Phoenix, Seattle Closing in on Deal?

[NastyOne]

If this trade does go down and Barbosa is included, Don't be surprised if we select JJ Redick as his replacement.

We would add two deadly shooters in Lewis and Redick, and thats what D'Antoni wants to surround Amare with.

We could still then trade #21 and James Jones or Danny Fortson to get another pick in the Teens to select either a PG like Sergio Rodriguez/Rajon Rondo or a center like Sheldon Williams/Saer Sene/Hilton Armstrong.

 

[Gaddabout]

Rashard Lewis is a 27-year-old, 8-year veteran who only recently has been asked to be the featured player on his team. He's a 20/5 guy who, if he was forced into Marion's undersized PF role, might approach Marion's numbers based on height and athleticism, but would unlikely play the role with as much character and effort.

Lewis can be an electric shooter and scorer, although he's far from complete. He *should* be dynamic putting the ball on the floor, he just doesn't do it very much. He *should* be an All-NBA defender, but the stats are never quite complete. He *should* be one of the few SF who approaches 5 assists a game, but he's always seemed much more concerned with how he's going to get his shot off. He should be approaching 230+ lbs. and be a more versatile forward, but he's never been committed to that part of his game.

That said, I like Lewis' game and he'd be a great fit in the Suns system. Not only does he actually improve the Suns' shooting and spacing, but he also provides one more option for Steve Nash in the two-man game; Lewis can play the 4 in stretches and has legitimate low-post game. I don't believe the Suns have had a 3 in my memory that could defend the perimeter to the baseline paint like Lewis; what he's lacked in fiery motivation, he's still an above average defender for his position.

Like Marion, Lewis feasts some on put backs on the offensive boards. He will score without the ball, and he doesn't always have to be featured to go off on teams. He would be just as dynamic as Marion in the open floor, but less likely for a turnover in that situation.

The trade is not a bad one. I can't imagine the Suns getting a better trade next year, and I don't think Marion for Lewis is a fatal blow to the Suns' championship hopes. Those ride on Amare's surgically repaired knees either way. The Suns would lose something very important -- sheer effort and tenacity -- and I would question Lewis' impact on what has been the ideal locker room for almost two years now.

Those who question adding Lewis without some kind of guarantee on his contract have a valid point. Marion for a 1-year lease of Lewis is a sour deal.

 

[Gaddabout]

If this trade does go down and Barbosa is included, Don't be surprised if we select JJ Redick as his replacement.

I will personally kick D'Antoni's a** if this is actually what happens. I'd do it before the draft if I had clear affirmation the thought has crossed his mind.

 

[NastyOne]

I will personally kick D'Antoni's a** if this is actually what happens. I'd do it before the draft if I had clear affirmation the thought has crossed his mind.

Being a Duke fan, i have to say that Redick would kill on this team off the bench.

Being the star and leader of Duke, teams game planned on not letting him get any kind of open looks from three, and he still hit them with ease.

His problems come during tourney time and thats not really his fault, cause the level of competition is higher and teams really have him running all over the court trying to find a good look.

Hes not a choker, its just Duke hasnt had anyone for the last few years else that can make the other team pay on offense for trying to gameplan around Redick.

Duhon was a playmaker when he was here,Ewing wasnt a threat when he was here,Sheldon Williams finally developed a decent post game this season and McRoberts was only a freshmen.

Put Redick on North Carolina or a team like LSU or Memphis with athletic talent and he would murder from three.

Dukes entire offense relied on Redick, and opposing coaches threw everything at him so he wouldnt go off.

He looks like Reggie Miller out there running off screens trying to get away from defenders.

Put him on this team and those corner threes would be automatic night in night out.

He would lead the NBA in three point percentage.

When we go small i would love to see this lineup if we took Redick...

Nash
Redick
Bell
Lewis
Stoudemire

You either get eaten alive by Amare or surrender the wide open three.

