Suns updates and discussion for the 2023-24 season

[Mainstreet]

Ish shot .370 from the field last season and averaged 2.3 rebounds. That should say something.

If fans want to like the guy then fine, I do as well, but not on the 15-man roster.

 

[Chaplin]

Ish shot .370 from the field last season and averaged 2.3 rebounds. That should say something.

If fans want to like the guy then fine, I do as well, but not on the 15-man roster.

And there is a reason he is still on the team and not cut, as you and Hoop have so eloquently talked about. I don't think it's a question that needs to be asked at this point. Next week, sure. But not right be fore game 3 of the preseason? He's been injured and is non-guaranteed. If Ish wasn't in our plans then there is NO reason for us to even keep him on the roster at all, is there?

 

[Superbone]

This team is on another level now - IF Ish sees any playing time (at all) it will be when the game's already been decided and fans are heading to their cars

That's going to be true of all 15th men. That's why you want them to be good locker room guys.

 

[Hoop Head]

And there is a reason he is still on the team and not cut, as you and Hoop have so eloquently talked about. I don't think it's a question that needs to be asked at this point. Next week, sure. But not right be fore game 3 of the preseason? He's been injured and is non-guaranteed. If Ish wasn't in our plans then there is NO reason for us to even keep him on the roster at all, is there?

That reason is players aren't generally waived in the middle of preseason unless they're a locker room problem. So as I said before, it's inevitable he'll be cut at some point. The numbers don't work in his favor. I don't see the harm is saying he will be a camp casualty or why you take issue with it. I don't believe @Mainstreet wants him cut tomorrow, neither do I. It's been discussed because we're at 17 players right now and that needs to shrink.

 

[Chaplin]

That reason is players aren't generally waived in the middle of preseason unless they're a locker room problem. So as I said before, it's inevitable he'll be cut at some point. The numbers don't work in his favor. I don't see the harm is saying he will be a camp casualty or why you take issue with it. I don't believe @Mainstreet wants him cut tomorrow, neither do I. It's been discussed because we're at 17 players right now and that needs to shrink.

Again, if he isn't going to play in the preseason, why wait?

 

[Germz249]

Again, if he isn't going to play in the preseason, why wait?

Not saying he is a players team would jump on but possible trade maybe?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Lotta talk about… our 15th best player.

Regular season needs to start yesterday.

 

[Chaplin]

Not saying he is a players team would jump on but possible trade maybe?

You'd be hard pressed to find any value for another team. I thought about that too. But he would be the ultimate definition of a throw-in, his salary wouldn't work in a trade because he's barely making anything.

 

[Hoop Head]

Again, if he isn't going to play in the preseason, why wait?

You tell me. We know they need to shrink the roster by 2. As I said, teams generally don't do that in the middle of preseason unless a player is a cancer, see Kai Jones, so why are you so hung up on some of saying Ish is likely 1 of the 2 guys who will be cut? You're really taking up for Ish without providing any sort of reason why he's worth keeping over 2 other guys. So do tell, who will be cut, if not Ish, and why?

 

[Mainstreet]

Damion Lee had successful surgery on his right meniscus today. No update on his return.

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[Hoop Head]

Damion Lee had successful surgery on his right meniscus today. No update on his return.

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IIRC the timetable for return can be 6-8 weeks or 8-10 weeks depending on which type of surgery it was. Removal is quicker, repair takes longer. He's likely out until mid December, if not January.

 

[Mainstreet]

IIRC the timetable for return can be 6-8 weeks or 8-10 weeks depending on which type of surgery it was. Removal is quicker, repair takes longer. He's likely out until mid December, if not January.

This sounds right. The Suns probably have time to wait for Damion Lee to return this season if they decide to go this direction.

 

[CardsSunsDbacks]

IIRC the timetable for return can be 6-8 weeks or 8-10 weeks depending on which type of surgery it was. Removal is quicker, repair takes longer. He's likely out until mid December, if not January.

From what I can find Bledsoe was out for about 10 weeks when he had it removed. If Lee opts for repair it will likely be longer than that. From what I can find when googling it is as long as 6 months.

 

[95pro]

Who are you most happy to move on from?


CP3 - old, broken, slow pace, standoff-ish, possibly canceruous

Monty - lineups, timeouts, doghouse, favorites

Ayton - lack of a lot of things (aggression, growth, commitment)


These three all have their warts, we managed to move on from them, but who are you most happy to move on from?

 

[Hoop Head]

Who are you most happy to move on from?


