reason it changed vs. the Pelicans is because Knight was not available.

The Suns were much more one dimensional with Dragic as "the guy". It was 100% run run run offense and 0% defense. It was basically a homeless man's version of the SSOL Suns. You might not like the way Bledsoe plays but his skills are much more versatile than Dragic's.

 

[SirStefan32]

The Suns were much more one dimensional with Dragic as "the guy". It was 100% run run run offense and 0% defense. It was basically a homeless man's version of the SSOL Suns. You might not like the way Bledsoe plays but his skills are much more versatile than Dragic's.

Let's put Bledsoe alongside Warrick, Childress, Beasley, and Hedo, and see how he does. I know you are a Bledsoe fan, but when it comes to versatility, Bledsoe is probably at the bottom of any list. He can drive to the hoop, that's it. Can't shoot, can't run, can barely play pick and roll other than drive to the hoop.

2005 Steve Nash couldn't have made that Warrick/ Hedo/ Chilli/ Frye/ Dudley/ Beasley team into anything better, let along Dragic or Bledsoe.

 

[Phrazbit]

Let's put Bledsoe alongside Warrick, Childress, Beasley, and Hedo, and see how he does. I know you are a Bledsoe fan, but when it comes to versatility, Bledsoe is probably at the bottom of any list. He can drive to the hoop, that's it. Can't shoot, can't run, can barely play pick and roll other than drive to the hoop.

2005 Steve Nash couldn't have made that Warrick/ Hedo/ Chilli/ Frye/ Dudley/ Beasley team into anything better, let along Dragic or Bledsoe.

... so... being a elite defender and among the best rebounding guards in the NBA adds nothing to "versatility"...

 

[SirStefan32]

... so... being a elite defender and among the best rebounding guards in the NBA adds nothing to "versatility"...

Not the way I define versatility in basketball.
Versatility implies the ability to adapt from one thing to another, as well as do multiple things well. Bledsoe drives to the hoop (and turns the ball over often, but let's ignore that for the sake of this argument) and nothing else offensively. He is not a particularly good shooter, is less then effective in pick and roll or pick and pop situations, he doesn't run, and nobody is going to confuse him with a good facilitator. He is also not an efficient player.
EDIT: He is also extremely inconsistent at even the things he generally does well. We saw what he can do earlier today, but generally speaking, he will not shoot that well often. B

Rebounding is grossly overrated for a point guard, and I question your statement about Bledsoe being an "elite" defender. Elite defenders are guys like Tony Allen, Kawhi Leonard, Joakim Noah, Marc Gasol, etc. Bledsoe is certainly a capable defender, but he is not an "elite" one. He is good at staying in front of his man and he is OK at fighting through picks. His help defense is nothing to write home about and he gambles too much defensively.
As far as rebounding goes, I'd rather he be ready for a fastbreak than grab a couple of defensive rebounds, and I'd rather he get back on defense than chase down an offensive rebound or two when the Suns shoot.
Hell, for all the talk about his rebounding he doesn't even grab two more rebounds than Dragic who leaks out for fast break every time.

 

[Catlover]

Let's put Bledsoe alongside Warrick, Childress, Beasley, and Hedo, and see how he does. I know you are a Bledsoe fan, but when it comes to versatility, Bledsoe is probably at the bottom of any list. He can drive to the hoop, that's it. Can't shoot, can't run, can barely play pick and roll other than drive to the hoop.

2005 Steve Nash couldn't have made that Warrick/ Hedo/ Chilli/ Frye/ Dudley/ Beasley team into anything better, let along Dragic or Bledsoe.

2011/2012 Steve Nash turned that same roster into a .500 squad. Goran was in Houston that season.

 

[SirStefan32]

2011/2012 Steve Nash turned that same roster into a .500 squad. Goran was in Houston that season.

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Nash have Hill, Frye, Redd, Lopez on that roster, and most importantly, no Beasley? Suns lost all of those guys, as well as Gortat for 15 games or so the next season, if my memory is correct (it may not be as I totally forgot about Frye being out when I typed out my previous post.)

 

[Phrazbit]

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Nash have Hill, Frye, Redd, Lopez on that roster, and most importantly, no Beasley? Suns lost all of those guys, as well as Gortat for 15 games or so the next season, if my memory is correct (it may not be as I totally forgot about Frye being out when I typed out my previous post.)

By the time Gortat went down the season was deep in the toilet. Nash also didn't have O'Neal, Scola, Tucker or anything but an infantile version of Markieff...