 

[Gaddabout]

You do not use a #10 pick on a one-note player. It's that simple. If Reddick had played for any other team, he'd be discussed as someone in the teens to 20s. Compare him to Steve Nash out of college:

Nash
Height/weight: 6-3/180

Reddick
Height/weight: 6-4/190

Report on Nash: Great mid-range game and ball skills, high basketball IQ, but uncertain to find a position. Lightning quick with the ball in his hands, always finds the open man. Too slow to guard NBA points and possibly too short to play shooting guard.

Report on Reddick: Great all-around shooting and decent handle, high basketball IQ, but can't play point and will have difficulty shooting over taller NBA 2s.

Nash, with twice the offensive skills, fell to #15 -- and that was a pretty good read on him. Much of Reddick's game will disappear at the next level, so you are asking the Suns to use a lottery pick on a guy who can do one thing well, and will probably only benefit for the life of Nash's career.

If you just want a guy to stand out at the three-point line and shoot without playing much defense, I'm betting there's a veteran out there that could be had for the minimum (or near it) ... less guaranteed money on a shorter contract than the No. 10 pick. On a three-year deal, the No. 10 pick gets about $6 mil.

I suggest the Suns better find someone who can play now and do more to contribute beyond the life of Nash's career. IF (and I say BIG IF) this deal with the Sonics is in place, someone like Ronnie Brewer makes much more sense -- especially if the backup PG is included.

 

[sly fly]

A few things that stand out in this thread....

- The only site that has ANY information about this deal is DraftExpress.com. I'll wait until I see it on ESPN.com or AzCentral before I lend any merit to it. You're telling me a fan named Jonathan is more in the know than say, a Chad Ford??? Congrats to Jonathan if he did get the scoop first, though.

- J.J. Redick sure does get bashed on here a lot. I don't know about you guys, but the last few times I saw Redick... he was crossing-over defenders and pulling up on 28 footers. So what he had a sub-par tourney? Any guy that plays in arguably the toughest conference in the country and unleashes multiple 40+ games is OK in my book. Don't gve me the Casey Jacobsen crap. Redick would be golden in D'Antoni's system (re: spreading the floor for Amare).

- It's hilarious how some of you (cheesebeef) are so damn fickle. Cheese was Marion's worst critic before the Clipper series. He practically wanted to sleep with him after the Clipper series. Marion goes for his typical 18-10 during the Maverick series, and he's back to calling him a "tortilla". I love you Cheese, but you're off your rocker if you think the Suns wouldn't miss Marion over an 82 game schedule.

Marion played out-of-position the ENTIRE FRIGGIN YEAR, because of Amare's injury. KT then goes down, and Marion is expected to slide over even more. THEN, Marion is asked to guard Lamar Odom AND Elton Brand (who each have about 40 lbs/couple inches on him). Next, he's somehow supposed to muster enough strength to shut down Dirk Nowitzki (7-footer).

Remember, towards the end, PHX was basically playing with 7 guys.

Apparently, according to some of you... that wasn't good enough. Thus, time to re-attach the "tortilla" label. Nice.

Bridge the gap to the future? The future is now. Get the guys healthy, add a little depth to spell Nash, and worry about the future later.

- The only guy who is expendable (in my mid) is Tim Thomas. Thanks for the memories in the playoffs, Tim. But, we know how players "shine" in contract situations. You haven't proven that you could keep this up over an 82 game schedule, and don't think you're going to all of a sudden change.

Have fun playing with Kobe.

 

[jlove]

IF, this trade is real and goes down & Barbs (& Fortson) is a part of it, I'd love to see it go down something lke this:

Sonics receive:

Marion
Barbs
Burke
#27
(Possibily adding) Rights to Vujacic (since we'll never see him)

Suns receive:

Lewis
Fortson
Ridnour
#10


Addidng Burke or a low cost guy is the only way we can get Ridnour from Seattle. Then a followuo trade of maybe #21 and Fortson to move up to say Indy for #17 and Foster. That way Fortson never sees a Suns uni and we get another goo rebounding big.

