Rockets @ Suns game thread 1-12-18

[Hoop Head]

And the Warriors are really good now... and the Spurs are also still pretty good. And either one of them will probably continue to brick wall the Rockets as long as they are playing D'Antoni's patented anti-defense/short rotation style... that has and never will win any meaningful playoff series ever.

I'm glad D'Antoni's teams consistently took down the Lakers. That helped cushion the eventual loss to the Spurs. I wish they wouldn't have made the Shaq/Marion trade though until they had a different coach here, Shaq was a bad fit for D'Antoni's style and I think there's a chance Gentry could have taken the Nash, Amare, and Marion team further than D'Antoni did at the end, losing to the Spurs in the 1st round during his last year, making the Shaq trade look that much worse since he was acquired to help get past a team like the Spurs.

There were other options at Centers to try and force onto D'Antoni that could have been possible without losing Marion, who was a big piece of why those Suns teams worked with D'Antoni's style. I think that trade was more removing the small ball option from D'Antoni than adding pieces to help the team get further in the playoffs.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Not only that, but they were also missing three rotation players. Suns are not a deep team to begin with, and they were missing their best point guard, their best power forward, and their best defender.

And the Rockets were missing an MVP candidate.

 

[hcsilla]

The Rockets are a more balanced team this season so we shall see.

Not only more balanced, but also better. When they were at full strentgh, they seemed a legit contender and maybe even more.

The key was that they became a top defensive team as well by adding Tucker and Mbah-a-Moute.

Then injuries to Paul, Mbah-a-Moute, Capela and Harden ruined their momentum but when everyone was healthy they sure looked like a team that can get past the Warriors.

 

[Phrazbit]

Glad to see Dumas with the team, hopefully he's doing better now. That guy had so much talent, definitely one of those "what if" sort of situations. He could have been the face of the franchise as Barkley and KJ got older.

Well, he isn't in prison, which is better than his trajectory had him going.

 

[Phrazbit]

A few notes on this game.

Alex Len has rapidly reverted back into a guy who gets swatted on easy dunks, has bricks for hands and the attention span of an infant on defense. I'm legit bummed. I'd love to be wrong about him, he looked good for a hot minute there.

Mike D'Antoni is still so very very Mike D. This game was essentially over by half time, despite that Mike used what was essentially a 7 man rotation... to blow out a bad team... in January... and I'm sure in April/May he is going to be stunned at his "bad luck" when his players are going down with popped tendons and worn out hamstrings.

And finally... we desperately need to get Booker some help. Not saying it has to happen right now, but good lord I feel bad for the kid. He is, right now, a freaking super-duperstar. You could put him on any team in this league and he'd be a monster. Barring tragedy, this guy is going to the hall of fame. He's in his 3rd season and I feel comfortable saying he is the best player the Suns have ever drafted. I dunno what his parallel is, it probably does not exist. If I had to compare him to modern players I'd say he is some sort of mix of Harden and Kobe... and I don't think that is hyperbole. On the right team, with the right coach, this guy is going to be a perennial MVP candidate.

Please please please, gods of basketball, hear my prayer; "let us be the right team, let us find the right coach".

 

[SirStefan32]

And the Rockets were missing an MVP candidate.

I wasn't talking about the Rockets. They are obviously a better team, even without Harden. I am far more interested in how the Suns are playing than anything else. Good teams can be good without their best player. Bad teams look really bad without three rotation players.

 

[devilalum]

Bender needs to work on in his inside game throughout the postseason. He's got a good shot from outside and that's coming along fine but the misses inside are embarrassing. He's shooting just 33% from 3-10 feet, which is awful.

I think you mean off season. My crystal ball says no “postseason” in the Suns immediate future.


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[CardsSunsDbacks]

Bender needs to work on in his inside game throughout the postseason. He's got a good shot from outside and that's coming along fine but the misses inside are embarrassing. He's shooting just 33% from 3-10 feet, which is awful.

LeBron is shooting 38% from that range, Steph Curry 39% and Harden a whopping 29% from that range. 33% from 3-10 feet is probably average at worst.

Now if you want to point out his mere 50% from 0-3 feet than I can agree it needs work, but plenty of even very good players have low percentages from 3-10 feet.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

He may be a tall guard but that doesn't excuse missing so many shots inside. If he's taking them then he should be making around 50%, someone his size who isn't getting their shots blocked should be shooting those at a much higher percentage. He's only shooting 50% from 0-3 feet, add that to the 33% from 3-10 feet, and he's 0% from 10-16 feet and that says something about him, not how he's being used.