When Nash was healthy, and still able to move, he was good enough to elevate any roster to .500. You put a healthy Nash on the 2012/13 Suns and I honestly think they're better than the previous year, Beasley be-damned. Dropping Nash was the right move, because that team was old and going nowhere, but Nash certainly made any team worlds better.

Any comparison between Nash, when he was able to play and Goran is laughable. Goran is a good player, Nash is an all-time great.

Back on the topic of "versatile": your definition of "versatile" seems to fly contrary to the meaning of the word. You might not like the way Bledsoe plays but he does a LOT more stuff out there than Dragic, whether you value them or not.

And I know you've gone off the deepend over this issue, but to claim Bledsoe is nothing more than a "capable" defender is laughable, and that his help defense is "nothing to write home about". Honestly... other than watching to find things to hate about him are you even paying attention? He is among the best help defenders, at any position, in the entire league. He has his warts, his turnovers continue to be a serious problem, but acting as though he is merely a "capable" defender reeks of a desperate bias to avoid saying anything positive about the player.

 

[SirStefan32]

By the time Gortat went down the season was deep in the toilet. Nash also didn't have O'Neal, Scola, Tucker or anything but an infantile version of Markieff...

When Nash was healthy, and still able to move, he was good enough to elevate any roster to .500. You put a healthy Nash on the 2012/13 Suns and I honestly think they're better than the previous year, Beasley be-damned. Dropping Nash was the right move, because that team was old and going nowhere, but Nash certainly made any team worlds better.

Any comparison between Nash, when he was able to play and Goran is laughable. Goran is a good player, Nash is an all-time great.

Back on the topic of "versatile": your definition of "versatile" seems to fly contrary to the meaning of the word. You might not like the way Bledsoe plays but he does a LOT more stuff out there than Dragic, whether you value them or not.

And I know you've gone off the deepend over this issue, but to claim Bledsoe is nothing more than a "capable" defender is laughable, and that his help defense is "nothing to write home about". Honestly... other than watching to find things to hate about him are you even paying attention? He is among the best help defenders, at any position, in the entire league. He has his warts, his turnovers continue to be a serious problem, but acting as though he is merely a "capable" defender reeks of a desperate bias to avoid saying anything positive about the player.

Look up "versatility" in the dictionary. Bledsoe is not it.

Also, READ what I say- the spirit of my post was that the roster was so terrible that even the best point guard since Stockton retired couldn't have made them a winning team, let alone Dragic. How you got that I am comparing Dragic to Nash is beyond me.

As far as Bledsoe's defense goes, show me some evidence that he is an "elite" defender. One or two defensive sequences per game don't make someone an elite defender. I suppose he's been on All-NBA Defensive teams since he is so elite?

 

[Phrazbit]

First his defense:

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/DRPM/position/1

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/year/2014/sort/DRPM/position/1

Top 5 in his first two years as a starter, last year the most impactful defensive PG by a gigantic margin. If you have not seen that he is a phenomenal defender during the last 2 years then its just more evidence that you're willfully ignorant to anything that does not suit your love of Dragic.

I can't believe I'm having to do this:

Versatility:

1. capable of or adapted for turning easily from one to another of various tasks, fields of endeavor, etc.: a versatile writer.


2. having or capable of many uses: a versatile tool.



I realize I'm talking to a wall right now and that not of the stats or facts really matter when it comes to talking to you about your most hated player. But he is a GOOD offensive player a great rebounding PG and an elite defender. He does everything out there. Does he do everything at a superb level? No. But thats not what defines "versatility". He is versatile, and far more so than a guy like Dragic who, while a great offensive player, is actively hurting you during half the game with his awful defense.

 

[Zobaczcie suki]

First his defense:

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/sort/DRPM/position/1

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/year/2014/sort/DRPM/position/1

Top 5 in his first two years as a starter, last year the most impactful defensive PG by a gigantic margin. If you have not seen that he is a phenomenal defender during the last 2 years then its just more evidence that you're willfully ignorant to anything that does not suit your love of Dragic.

I can't believe I'm having to do this:

Versatility:

1. capable of or adapted for turning easily from one to another of various tasks, fields of endeavor, etc.: a versatile writer.


2. having or capable of many uses: a versatile tool.



I realize I'm talking to a wall right now and that not of the stats or facts really matter when it comes to talking to you about your most hated player. But he is a GOOD offensive player a great rebounding PG and an elite defender. He does everything out there. Does he do everything at a superb level? No. But thats not what defines "versatility". He is versatile, and far more so than a guy like Dragic who, while a great offensive player, is actively hurting you during half the game with his awful defense.

Well said. Thanks for including some good facts