 

[Gaddabout]

Seattle is NOT going to give up their starting PG for Pat Burke ... unless they're putting on a production of "Lord of the Dance." I doubt they would do that for Barbs.

Also, league rules prevent teams for trading a player they just acquired. There's a time period for that ... I think at least 90 days, perhaps longer. If the Suns acquire Fortson, they can't trade him until next season.

 

[NastyOne]

You do not use a #10 pick on a one-note player. It's that simple. If Reddick had played for any other team, he'd be discussed as someone in the teens to 20s. Compare him to Steve Nash out of college:

Nash
Height/weight: 6-3/180

Reddick
Height/weight: 6-4/190

Report on Nash: Great mid-range game and ball skills, high basketball IQ, but uncertain to find a position. Lightning quick with the ball in his hands, always finds the open man. Too slow to guard NBA points and possibly too short to play shooting guard.

Report on Reddick: Great all-around shooting and decent handle, high basketball IQ, but can't play point and will have difficulty shooting over taller NBA 2s.

Nash, with twice the offensive skills, fell to #15 -- and that was a pretty good read on him. Much of Reddick's game will disappear at the next level, so you are asking the Suns to use a lottery pick on a guy who can do one thing well, and will probably only benefit for the life of Nash's career.

If you just want a guy to stand out at the three-point line and shoot without playing much defense, I'm betting there's a veteran out there that could be had for the minimum (or near it) ... less guaranteed money on a shorter contract than the No. 10 pick. On a three-year deal, the No. 10 pick gets about $6 mil.

I suggest the Suns better find someone who can play now and do more to contribute beyond the life of Nash's career. IF (and I say BIG IF) this deal with the Sonics is in place, someone like Ronnie Brewer makes much more sense -- especially if the backup PG is included.

Redick's game is way better than you're giving him credit for.

Hes more of a Michael Redd clone than anything, and i would love to have Redd on this team.

Just like Redd his entire game revolves around his deadly outside shoot, and there isnt one person on this forum who wouldnt want to draft Redd if he were in this draft.

 

[Gaddabout]

- The only site that has ANY information about this deal is DraftExpress.com. I'll wait until I see it on ESPN.com or AzCentral before I lend any merit to it. You're telling me a fan named Jonathan is more in the know than say, a Chad Ford??? Congrats to Jonathan if he did get the scoop first, though.

I don't think Chad Ford has an enormous amount of credibility, either, but JG at Draft Express are usually out on a limb. I have no doubt they've spoken to many NBA types for their rumors, but I know from personal experience NBA types talk out of their [backside] as much as any fan.

I'm sure the reports out of Seattle are true -- the Sonics are looking to deal Rashard Lewis, and would probably part with the #10 pick and take back Marion and his contract to do it. But the key to all of this is none of these rumors are coming out of Phoenix -- because D'Antoni has been Marion's staunchest defender. D'Antoni has said it before -- they'll listen to any trade -- but the answer is almost assuredly "No."

So it wouldn't surprise me to learn Seattle is hopeful but unrealistic in all of this, and deluding themselves into thinking the Suns WANT to part with Marion this summer. From all indications, unless some team drops an A-bomb trade on them, they really do want Marion back next year.

 

[Gaddabout]

Hes more of a Michael Redd clone than anything, and i would love to have Redd on this team.

Redd is 6-6 about 220 and not a major liability on defense. Reddick is 6-4 about 190 and incapable of guarding another NBA 2 one-on-one. I'm sorry, I think you're looking through Duke-colored glasses on this one.

 

[Divide Et Impera]

This trade is BS. The only trades I do with SEA are as follows:

Marion/Jones/#27 for Lewis/Fortson/Petro/#10

Marion/Barbosa/#27 for Lewis/Ridnour/Petro/#10

If Barbosa is anywhere near this trade, we'd BETTER be getting Ridnour....