CP3 - old, broken, slow pace, standoff-ish, possibly canceruous

Monty - lineups, timeouts, doghouse, favorites

Ayton - lack of a lot of things (aggression, growth, commitment)


These three all have their warts, we managed to move on from them, but who are you most happy to move on from?

Ayton, most definitely. I didn't think Monty should be fired until the blowout in game 6. Having that happen 2 years in a row was unforgivable. Before that, I'd have said the franchise needs to choose Ayton or Monty so both being sent out this off-season was surprising.

No ill will towards CP3. Not his fault he was getting up there in years and couldn't maintain his health when it mattered most. He gave us what he could and helped bring us back to relevancy.

Ayton meanwhile was a walking disappointment that was never going to live up to his draft position. He wasn't even the best 1st round selection of ours that year given Mikal was superior to him in virtually everyway. Mikal had more trade value and received more accolades, finishing 2nd or 3rd in DPOY voting in 2022 and making the Defensive 1st Team. All around class act. Ayton meanwhile had talent but no drive to push him to be the best version of himself night in and out.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Who are you most happy to move on from?


CP3 - old, broken, slow pace, standoff-ish, possibly canceruous

Monty - lineups, timeouts, doghouse, favorites

Ayton - lack of a lot of things (aggression, growth, commitment)


These three all have their warts, we managed to move on from them, but who are you most happy to move on from?

They all made me sad. Sad we didn't win it all with CP3 before he lost another step. Sad Monty couldn't walk the talk and find a way to build bridges with players rather than tear them down. Sad that Ayton had so much promise, failed to consistently deliver on that promise and never accepted any responsibility for his part in the failures.

I won't be happy with any of those moves until we actually see them pay off, and then I'll be ecstatic. Until then I'm comfortable with the direction we're heading without those three.

 

[Folster]

Who are you most happy to move on from?


CP3 - old, broken, slow pace, standoff-ish, possibly canceruous

Monty - lineups, timeouts, doghouse, favorites

Ayton - lack of a lot of things (aggression, growth, commitment)


These three all have their warts, we managed to move on from them, but who are you most happy to move on from?

CP3. He still showed flashes, but he couldn't even be relied upon to bring the ball up under pressure, the most basic responsibility of a point guard and he bogged down our offense. Add on his propensity to break down in the playoffs and the decision seemed so easy. I was happy that the front office was able to realize his time was over.

 

[Mainstreet]

They all made me sad. Sad we didn't win it all with CP3 before he lost another step. Sad Monty couldn't walk the talk and find a way to build bridges with players rather than tear them down. Sad that Ayton had so much promise, failed to consistently deliver on that promise and never accepted any responsibility for his part in the failures.

I won't be happy with any of those moves until we actually see them pay off, and then I'll be ecstatic. Until then I'm comfortable with the direction we're heading without those three.

Monty's lack of ability to build bridges especially perplexed me because after the first two seasons as head coach, this seemed to be what the team was all about.

Then the team culture seemed to disintegrate after winning a franchise high 64 wins in the 2021-22 season.

 

[CardsFan88]

CP3 willed our offense and single-handedly took over games. His faults were age. There's far worse for a locker room than an overdemanding floor general.

Definitely between Monty and Ayton, but have to give Ayton the nod.

Too many self-inflicted, unnecessary, unforced errors. Both on and off the court. Glad the Blazers will be dealing with those and not us. His hands alone make an offensive lineman's look like Jerry Rice.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I have no ill-will towards Paul.

Monty was great as a culture builder to help carry this team over the franchise joke era to consistent contender. That’s impressive no matter his ugly exits from the playoffs. That said, I’m happy to see a new voice coaching the team.

Ayton’s a quitter and could care less about him leaving. Addition by subtraction there.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Monty's lack of ability to build bridges especially perplexed me because after the first two seasons as head coach, this seemed to be what the team was all about.

Then the team culture seemed to disintegrate after winning a franchise high 64 wins in the 2021-22 season.

Ayton was Monty's kryptonite.

 

[Mainstreet]

Ayton was Monty's kryptonite.

Along with Jae Crowder I suspect.

 

[95pro]

Keon for sure should go.

Goodwin came out like a true pro and proved he belonged almost immediately.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Keon for sure should go.

Goodwin came out like a true pro and proved he belonged almost immediately.

Yup. Goodwin showed some pop out there the moment he hit the floor.

 

[Superbone]

Yup. Goodwin showed some pop out there the moment he hit the floor.

The ball flowed so much better with Goodwin than with Lee.