Suns 2024-2025 Season Discussions

[95pro]

One can't help but notice the Suns are loaded at point guard with Tyus Jones, Monte Morris, Collin Gillespie (TW) and Ty TY Washington (TW).

At some point, I think Gillespie will be playing in the NBA this season. He looks solid.

The suns weren't even trying it seems while sticking with Saben, adding the g-league team allows us to expand our potential greatly.

 

[Mainstreet]

The suns weren't even trying it seems while sticking with Saben, adding the g-league team allows us to expand our potential greatly.

Yes, the Suns were active completing their G-League roster and adding some solid prospects on two-way contracts.

It's interesting how their focus has been on adding point guards. It's completely different from last season. Bud, probably had an impact on this.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Yes, the Suns were active completing their G-League roster and adding some solid prospects on two-way contracts.

It's interesting how their focus has been on adding point guards. It's completely different from last season. Bud, probably had an impact on this.

Maybe but I'm really hoping that the 23-24 season had even more to do with the PG focus this offseason. Because, if they haven't learned from that mistake...

 

[Hoop Head]

Maybe but I'm really hoping that the 23-24 season had even more to do with the PG focus this offseason. Because, if they haven't learned from that mistake...

Go back further, pre bubble run. We didn't have a PG from when Bledsoe was dealt until we traded TJ for Rubio right before the 2020 season. There were 3 seasons without a real PG. James Jones was here for that. He thought trading for Tyler Johnson would make a difference. He also waived Austin Rivers, who I don't care for but could have helped as an actual PG. I blame part of Chriss and Bender's lack of development on not having a legit NBA starting caliber PG.

 

[95pro]

Maybe but I'm really hoping that the 23-24 season had even more to do with the PG focus this offseason. Because, if they haven't learned from that mistake...

Could be some long-term strategy. Jones and Morris likely on one and done deals, so we are looking to keep Book as sg and not re-do point Book again, again.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Go back further, pre bubble run. We didn't have a PG from when Bledsoe was dealt until we traded TJ for Rubio right before the 2020 season. There were 3 seasons without a real PG. James Jones was here for that. He thought trading for Tyler Johnson would make a difference. He also waived Austin Rivers, who I don't care for but could have helped as an actual PG. I blame part of Chriss and Bender's lack of development on not having a legit NBA starting caliber PG.

Not me. That was all on the management team solely for selecting those two guys. We had no business drafting a player we knew almost nothing about and another player that had alarm bells ringing everywhere for anyone that actually watched him play the game. Anyway, we were horrible through the stretch you're talking about mostly because we lacked talent at multiple positions, not just PG.

We earned our horrible records, even when it was just called tanking. But this last year we stunk it up in the 4th quarter for one major reason, we didn't have a true floor general. If Ishbia and whoever is making the decisions there haven't recognized what was happening, we're in trouble.

As for Rivers, didn't he refuse to play for us or am I thinking of someone else?

 

[AzStevenCal]

Could be some long-term strategy. Jones and Morris likely on one and done deals, so we are looking to keep Book as sg and not re-do point Book again, again.

Yeah, let's hope. For a shooting guard Booker has above average PG skills but as a PG, he's lower tier and we take a hit at the 2 spot at the same time so it's a lose-lose proposition.

 

[Hoop Head]

Not me. That was all on the management team solely for selecting those two guys. We had no business drafting a player we knew almost nothing about and another player that had alarm bells ringing everywhere for anyone that actually watched him play the game. Anyway, we were horrible through the stretch you're talking about mostly because we lacked talent at multiple positions, not just PG.

We earned our horrible records, even when it was just called tanking. But this last year we stunk it up in the 4th quarter for one major reason, we didn't have a true floor general. If Ishbia and whoever is making the decisions there haven't recognized what was happening, we're in trouble.

As for Rivers, didn't he refuse to play for us or am I thinking of someone else?

Don't get me wrong as far as Chriss and Bender are concerned. They were bad picks and unlikely to develop however if you inherit a team with those 2 then it's your job as a GM, coach, or whatever to try and develop those guys. Not giving them a PG to play off of put them even further behind the 8 ball. That's on JJ. He has a history of overlooking the PG position.