 

[jlove]

Seattle is NOT going to give up their starting PG for Pat Burke ... unless they're putting on a production of "Lord of the Dance." I doubt they would do that for Barbs.

Also, league rules prevent teams for trading a player they just acquired. There's a time period for that ... I think at least 90 days, perhaps longer. If the Suns acquire Fortson, they can't trade him until next season.

Yes, I know, however, you immediately make it a 3 team deal getting Fortson elsewhere.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Reddick will NOT be the Suns pick at 10, I will guarantee that.

Jonathan isn't just "some fan".....

He is a legitimate scout, works for several international teams for their NCAA scouting - and is in constant contact with NBA front office people. I know for a fact he has contacts in the Suns.

Him posting it doesn't mean it is going to happen, but I put more stock in a rumor posted by him than almost any other source.

 

[Gaddabout]

Reddick will NOT be the Suns pick at 10, I will guarantee that.

Jonathan isn't just "some fan".....

He is a legitimate scout, works for several international teams for their NCAA scouting - and is in constant contact with NBA front office people. I know for a fact he has contacts in the Suns.

Him posting it doesn't mean it is going to happen, but I put more stock in a rumor posted by him than almost any other source.

The question is which front office people.

Good NBA sources:
Head coaches
GMs
(To a lesser extent) Player agents
(To an even lesser extent) Media rep

NBA sources that will make you look foolish if you publish what they tell you:
Assistant coaches
Trainers
NBA league office employees
Scouts (the worst offenders)

This is why I always put big conditionals on anything I report from my friends and acquaintances in the NBA. Most of them are more full of Sugar Honey Ice Tea than anyone on this board, including me.

 

[NastyOne]

Redd is 6-6 about 220 and not a major liability on defense. Reddick is 6-4 about 190 and incapable of guarding another NBA 2 one-on-one. I'm sorry, I think you're looking through Duke-colored glasses on this one.

When Redd came out of OSU he was 6'6 205lbs, and he was not a good defender.

You're expecting Redick to come into the NBA and not improve other aspects of his game at all?

Guys get better at things as they get more experience in the pros.

And i can name a boatload of tweeners in the NBA that are only known for their scoring.And some of them are allstars.

 

[Espo]

I was just listening to ESPN radio this morning and they were talking about this as a possible trade and "credible" rumor. I am not sure if I like the deal or not. I think Lewis' shooting ability would bring yet another weapon to this offense.

 

[Gaddabout]

When Redd came out of OSU he was 6'6 205lbs, and he was not a good defender.

You're expecting Redick to come into the NBA and not improve other aspects of his game at all?

I'm saying Redd was clearly capable of being a better defender, Redick is not. Redd is still twice the athlete, built more like Walter Davis. Actually, Redd reminds me a lot of Walter Davis. Redick is Kyle Korver with some dribble moves.

 

[NastyOne]

I'm saying Redd was clearly capable of being a better defender, Redick is not. Redd is still twice the athlete, built more like Walter Davis. Actually, Redd reminds me a lot of Walter Davis. Redick is Kyle Korver with some dribble moves.

Once again you're not giving Redick any kind of credit.

Redd is not that much better of an athlete than Redick, He has more size and thats it.

Redick will probably get up to around 205lbs when a NBA trainer gets ahold of him.

Redd was also not thought of highly coming out of OSU since he did fall into the middle of the second round in 2000.

He had to make some big improvements in his game to get where he is today.

IMO Redicks potential is the finished product of Michael Redd.

At worst hes a better version of Steve Kerr.

 

[Treesquid PhD]

I'm saying Redd was clearly capable of being a better defender, Redick is not. Redd is still twice the athlete, built more like Walter Davis. Actually, Redd reminds me a lot of Walter Davis. Redick is Kyle Korver with some dribble moves.

