Star Wars: The Force Awakens (Episode VII)

Covert Rain

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I still want to see it again. I just watched 4-6 last week. The charm, character buildup and banter was just missing from this one or needs to be experienced as a whole. I read up on the prior 30 years and that helped a little.
I wanted to like all the characters but it was thrown together a little too much for me too quickly. I have no probs with them re doing a new hope but the new characters didn't pull it off. Rey being Luke/leia as one needed more back story or a scene of her looking out onto a desolate dual sun for me to feel any of her wants.. Finn as the new Han just didn't pull it off and needed better banter with Rey.
They just missed on so many things that made the first one so special. Didn't even get close to it.

Wow...really....we must have been watching the opposite movie. The new characters were fantastic and actually the strongest part of the film. Also, don't agree we need much back story either. Aside from Luke in ANH, no other characters had back stories. For example Vader and Obi became insanely popular after the first film and nobody knew squat about them. Even Han and Chewbacca was sort of...hey we are smugglers who owe a debt..that's it. Had no clue where he came from, what kind of smuggler he was, let along know squat about Chewbacca after that movie. Yet again, insanely popular after that movie. There are multiple stories from the actors after filming Star Wars that they still didn't know much about the story, who their characters were and what the movie was really about.
 
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I loved it. No complaints whatsoever. Only negative is having to wait for VIII.
 

Covert Rain

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I loved it. No complaints whatsoever. Only negative is having to wait for VIII.

I only had two small issues really. One was Starkiller base and the other was how Rey held her own against Kylo. However, I just read an interesting theory that might make one of those issues go away for me. The theory is, Rey was left there by Luke. Not necessarily because she is his daughter (although they didn't rule that out) but because she was also a Padawan in training and Luke was hiding her just like Obi did for him because of the slaughter of the Jedi by the Knights of Ren.

We know they start training them when they are kids. I guess that theory would make sense that at least she had some training as a kid. It would definitely make that entire scene more palatable for me. I hope it's true because that makes the film that much better for me.

Technically I had one other small issue but it's really not an issue per say. I didn't like the design of Snoke at all. It just reminds me of Gollum's big brother. I hope it's just a Wizard of OZ thing (man behind the curtain) and Snoke is something else. That's my hope at least. I just don't want another CGI driven main character.
 

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I only had two small issues really. One was Starkiller base and the other was how Rey held her own against Kylo. However, I just read an interesting theory that might make one of those issues go away for me. The theory is, Rey was left there by Luke. Not necessarily because she is his daughter (although they didn't rule that out) but because she was also a Padawan in training and Luke was hiding her just like Obi did for him because of the slaughter of the Jedi by the Knights of Ren.

I think the crux of that theory is essentially true, although the bigger question is how she doesn't remember being a Padawan. They actually never touched on her past, other than give subtle hints to it, like the Jedi stuff and her wearing the X-Wing pilot helmet (which I thought is a reference to her parentage by Luke, but of course could be a misdirection). Is mind wiping something we've seen before in Star Wars? I don't recall.
 

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I wanted that first 20 minutes to blow me away but never happened so I was fighting the movie the whole time.

Not a big lore guy.. Not sure who fought but if they had started with the battle of jakku that would have been amazing. Skip forward to Rey and maybe her finding something on the destroyer that leads to the search for sky walker.
 

Covert Rain

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I think the crux of that theory is essentially true, although the bigger question is how she doesn't remember being a Padawan. They actually never touched on her past, other than give subtle hints to it, like the Jedi stuff and her wearing the X-Wing pilot helmet (which I thought is a reference to her parentage by Luke, but of course could be a misdirection). Is mind wiping something we've seen before in Star Wars? I don't recall.

Good Point. I don't recall that either but I would have to imagine that if you can have an "awakening" with the Force by putting images into someone's head, it's logical to assume someone out there could take them out. I think Luke's daughter thing is a good theory but it seems like they are putting that on a silver platter a little to neatly for us fans. I think it could be a misdirection or maybe fans are just to damn intuitive now to miss details.