I'm getting those stats from Basketball-Reference, here is the link. Here is a look at them, for those interested.

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The 0% from 10-16 is a bit misleading as that is on something like 0-2 on the whole season. It is more interesting that he has only taken a couple shots in that range all year as opposed to his shooting percentage from there.

 

[SirStefan32]

The 0% from 10-16 is a bit misleading as that is on something like 0-2 on the whole season. It is more interesting that he has only taken a couple shots in that range all year as opposed to his shooting percentage from there.

I was curious as to the sample size. Bender doesn't take many shots, and I would guess that two thirds are from beyond the three-point line. It doesn't change the fact he needs to get better, but I don't think it's as bad as the stats suggest. Without looking it up, I would be shocked if he's taken hundred shots inside the three-point line.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I was curious as to the sample size. Bender doesn't take many shots, and I would guess that two thirds are from beyond the three-point line. It doesn't change the fact he needs to get better, but I don't think it's as bad as the stats suggest. Without looking it up, I would be shocked if he's taken hundred shots inside the three-point line.

He has taken 232 total shots. Only 4 from 10-16 feet, 9 from 16+ and 161 3s. 70% of his shot attempts are from 3 and 25% are from 10 feet and in. Doesn’t do hardly anything in between.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm glad D'Antoni's teams consistently took down the Lakers. That helped cushion the eventual loss to the Spurs. I wish they wouldn't have made the Shaq/Marion trade though until they had a different coach here, Shaq was a bad fit for D'Antoni's style and I think there's a chance Gentry could have taken the Nash, Amare, and Marion team further than D'Antoni did at the end, losing to the Spurs in the 1st round during his last year, making the Shaq trade look that much worse since he was acquired to help get past a team like the Spurs.

There were other options at Centers to try and force onto D'Antoni that could have been possible without losing Marion, who was a big piece of why those Suns teams worked with D'Antoni's style. I think that trade was more removing the small ball option from D'Antoni than adding pieces to help the team get further in the playoffs.

The trade for Shaq was indeed a mistake. Marion was the better fit for the Suns and he went on to have a number of productive seasons with Dallas.

Surprisingly a lot of Suns fans were glad to see him go because he never fit the mode the Suns wanted for a PF. In today's game he would excel at this position.

 

[Mainstreet]

And the Warriors are really good now... and the Spurs are also still pretty good. And either one of them will probably continue to brick wall the Rockets as long as they are playing D'Antoni's patented anti-defense/short rotation style... that has and never will win any meaningful playoff series ever.

A lot of teams did not get past the Warriors and Spurs. Anyway, it's in the past for the Suns.

 

[Mainstreet]

Not only more balanced, but also better. When they were at full strentgh, they seemed a legit contender and maybe even more.

The key was that they became a top defensive team as well by adding Tucker and Mbah-a-Moute.

Then injuries to Paul, Mbah-a-Moute, Capela and Harden ruined their momentum but when everyone was healthy they sure looked like a team that can get past the Warriors.

I agree, the Rockets look to be improved. Still the Warriors are the team to beat as they have won the last three NBA Championships. I'd like to see a Warriors- Rockets match-up with the Rockets winning. It would be exciting and good for the game.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

I agree, the Rockets look to be improved. Still the Warriors are the team to beat as they have won the last three NBA Championships. I'd like to see a Warriors- Rockets match-up with the Rockets winning. It would be exciting and good for the game.

2 of the last 3*

 

[GatorAZ]

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[Mainstreet]

2 of the last 3*

Hiccup. Cavaliers in the middle. What should have been.

 

[JustWinBaby]

You mean when they get tired of winning?

It is really amazing how ignorant posters on this board are. They continue to bash a coach, at every opportunity, that had tremendous success and brought unbelievable excitement to this franchise.

Yeah it was really boring winning 60 games each year. It was just horrible to deal with all those WCF losses.

We surely do not have any of those unbearable atrocities to deal with in our near future.

The Rockets just can't get anyone that wants to play for that horrible coach. I would dump him.

I really hope the rumor comes true and Lebron ends up in Houston next year. They might go undefeated.

I am glad Gerald Green ended up there. He is perfect for them and they are perfect for him.

Houston happens to have a real GM and a real owner. That is why MDA has a job.