JJ may have made the deal for Rubio but he didn't get Rubio a backup until the bubble when he brought in Cam Payne, who had a history with Monty and attributed his opportunity here to Monty specifically. That again shows how JJ neglected the PG spot. Last season seemed a long run of no PG, which was kickstarted by ditching Payne in a clear salary dump move. Vogel wasn't the type to rock the boat. I believe there was a clear directive from the front office that Booker and Beal will be the PG's and it was Vogel's job to make it work. We know how that turned out.


As for Austin Rivers, I've heard he didn't want to be here and I've heard he was shocked by being told he was going to be bought out. I did a little digging and found this article where Rivers says he wanted to be a playoff contender and didn't want to be here but when he spoke to the Suns he learned the feeling was mutual in that we didn't want him either. This article is from 2019, the trade was 2018, so all that's said is back before Rivers playing career had ended. He mentions he was in a contract year and I don't imagine it would have been hard to sell him on being a starter. Maybe it would have. I mainly mentioned it as one of the many times that JJ didn't view the PG spot as a priority because whether Austin wanted to be here or not, there should have been more of a discussion.

It's also another case of JJ wasting a potential asset. Austin was expiring and we bought him out almost right away. That's one of the many times JJ has fumbled an expiring contract.

Maybe I'm nitpicking, at this point though I won't give JJ the benefit of doubt since most issues I have with him now regarding team building, signings, drafts, and trades are all repeated behavior on his part.

Austin Rivers explains why he didn't join the Suns after trade from the Wizards

Austin Rivers loves the city of Phoenix. He just wasn’t trying to play for the Suns.

www.azcentral.com

 

[Proximo]

Yes, the Suns were active completing their G-League roster and adding some solid prospects on two-way contracts.

It's interesting how their focus has been on adding point guards. It's completely different from last season. Bud, probably had an impact on this.

I don't really recall the Bucks having a pure point guard. I don't think it is coming from him.

I think if anything it's the best available players available to us were point guards because most of the league is devaluing them.

 

[Mainstreet]

I don't really recall the Bucks having a pure point guard. I don't think it is coming from him.

I think if anything it's the best available players available to us were point guards because most of the league is devaluing them.

I'd consider Jrue Holiday as a point guard, although he is a good all around player, especially on defense. The Bucks now have Damian Lillard and Delon wright.

However, let the NBA devalue them if such is the case. IMO, the good ones are valuable, much like quarterbacks in the NFL.

A good passing offense is less dependent on them, but the Suns are not there.

 

[Mainstreet]

Gerald Bourguet continues his articles about Suns players. They are excellent and detailed.

He will write about all 17 players.

There are some additionally linked articles in the Suns Training Camp thread.

Today, he talks about Ryan Dunn in a free pay article.

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[Yuma]

Gerald Bourguet continues his articles about Suns players. They are excellent and detailed.

He will write about all 17 players.

There are some additionally linked articles in the Suns Training Camp thread.

Today, he talks about Ryan Dunn in a free pay article.

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I know people have gone over how much Bridges jump shot percentage was better than Dunn's and not to equate the two. Still, Bridges was a VERY reluctant shooter. Most of his early playing time was other Sun's players and coaches comments on how he needed to take more shots. Teams were literally not even guarding him in some games. BUT, he had a skill we lacked, Wing defense. That was enough to get him on the floor where he developed into a guard the 1-4 positions elite defender. I am only pointing this out, because even in a second unit scenario, defense will get Dunn onto the floor. Possibly even limited tries at slowing down the hot hand on the other side some nights.

I think we focus on Dunn and what we think/"know" what he is weak at. We aren't looking at fit and what the Suns need. Before we make a trade for a wing defender, Dunn most certainly will get some minutes to see what he can do. There is hype that Dunn may have been among the best wing defenders in this last draft.

I am not expecting him to be a Bridges replacement, but his ceiling upside looks very promising.