Let's not forget, it seems like we get hints that Kylo knows who she is. At least that's how I took it. Maybe he knows Luke hid the lone survivor of the massacre all those years ago. Seems to me Kylo's other obsession (besides Vader) quickly becomes Rey. That makes sense if she is either Luke's daughter or the lone survivor of the Jedi massacre found at last.
 
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Bert

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I saw it again last night cuz I wanted to see it at the IMAX before it was too late.

Some thoughts about Kylo. Some spoilers here but I think we might be getting past spoiler tags.

I actually think that for the first half of the movie Kylo was super scary. I mean, his resume is every bit as daunting as vaders (considering that at the time ANH came out, we didn't know that Vader had slaughtered all the Jedi including the younglings)

He starts the movie by murdering a defenseless old man who apparently has known him for a long time. Then he orders the slaughter of the innocent villagers. He has the same kind of head butting with the General that Vader had and the general is obviously a little afraid of him. He flips out showing that he is a total psycho and chokes the dude with the force. And, I actually thought the scene where he is torturing Po is like, awesome. That was actually more graphic than anything Vader ever did and Po does an amazing acting job there.

What makes Kylo not scary is the whole crying to Vaders mask thing and basically EVERYTHING after he takes off the mask. The second he takes off the mask its like whaaaaat? This wimp is the villain?

But, I believe that it was deliberate to soften that character. Because he basically is a huge poser. People have called him a fanboy which I think is a great description. I think if you told JJ Abrams; that villain sucked he was basically a fanboy. JJ might say; Sweet, that's exactly what I was going for! I believe it was all deliberate and just might require a little patience on our part to see how it all shakes out in the rest of the series..

From wearing the mask he doesn't need, letting his guard down by to trying to convert Rey. (remember he was under orders to bring her to Snoke, not kill her. And he basically has her defeated before she went on force steroids.) :) He's trying to convince everyone including himself that he is this big bad villain and he is obviously an entitled little child in many ways. But I maintain that this movie may all part of him turning into one of the worst villains we've ever seen. His psychosis and his desperation to prove himself has caused him to murder those closest to him and now that he has passed Snokes test of killing you know who, the reigns might be off this guy and we will see where he goes from here.

One question I would love answered is why does the Dark side always obsess about the Jedi so much? Going back to the old ones they are constantly raving about how much better the darkside is than the light, but they obviously fear the Jedi and are obsessed about taking them out. I mean, Snoke fears Luke so much that he made it Kylos main task to find him and kill him because he believes that the simple fact of Luke being found will bring rise to the New Jedi Order which will obviously be a huge threat to them.

This is why I think that the departure from the original mcgufffin was intentional. Hux feels like I do, he's not particularly concerned with finding Luke, he's all about the weapon. He obviously dislikes Kylo and see's through his facade as this big baddie and has zero respect for him outside of a moderate amount of fear. Hux finally gets his way to use the weapon and takes a moment to give Kylo that (deez nuts) look before leaving. LoL ;)

Just some of my thoughts, not looking for an argument or anything. :)

Is this set up like another trilogy or is it an open ended thing?

Regardless of how we all felt about this one, I think we'd like them to keep em coming. It's better than 90% of the other garbage and look how much discussion it has prompted! Its fun going back and forth with everyone and hearing peoples critiques etc. I like it.
 
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Brian in Mesa

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I only had two small issues really. One was Starkiller base and the other was how Rey held her own against Kylo. However, I just read an interesting theory that might make one of those issues go away for me. The theory is, Rey was left there by Luke. Not necessarily because she is his daughter (although they didn't rule that out) but because she was also a Padawan in training and Luke was hiding her just like Obi did for him because of the slaughter of the Jedi by the Knights of Ren.

We know they start training them when they are kids. I guess that theory would make sense that at least she had some training as a kid. It would definitely make that entire scene more palatable for me. I hope it's true because that makes the film that much better for me.

Technically I had one other small issue but it's really not an issue per say. I didn't like the design of Snoke at all. It just reminds me of Gollum's big brother. I hope it's just a Wizard of OZ thing (man behind the curtain) and Snoke is something else. That's my hope at least. I just don't want another CGI driven main character.

