Suns Draft Prospects Who do We Take?

[elindholm]

I was just saying that the last half of the 1st round is not much better then the second round

But, by the very numbers brought up in this discussion, it has been established that the second half of the first round is almost three times as good as the second round. You're talking 2-3 players per year from among 13 picks, compared to 2-3 players per year from among 29 picks. The success rate of late first-rounders is much higher.

 

[hcsilla]

Originally posted by Chaplin
Whoa!

Hold on right there. Nobody said that the #17 pick would be "starting caliber".

No,nobody said because it's pretty unlikely.
Especially that Suns have only one hole at their starting lineup and it seems to be very likely that we won't be able to take our future C at #17.
However if our pick (for example Hinrich or Ridnour) will become a starting quality player ala Nash then it's even better because he will be a valuable asset.

In fact, everyone pretty much agrees that the #17 pick would be used as punch off the bench, which as you probably agree, we desperately need.

Yes,it is a realistic demand from the #17 pick that he should be a future,good benchplayer.

 

[fordronken]

According to nbadraft.net, Sofoklis could fall to us. What do you guys think about him?

 

[fordronken]

http://www.nbadraft.net/profiles/haseung-jin.htm

Projected to go in 2004. Still a junior in high school, and x-rays reveal he's still growing!

 

[jbeecham]

I'm not sure about Sofoklis. A lot of it will ride on his actual height measurements in pre-draft camp workouts. He could be the next Alton Ford or the next Alonzo Mourning but I really don't know anything about him yet except what I've read on NBADraft.net.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Ok since I apparently completely lost any ability I used to have to make a point, I will take one last crack at it.


For this year, based off of what I know of the draft as of today vs. the amount of FAs that are available, and could possibly be had for parts or the entire exception.......I would rather spend the roster spot and money on a FA.

Like I said before, my stance may change once the dust settles, and solid scouting reports are more available. But as of TODAY, I would rather have a FA.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by thegrahamcrackr


Like I said before, my stance may change once the dust settles, and solid scouting reports are more available. But as of TODAY, I would rather have a FA.

But because you don't have a specific FA in mind, your reasoning seems flawed. Notice I said seems.

Dan Langhi will be a free agent--would you prefer him over the #17 pick?

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Ok, some FAs that I wouldnt mind considering --

jason terry
jumaine jones
walt williams
popeye jones
juwan howard
james posey
brad miller
samaki walker
corey magette
eddie house
rasho nesterovic
lucious harris
pj brown
jerome moiso
pat burke
tyrone hill
kenny thomas
antonio daniels
jim jackson
speedy claxton


I know some of these players will be resigned, and some may not fit. I also tried to avoid players that would would have no chance at. However, there is a very large amount of role player FAs this summer, and a lot could be had at bargains since there is so much competition for roster spots.

 

[Chaplin]

jason terry - too expensive
jumaine jones - nice possibility
walt williams - too old
popeye jones - too old
juwan howard - too expensive
james posey - too expensive
brad miller - too expensive
samaki walker - not a good fit
corey magette - too expensive
eddie house - nice possibility
rasho nesterovic - too expensive
lucious harris - NJ NET!!!
pj brown - nice possibility
jerome moiso - i know some like him, but not me
pat burke - nice possibility, even with the #17 pick intact
tyrone hill - too old
kenny thomas - too expensive
antonio daniels - too expensive
jim jackson - too expensive
speedy claxton - too expensive

All and all, an interesting list, but most if not all are realistically too old or too expensive. The others that might be nice are probably going to be too much money too, but we'll have to see.

 

[fordronken]

Very unrealistic
jason terry
juwan howard
corey maggette
rasho nesterovic

Likely to either re-sign or go to a championship contender
pj brown
tyronne hill
jim jackson

If they do take a mid-level, they probably wouldn't take ours
kenny thomas
antonio daniels
jerome moiso

Which leaves...
jumaine jones - Would be a good guy to pick up, and would hopefully learn some locker room manners from our guys. He will be hard to get, however.
walt williams - How much game does he have left? Possibly just enough to give Marion his 5-10 minutes of rest.
popeye jones - A possibility, but do we need him?
james posey - A good fit, but I think he will re-sign.
samaki walker - May re-sign, but if not, would he help us?
eddie house - Undersized at the 2, and I don't think he could run our team as a point.
lucious harris - Would just be brought in as a shooter. Could very well re-sign.
pat burke - Probably will be retained, but would be a good compliment to Amare.
speedy claxton - I will be very surprised if he is not retained. If not, he would fit it well as a back up for Marbury.