 

[Mainstreet]

I know people have gone over how much Bridges jump shot percentage was better than Dunn's and not to equate the two. Still, Bridges was a VERY reluctant shooter. Most of his early playing time was other Sun's and coaches comments on how he needed to take more shots. Teams were literally not even guarding him in some games. BUT, he had a skill we lacked, Wing defense. That was enough to get him on the floor where he developed into a guard the 1-4 positions elite defender. I am only pointing this out, because even in a second unit scenario, defense will get Dunn onto the floor. Possibly even limited tries at slowing down the hot hand on the other side some nights.

I think we focus on Dunn and what we think/"know" what he is weak at. We aren't looking at fit and what the Suns need. Before we make a trade for a wing defender, Dunn most certainly will get some minutes to see what he can do. There is hype that Dunn may have been among the best wing defenders in this last draft.

I am not expecting him to be a Bridges replacement, but his ceiling upside looks very promising.

It's hard to not get excited about Ryan Dunn after watching the video clips in the above linked Gerald Bourguet article.

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[Yuma]

There were times in Summer League, where Dunn and Ighodaro were on the court at the same time, and one of them would make a defensive play. About 50% of the time we were guessing the wrong guy made the play. Dunn looks "bigger" than the 6'8", and maybe that's not so much height as it was his bulk. Dunn and Oso looked similar from the far angles they were sometimes showing the court in Summer League. He's not a stick. He will have to get stronger, but he's got a good physical base to build on.

 

[Mainstreet]

There were times in Summer League, where Dunn and Ighodaro were on the court at the same time, and one of them would make a defensive play. About 50% of the time we were guessing the wrong guy made the play. Dunn looks "bigger" than the 6'8", and maybe that's not so much height as it was his bulk. Dunn and Oso looked similar from the far angles they were sometimes showing the court in Summer League. He's not a stick. He will have to get stronger, but he's got a good physical base to build on.

I like that Dunn has a long wing span, athletic and uses that athleticism to stay in front of offensive players. He makes stops, steals and block shots.

 

[Yuma]

I like that Dunn has a long wing span, athletic and uses that athleticism to stay in front of offensive players. He makes stops, steals and block shots.

He is VERY patient on defense. He doesn't jump early. He stays down on dribblers and lets them go through all their moves, and waits until they are in the shooting motion to attempt a block. IF you watch his highlights, he patiently stays in front of guys and doesn't try and reach or push the offensive players. This style of defense will translate VERY well to the NBA. He's not using his hands at all to stay with the defender.

 

[Mainstreet]

He is VERY patient on defense. He doesn't jump early. He stays down on dribblers and lets them go through all their moves, and waits until they are in the shooting motion to attempt a block. IF you watch his highlights, he patiently stays in front of guys and doesn't try and reach or push the offensive players. This style of defense will translate VERY well to the NBA. He's not using his hands at all to stay with the defender.

And Dunn is not afraid to use his chest on defense. Now all we need is for him is to turn into another Dennis Rodman.

 

[elindholm]

I have never gambled before but recently saw that the sports books here in Austria are offering +3100 for the Suns to win the title. Isn't that a bit high? Like I said I have no experience in sports betting and I am also not very informed about what has happened around the NBA in the Offseason but was thinking about placing a small bet... even if it is just to justify for myself the costs of streaming the Suns games hehe.

You'd have to think that the Suns have better than a 3% chance of winning the title. I don't, but it doesn't look like a horrible bet to me. If it's going to add entertainment value for you, I'd say go for it.

 

[Yuma]

And Dunn is not afraid to use his chest on defense. Now all we need is for him is to turn into another Dennis Rodman.

I think obviously we got guys to hype with those turn over numbers that have plagued us for many seasons now, and we got a few defenders, too. The rebounders, I guess Plumlee is about our best upgrade for that. We still are short on rebounding, imho.

 

[Mainstreet]

I think obviously we got guys to hype with those turn over numbers that have plagued us for many seasons now, and we got a few defenders, too. The rebounders, I guess Plumlee is about our best upgrade for that. We still are short on rebounding, imho.

Agree, the Suns are short on rebounders, wing defense and at center where more ability would help.

The pieces might be there, but I think the Suns presently need to add a 4/5.