There is another theory or possibly a mix of both...

 

jf-08

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I don't know if this has been mentioned, but has anyone thought of Rey being in the Kenobi family? Perhaps his granddaughter?
 

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I don't know if this has been mentioned, but has anyone thought of Rey being in the Kenobi family? Perhaps his granddaughter?

Does Finn have the force? If so where did he get it? Samuel Jackson?
 

Covert Rain

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Cheesebeef

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Definitely a possibility. Am I the only one that got the vibe that Kylo's interest in Rey wasn't just casual or coincidental?!?!

no. IMO, they made it a pretty clear point, that he knew of her. I mean, he freaks out when the guy says the droid has left Jakku with Fin and "some girl". He then says WHAT GIRL? As if he knows there's something more there before they cut out of the scene.
 

Bert

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I don't know if this has been mentioned, but has anyone thought of Rey being in the Kenobi family? Perhaps his granddaughter?

I read an interesting theory on this the other day. I think there might be merit to it. I maintain that Rey might be something we have never seen before. It is alluded to alot in the movie. People spend almost the whole movie being notably amazed by the things she can do. Even Han, who has seen some pretty incredible force feats in his day. Have to believe that is deliberate.

I loved all the subtle storytelling with Rey. I thought it was awesome film making. From the moment we see her she's obviously special and can do things and go places that other scavengers cant go. Then the scene where she is cleaning her parts up, she pauses and looks at the old woman as though she is seeing her future thinking (god, is that how I'm going to end up? Old and wrinkled and still here waiting?) Then the scene with her sitting there watching the rockets take off, donning the Pilots helmet and even choosing the walker as her home, it's clear that she is drawn to all these things and she doesnt even know why. The way her eyes light up when she finds out that Fin is allegedly part of the resistance. She is so attracted to the fight she can hardly contain herself, but she is torn apart because she wants to hold on to hope that someone is coming back for her. Even though she has clearly led a hard knock life where she has had to scratch and claw to survive, she still has compassion for a little droid and can sense that he is somehow important, even more important than her own survival. (turning down the extra portions.)

I thought her character development was brilliant though not completely overt.
 

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I read an interesting theory on this the other day. I think there might be merit to it. I maintain that Rey might be something we have never seen before. It is alluded to alot in the movie. People spend almost the whole movie being notably amazed by the things she can do. Even Han, who has seen some pretty incredible force feats in his day. Have to believe that is deliberate.

I loved all the subtle storytelling with Rey. I thought it was awesome film making. From the moment we see her she's obviously special and can do things and go places that other scavengers cant go. Then the scene where she is cleaning her parts up, she pauses and looks at the old woman as though she is seeing her future thinking (god, is that how I'm going to end up? Old and wrinkled and still here waiting?) Then the scene with her sitting there watching the rockets take off, donning the Pilots helmet and even choosing the walker as her home, it's clear that she is drawn to all these things and she doesnt even know why. The way her eyes light up when she finds out that Fin is allegedly part of the resistance. She is so attracted to the fight she can hardly contain herself, but she is torn apart because she wants to hold on to hope that someone is coming back for her. Even though she has clearly led a hard knock life where she has had to scratch and claw to survive, she still has compassion for a little droid and can sense that he is somehow important, even more important than her own survival. (turning down the extra portions.)

I thought her character development was brilliant though not completely overt.

Rey was easily the best part of the movie for me. She was a protagonist that I definitely look forward to watching in the future. And that was the most important thing Awakens needed to do.
 

Chaplin

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I read an interesting theory on this the other day. I think there might be merit to it. I maintain that Rey might be something we have never seen before. It is alluded to alot in the movie. People spend almost the whole movie being notably amazed by the things she can do. Even Han, who has seen some pretty incredible force feats in his day. Have to believe that is deliberate.