 

[JustWinBaby]

I'm glad D'Antoni's teams consistently took down the Lakers. That helped cushion the eventual loss to the Spurs. I wish they wouldn't have made the Shaq/Marion trade though until they had a different coach here, Shaq was a bad fit for D'Antoni's style and I think there's a chance Gentry could have taken the Nash, Amare, and Marion team further than D'Antoni did at the end, losing to the Spurs in the 1st round during his last year, making the Shaq trade look that much worse since he was acquired to help get past a team like the Spurs.

There were other options at Centers to try and force onto D'Antoni that could have been possible without losing Marion, who was a big piece of why those Suns teams worked with D'Antoni's style. I think that trade was more removing the small ball option from D'Antoni than adding pieces to help the team get further in the playoffs.

You have lost all credibility when you think that Gentry is a better coach than MDA. I like Gentry as a person but he is a marginal coach at best and has been fired multiple times and will get fired this off season if not sooner with a pretty good roster in New Orleans.

If Amare had stayed healthy after Shaq was acquired for Marion, who knows what might have happened that first year. We were nearly unbeatable with a healthy Amare and Shaq together. Then Amare got hurt again. Gentry's main success was with a healthy Amare in a contract year along with several other players having career years.

The biggest problems then and now in Phoenix is our management group.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Yes, it is nostalgic to see the introduction of the

It is really amazing how ignorant posters on this board are. They continue to bash a coach, at every opportunity, that had tremendous success and brought unbelievable excitement to this franchise.

Yeah it was really boring winning 60 games each year. It was just horrible to deal with all those WCF losses.

We surely do not have any of those unbearable atrocities to deal with in our near future.

The Rockets just can't get anyone that wants to play for that horrible coach. I would dump him.

I really hope the rumor comes true and Lebron ends up in Houston next year. They might go undefeated.

I am glad Gerald Green ended up there. He is perfect for them and they are perfect for him.

Houston happens to have a real GM and a real owner. That is why MDA has a job.

I loved DAntoni and the style of play. I just hated his short rotations. He was really good, but if he was not so stubborn, he could have been even better. Steve Kerr proved it.

 

[Hoop Head]

You have lost all credibility when you think that Gentry is a better coach than MDA. I like Gentry as a person but he is a marginal coach at best and has been fired multiple times and will get fired this off season if not sooner with a pretty good roster in New Orleans.

If Amare had stayed healthy after Shaq was acquired for Marion, who knows what might have happened that first year. We were nearly unbeatable with a healthy Amare and Shaq together. Then Amare got hurt again. Gentry's main success was with a healthy Amare in a contract year along with several other players having career years.

The biggest problems then and now in Phoenix is our management group.

Gentry was willing to use more than 7 players and also had the team playing defense. He was a better coach for the Suns than D'Antoni was. Since they've left they're pretty even, with D'Antoni being awful until arriving in Houston and Gentry being a solid assistant and average head coach. He's coaching a very lopsided New Orleans team and their faults don't fall on him as much as their GM.

 

[Mainstreet]

It is really amazing how ignorant posters on this board are. They continue to bash a coach, at every opportunity, that had tremendous success and brought unbelievable excitement to this franchise.

Yeah it was really boring winning 60 games each year. It was just horrible to deal with all those WCF losses.

We surely do not have any of those unbearable atrocities to deal with in our near future.

The Rockets just can't get anyone that wants to play for that horrible coach. I would dump him.

I really hope the rumor comes true and Lebron ends up in Houston next year. They might go undefeated.

I am glad Gerald Green ended up there. He is perfect for them and they are perfect for him.

Houston happens to have a real GM and a real owner. That is why MDA has a job.

I was waiting for your post. We might be the only two D'Antoni supporters on the forum.

However, I don't think anyone can question DA has changed the game.

 

[3rdside]

I was waiting for your post. We might be the only two D'Antoni supporters on the forum.

However, I don't think anyone can question DA has changed the game.

Count me as three - guy is a coaching genius in one sense, being so far ahead of his time. So glad he’s got a chance to compete again with compatible talent.


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[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Dantoni definitely had his pluses and minuses. His +1 plus far outweighs his minuses but his minuses might be what stands between him and a championship.

Pluses:
Offensive genius
Good at identifying talent that fits his scheme
Likable

Minuses:
Dangerously short rotations
Ignores defense
Inflexibility
Sideline histrionics

 

[Cheesebeef]

Count me as three - guy is a coaching genius in one sense, being so far ahead of his time. So glad he’s got a chance to compete again with compatible talent.


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A genius knows how to adjust. DA doesn’t.

Not to mention he’s never even been to a Finals, much less won one.

He’s a good coach, straddling on the fence of being very good, but genius? No.