 

[Divide Et Impera]

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Looks like he has the same lower body structure as Yao, but a wider, stronger upper body. That's good, btw. Yao's legs are all that keep him from being bowled over nightly....

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Originally posted by thegrahamcrackr
So what there is a 2nd round this year (Not that I see where you think it will be gone later, but whatever)

PhxSports4life, are you claiming that Luke Walton and Jason Gardener would be a waste? They will probably go 2nd round or undrafted in Jason's case. BTW, I dont watch a lot of college ball expect for UofA and ASU, that is why I do not bring up other people. The bench is a need. But why draft the bench based on potential, which sadly is what the first 20 picks are now. You know what you are getting with seniors, why not take them?? People knew what they got with Boozer for example, he was a second round pick, you think he would be a senseless type of player to draft fot this team????

you're completely guessing the second round (though I thought last year we should have taken boozer over jacobsen - we're a team always in need of more length).

and, i know you're gonna take umbrage at this, but oh well . . . luke and jason are gonna stink at the next level. now mind you, i route for UofA (went to a div III school outta state, so I can do that), but i don't think either's skills (and i watch a TON of college hoops) will translate over to the nba. they're both heady, but physically they were overmatched at times at the collegiate level (that's why i give lute so much credit for this past season), at the nba level they'll be overmatched by almost everyone they encounter.

an undersized, slow, unexplosive, average shooter with great court vision ain't cuttin it at forward.

an undersized, shoot first, low percentage streak shooter at pg ain't cuttin' it either.

both are training camp fodder.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by PHXSPORTS4LIFE


an undersized, slow, unexplosive, average shooter with great court vision ain't cuttin it at forward.

an undersized, shoot first, low percentage streak shooter at pg ain't cuttin' it either.

both are training camp fodder.

Agreed about Gardner, not so much about Walton. Walton is pretty close to Majerle size, there are some things he can do in order to be a productive NBA player.

As for Jason, well, I know Earl Boykins has done a great job, but he's going to have a tough time just because of his height--but he's similar to Stephon in that he's actually really strong.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Originally posted by PHXSPORTS4LIFE
you're completely guessing the second round (though I thought last year we should have taken boozer over jacobsen - we're a team always in need of more length).

I said I wanted to bring Gardener in for camp, which was actually Joe's idea first. I think he could help spell Marbury for 5-10 mionutes without us loosing ground.

I think that Walton's court vision is what makes him interesting. Players that know how to play the game will always have a chance in the league depsite their physical lackings.

Anyways, of course I am completely guessing the second roun, same with the first round. There is not nearly enough info out there to not guess them.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Originally posted by Chaplin
Agreed about Gardner, not so much about Walton. Walton is pretty close to Majerle size, there are some things he can do in order to be a productive NBA player.

As for Jason, well, I know Earl Boykins has done a great job, but he's going to have a tough time just because of his height--but he's similar to Stephon in that he's actually really strong.

while luke is close to majerle's size he doesn't have close to dan's explosiveness. now, i'm not saying that thunder was jordan, but when he first came into the league the only thing (other than defense) was take the ball to the hole and throw it down (didn't develop crazy dan majerle range 'til much later). luke just doesn't have that type of explosiveness.

and you've got to admit, earl boykins is a HUGE (pun intended) anomoly. freak, if you will.

 

[Chaplin]

Well, I didn't say that Luke would be a Majerle clone--I was just pointing out that his size shouldn't be a detriment to him, but his knowledge and court sense could pay dividends.

 

[cly2tw]

From this year's experience, I think the Suns will be very competitive next season, if they could get the center position adequately fixed (improved JAKE, Campbell, etc.). Since we are way over the luxuary tax limit, it's good reasoning that we might try to get rid of the salary commitment for the 17th pick this year as the player picked won't help us immediately anyway, unless the talent there is of the hard to come by type.

BTW, anyone knows whether we could pull a Kamp solution with Googs? After he picks up his option, we work out a retirement/severance deal that pays him 5mil this year and 1.5 for 5 more years. This way, we'd save 7mil in lux tax this year and be in a better position to persue FA with the exceptions. I thought Colangelo talked of somehow solving the salary problem in the offseason in the last article on Suns.com.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by cly2tw
Since we are way over the luxuary tax limit, it's good reasoning that we might try to get rid of the salary commitment for the 17th pick this year as the player picked won't help us immediately anyway, unless the talent there is of the hard to come by type.