I loved all the subtle storytelling with Rey. I thought it was awesome film making. From the moment we see her she's obviously special and can do things and go places that other scavengers cant go. Then the scene where she is cleaning her parts up, she pauses and looks at the old woman as though she is seeing her future thinking (god, is that how I'm going to end up? Old and wrinkled and still here waiting?) Then the scene with her sitting there watching the rockets take off, donning the Pilots helmet and even choosing the walker as her home, it's clear that she is drawn to all these things and she doesnt even know why. The way her eyes light up when she finds out that Fin is allegedly part of the resistance. She is so attracted to the fight she can hardly contain herself, but she is torn apart because she wants to hold on to hope that someone is coming back for her. Even though she has clearly led a hard knock life where she has had to scratch and claw to survive, she still has compassion for a little droid and can sense that he is somehow important, even more important than her own survival. (turning down the extra portions.)

I thought her character development was brilliant though not completely overt.

Midichlorians! Yeah!
 

Covert Rain

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I read an interesting theory on this the other day. I think there might be merit to it. I maintain that Rey might be something we have never seen before. It is alluded to alot in the movie. People spend almost the whole movie being notably amazed by the things she can do. Even Han, who has seen some pretty incredible force feats in his day. Have to believe that is deliberate.

I loved all the subtle storytelling with Rey. I thought it was awesome film making. From the moment we see her she's obviously special and can do things and go places that other scavengers cant go. Then the scene where she is cleaning her parts up, she pauses and looks at the old woman as though she is seeing her future thinking (god, is that how I'm going to end up? Old and wrinkled and still here waiting?) Then the scene with her sitting there watching the rockets take off, donning the Pilots helmet and even choosing the walker as her home, it's clear that she is drawn to all these things and she doesnt even know why. The way her eyes light up when she finds out that Fin is allegedly part of the resistance. She is so attracted to the fight she can hardly contain herself, but she is torn apart because she wants to hold on to hope that someone is coming back for her. Even though she has clearly led a hard knock life where she has had to scratch and claw to survive, she still has compassion for a little droid and can sense that he is somehow important, even more important than her own survival. (turning down the extra portions.)

I thought her character development was brilliant though not completely overt.

Honestly, her character done wrong could have derailed the entire movie. To me despite all the parts of the plot and characters, Star Wars future success hinged on fans getting behind the new characters. I found myself cheering and rooting for Rey almost from the start. Same with Finn.
 

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Honestly, her character done wrong could have derailed the entire movie. To me despite all the parts of the plot and characters, Star Wars future success hinged on fans getting behind the new characters. I found myself cheering and rooting for Rey almost from the start. Same with Finn.

I'm looking forward to the flashback when baby Finn is taken from his father Lando.
 

Covert Rain

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I'm looking forward to the flashback when baby Finn is taken from his father Lando.

I would buy that he is Lando's illegitimate child he knew nothing about that was taken. After all, Lando was a space pimp with the ladies. Something tells me he visited many space ports in his day.
 
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SO91

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no. IMO, they made it a pretty clear point, that he knew of her. I mean, he freaks out when the guy says the droid has left Jakku with Fin and "some girl". He then says WHAT GIRL? As if he knows there's something more there before they cut out of the scene.

Perhaps she was training to be a Jedi, and the ultimate Vader fanboy, with bootleg lightsaber and all couldn't bring himself to kill his cousin at the time.
 

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I don't know why we need spoiler tags on speculation about a character's origins. You aren't spoiling anything. You are making stuff up.

:D

I am going to speculate that the Emperor and Padme's handmaiden (Keira Knightly) bond over being from the same planet. They had a secret affair that resulted in a love child (a daughter). Then, she is kidnapped, raised by the Hutts, and then procreates with Boba Fett after he escapes the Sarlacc. Their spawn is half-Sith, half clone.

Her mom and dad train her to be self-sufficient, a pilot, and a general bad-ass. Maybe mom tosses in some Force training too. She has a tendency to embrace the light side of the Force, so she is really half-Jedi at this point.

Then one day, Rey hears an old recording of her grandpa issuing Order 66 and her clone half tries to kill her Jedi half, causing a complete psychotic break and amnesia.

When we meet her, she thinks she is waiting for her parents to come back or something, but really, they ditched her crazy ass on a desert planet so they could go all "Dog the Bounty Hunter" throughout the Galaxy without some stupid drooling mental patient cramping their style.
 
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