If JJ Redick is another Kyle Korver then I am with you.

Lewis is a great player and I could see why D'Antoni would want him, but again I don't think this is going to happen.

To another posters point, I certainly don't think the Suns would try to add 2 college players onto this team next season, their money is garaunteed and they offer nothing in their first year. I remember all the posters telling me that Thompson would make a contribution next season, well like the other 99% of rookies they don't in their first season, and especially not on a top 4 NBA team.

 

[panfolk]

i think ridnour is about as untouchable as they come.

Luke was battling with Earl Watson for minutes towards the end of the season IIRC. Petro is the one I'd call untouchable on the Sonics.

 

[George O'Brien]

One of the points I made was that I was focused on whether someone was a good fit for the Suns. Even if Redick might someday become a good defender, he isn't now.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

No we had to throw those in so that they would take him off our hands. I didn't say the Suns wouldn't make trades to clear cap space. I said that the Suns trading away a player who couldn't get off the bench is much different then trading a player who is a 20-10 guy and the 3rd best rebounder in the NBA.

your implication was that in one trade (the marion trade) we were giving up valuable assets and in the other we didn't give anything up. we did. two first round draft picks. that's how they're comparable. the suns org has shown that they are willing to give up valuable assets for monetary considerations. at least, that's what the original discussion centered on. and that's why you're wrong.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Rashard Lewis is a 27-year-old, 8-year veteran who only recently has been asked to be the featured player on his team. He's a 20/5 guy who, if he was forced into Marion's undersized PF role, might approach Marion's numbers based on height and athleticism, but would unlikely play the role with as much character and effort.

Lewis can be an electric shooter and scorer, although he's far from complete. He *should* be dynamic putting the ball on the floor, he just doesn't do it very much. He *should* be an All-NBA defender, but the stats are never quite complete. He *should* be one of the few SF who approaches 5 assists a game, but he's always seemed much more concerned with how he's going to get his shot off. He should be approaching 230+ lbs. and be a more versatile forward, but he's never been committed to that part of his game.

That said, I like Lewis' game and he'd be a great fit in the Suns system. Not only does he actually improve the Suns' shooting and spacing, but he also provides one more option for Steve Nash in the two-man game; Lewis can play the 4 in stretches and has legitimate low-post game. I don't believe the Suns have had a 3 in my memory that could defend the perimeter to the baseline paint like Lewis; what he's lacked in fiery motivation, he's still an above average defender for his position.

Like Marion, Lewis feasts some on put backs on the offensive boards. He will score without the ball, and he doesn't always have to be featured to go off on teams. He would be just as dynamic as Marion in the open floor, but less likely for a turnover in that situation.

The trade is not a bad one. I can't imagine the Suns getting a better trade next year, and I don't think Marion for Lewis is a fatal blow to the Suns' championship hopes. Those ride on Amare's surgically repaired knees either way. The Suns would lose something very important -- sheer effort and tenacity -- and I would question Lewis' impact on what has been the ideal locker room for almost two years now.

Those who question adding Lewis without some kind of guarantee on his contract have a valid point. Marion for a 1-year lease of Lewis is a sour deal.

i think gad states it perfectly.

 

[devilalum]

If JJ Redick is another Kyle Korver then I am with you.

Lewis is a great player and I could see why D'Antoni would want him, but again I don't think this is going to happen.

To another posters point, I certainly don't think the Suns would try to add 2 college players onto this team next season, their money is garaunteed and they offer nothing in their first year. I remember all the posters telling me that Thompson would make a contribution next season, well like the other 99% of rookies they don't in their first season, and especially not on a top 4 NBA team.

Rookies don't contribute much but you do have to continually develop young players.

I don't like the idea of trading Marion but if they are determined to save the money why not forget about the picks?

Marion and LB
for
Lewis and Ridnour

Then the Suns can still try to package their 2 picks to move up a little.