This is unreasonable. Why? Using this reasoning, you are willing to just give away the pick. If not, then we'll have salary committments no matter what in whatever we get in return. It's worthless to just "not pick". Funny, but the #17 pick has money invested in it already, whether it's from the picked player himself, or from whatever we get in return.

 

[thegrahamcrackr]

Originally posted by Chaplin
This is unreasonable. Why? Using this reasoning, you are willing to just give away the pick. If not, then we'll have salary committments no matter what in whatever we get in return. It's worthless to just "not pick". Funny, but the #17 pick has money invested in it already, whether it's from the picked player himself, or from whatever we get in return.

just to prolong this......

the #17 pick has money invested in it, but no necessarily for this season. We could technically trade for a furture first round pick, since the salary situation is only really bad for next year.

 

[Chaplin]

Originally posted by thegrahamcrackr
just to prolong this......

the #17 pick has money invested in it, but no necessarily for this season. We could technically trade for a furture first round pick, since the salary situation is only really bad for next year.

We could also draft a 7-4" center and let him play in Europe for a year or two and retain his rights.

We're NOT getting rid of that pick.

 

[sunsfn]

The suns have made a commitement to improve through the draft.

I do not think they will give up the 17th pick unless it would be involved in a trade to help the team get us a good young player, and possibly help the cap problem at the same time.
((very unlikely))

After watching the spurs/lakers games the suns may want to think about drafting a defensive specialist.
((if there is such a thing))

Does anyone know anything more than what we read on the internet about Boris Diaw?

6' 8" 210 lbs.

I prefer a big man, but if there is none the suns like, maybe this guy?
-------------------------------------------------
NBA Comparison: Bruce Bowen

Strengths: Athletically there isn't much Diaw doesn't posses with superior leaping ability, length, and quickness ... An underrated post passer who might be the best at his position ... Has the defensive skills that NBA team's love such as foot speed, long arms and quick hands ... Shows the ability to be a solid offensive rebounder on put backs ... Excels in the open court where his athleticism allows him to finish with flair ... Unselfish although almost to a fault he looks constantly for open teammates ... Possesses amazing body control and combined with his basket skills to make some impressive drives to the basket ... Even when the defense adjusts, his creativity allows for impressive finishes in traffic ... When aggressive, he can be a explosive scorer around the rim on dunks ... Diaw's long arms and quick hands enable him to be a threat to steal the ball and disrupt passing lanes ... Plays the game with poise and maturity no matter what the situation ... Does a good job of using the baseline to gain the advantage over the defense on quick lay-ups ... Fundamentally he is very sound and able to do a multitude of tasks well ... Makes solid court decisions when the ball is on his hands ... Team player who does all the little things that don't show up on the stat sheet ... Has excellent court vision rarely seen at his position ...

Weaknesses: Needs to improve on his upper body strength ... Offensively Diaw must focus on becoming more aggressive ... Perimeter shooting remains a very underdeveloped part of his game ... Struggles to make the 3-point shot with consistency ... Diaw has yet to learn how to drawl fouls from opposing defenders on a consistent basis ... Added improvement of his ball handling could enable him to take defenders off the dribble more efficiently ... Lacks the consistency to shoot off the dribble ... Confidence has a tendency to wavier at times ... Doesn't always finish in the lane after contact occurs ... Has few post up skills to take advantage of height mismatches of opposing defenders ... Should work on improving at moving without the ball as he has a habit of watching ... Doesn't play with the intensity level many coaches look for as Diaw approach's the game with a laid back demeanor ... Needs to display more effort on the court consistently ... Sometimes he will defer to teammates instead of looking for his shot ...

-Matthew Maurer
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Strengths: Great athlete. Not a shooter or a scorer, if he cared about his stats he could increase his scoring average. His biggest strength is his strong defensive-oriented-game, as he often is in charge of the main opposing scorer, whether they play the 1, 2, or 3 positon. His footwork, athlecism, elevation, and quick hands help him to lock down opponents. Incredible feel for the game. Shooting is his only weakness but otherwise he does it all. Very good defensive player, easily his best attribute. Had a very solid season for Pau this year, being a consistant contributor. Wiry athletic, a Kirilenko-type of frame. Great offensive and defensive abilities. Has quickness, nice wing-span. His penetration skills are awesome, as he has superb foot speed and body control allowing him to use his above average athlecism to score. Offensively his strength is his ability to read the defensive play and to penetrate or find an open man.

Weaknesses: No real shooting touch. Must develop more intensity. Can become very good, but seems to settle for being just good. Mental toughness must get stronger. is game is still developing, especially shooting, but his fundamentals are very good.

Notes: A leader: captain of the France Champs with the Under-21. in clubs National Team acquired experience both with the young and A team. His impact on the game goes beyond his stats.


-Uros Velkavrh
-Eric Winterstein
---------------------------------------------------------------------

Explosive athlete... Has all the necessary attributes to be an NBA player, esplosiveness, speed, mobility, perhaps lacks strength and muscles, but is improving his physical strength ... His fundamentals are improving.. He can shoot it from 3p, but isn't comfortable if he is rushed ... Has a first step and ball handling but it's his body control that makes the difference... He uses ball fakes in order to get by defenders and then penetrates ... A player of great instincts... Doesn't have great vision, but anticipates well ... Improves his teammates ... Gets a lot of touches and really enjoys controlling the tempo of the game ... has the ability to pass in traffic... Has a tendency to go stretches of being lazy ... Unselfish to the extreme that it hurts his game ... Must develop his finishing ability because it can be a great weapon with his body control and athleticism ... Defensively his skills are at the highest level... Has great one-on-one defensive ability with anticipation and lateral quickness ... Can at times get too enticed by the steal and lose track of his man ...

-Cristian Biagini
------------------------------------------------

 

[SweetD]

Does anyone know anything more than what we read on the internet about Boris Diaw?

6' 8" 210 lbs

Sounds like a watered down version of JJ. We need someone with confidence and is willing to get rough and play some tight D. Still he would be a nice addition to the team. Maybe he will not get drafted and look to be a free agent pick up??

 

[hcsilla]

Originally posted by fordronken
Very unrealistic
jason terry
juwan howard
corey maggette
rasho nesterovic

Likely to either re-sign or go to a championship contender
pj brown
tyronne hill
jim jackson

If they do take a mid-level, they probably wouldn't take ours
kenny thomas
antonio daniels
jerome moiso

Which leaves...
jumaine jones - Would be a good guy to pick up, and would hopefully learn some locker room manners from our guys. He will be hard to get, however.
walt williams - How much game does he have left? Possibly just enough to give Marion his 5-10 minutes of rest.
popeye jones - A possibility, but do we need him?
james posey - A good fit, but I think he will re-sign.
samaki walker - May re-sign, but if not, would he help us?
eddie house - Undersized at the 2, and I don't think he could run our team as a point.
lucious harris - Would just be brought in as a shooter. Could very well re-sign.
pat burke - Probably will be retained, but would be a good compliment to Amare.
speedy claxton - I will be very surprised if he is not retained. If not, he would fit it well as a back up for Marbury.

I completely agree.

CLE probably will re-sign Jumaine Jones.
I think that Jones is a more matured and agressive but less talented version of Joe Johnson.
Anyway if CLE won't re-sign him somebody else will.If not then he is a no-brainer future asset for 2-3 mil./year.

I never was a big fan of James Posey but he showed some signs of life in March and April.

I think that Walt Williams would be a good addition for the vet min.

 

[hcsilla]

Originally posted by SweetD
Does anyone know anything more than what we read on the internet about Boris Diaw?

6' 8" 210 lbs

Sounds like a watered down version of JJ. We need someone with confidence and is willing to get rough and play some tight D. Still he would be a nice addition to the team. Maybe he will not get drafted and look to be a free agent pick up??

I saw twice him this year when France played against Hungary in a qualification game for the European Championship.

Although he played only minutes he seemed to be totally raw.He was athletic but that's it.
I'm not sure that he is a legit 1st round pick material.

BTW, neither Mickael Pietrus was much better although he was a starter.
I think that he is ridiculously overhyped by Chad Ford ("mixture of Desmond Mason and Ray Allen", lol, isn't this Michael Jordan?) and IMO who takes him in the lottery will make a mistake.

 

[slinslin]

Best thing in my opinion would be if we could somehow manage to pick up Sofoklis and Barbosa. Sofoklis at 6'10 and 18 years could be a nice center and forward prospect. Barbosa could give Marbury some rest and at 6'3 6'10 wingspan play some with Marbury on the court.

Still would rather sign Moiso for the small exemption than Voshkul for about 2M$. That's cheaper and makes up for the additional costs of a 2nd first round pick. Replace Scott Williams with Elden Campbell.