Target JACKSON

[Hoop Head]

You put mine in there too and I've already said I'm against it. I just acknowledged that if we were convinced he was a star in the making, it's worth throwing in another pick if necessary.

I included you in that post because you've said you're for it, if the team is. I understand the caveat you attached but you're still for it if it happens, you're just not advocating for it on your own right now,

 

[JCSunsfan]

I'd gladly throw in Knight to try and swap with Philly, I'd throw in both 2nd round picks also, but no more than that. No future picks and none of our players except Derrick Jones Jr or Dudley. I don't think DJJ will ever be more than a 4th wing in the rotation, so why not include him and I'm not a fan of Dudley's contract but it's not bad enough to try and dump it elsewhere.I don't see how he gets minutes next season with Chriss and Bender healthy Booker and Warren covering the wings with Barbosa and DJJ backing up SG and SF plus whoever our rookie is. and

I think we might be able to get a later 1st round pick for him, from someone, this year. I'm not sure if Philly would take the #4 and Knight ofr the #3, no matter who they have slotted there.

I would agree with this for now. I think most Suns fans would have no problem trading to #3 if it only cost Knight and a second rounder or two.

Well. Nabbing the #4 pick certainly gives us more to talk about than if we got 1 or 2.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I included you in that post because you've said you're for it, if the team is. I understand the caveat you attached but you're still for it if happens, you're just not advocating for it on your own right now,

I would rather it said that I'm against it but recognize where it might become appropriate. I'm not a big Jackson fan and even if I were, I still don't see the kind of separation amongst these prospects that would warrant paying that kind of premium. But if we worked him out and were convinced he was the next Kawhi, sure, it's worth the extra pick if that's what it takes.

 

[pokerface]

Would you part with one of those picks, or a protected 1st of our own, to move up just 1 spot and guarantee Jackson? You're reasonable poster, please tell me you wouldn't.

I wish you wouldn't put it that way. First off...there is a " reasonable" chance that another team could swoop in and trade with Philly and steal Jackson from under our noses. So in that regard the fact Philly is only one spot higher is not the only thing to consider. Secondly, Philly has FOUR second rounders of their own...so offering them second rounders seems futile... Not only that but our offer would have to trump other offers... another team would probably offer a first rounder plus their current pick (although it would be lower than our #4 pick). Thirdly, we have a slew of draft picks and young talent of our own we're developing. We can afford to splurge and overpay for Jackson.

You are considering a poll about Jackson and what we should offer. My poll would be simpler and more straight forward. Which player do you prefer... Jackson or Fox? But I think we already know the answer...

 

[Errntknght]

I'd trade Bledsoe for their #3 slot then take Jackson and Fox. Heck, I'd trade Bledsoe for the #6 - #8 then take Fox and Markannen - I see no role for Bled here after two years - the odds being that between Rich Paul and Bleds knees he'll be gone or of significantly reduced value on the floor. I think now is the time to sell! If McD likes some other front court player besides Markannen I'd trade Eric for whatever draft slot is needed to nab him. If, for some reason, Jackson fell to us at 4, I'd still trade Bledsoe for Markannen or McD's choice of a FC player and depend on Ulis to carry the load at PG. We'd have to pick up another PG someplace but there should be several of those available after this PG rich draft. Tyler Ennis is a likely candidate since LAL is adding Lonzo - Ennis is 6'3 and 194, in case you don't remember.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'd trade Bledsoe for their #3 slot then take Jackson and Fox. Heck, I'd trade Bledsoe for the #6 - #8 then take Fox and Markannen - I see no role for Bled here after two years - the odds being that between Rich Paul and Bleds knees he'll be gone or of significantly reduced value on the floor. I think now is the time to sell! If McD likes some other front court player besides Markannen I'd trade Eric for whatever draft slot is needed to nab him. If, for some reason, Jackson fell to us at 4, I'd still trade Bledsoe for Markannen or McD's choice of a FC player and depend on Ulis to carry the load at PG. We'd have to pick up another PG someplace but there should be several of those available after this PG rich draft. Tyler Ennis is a likely candidate since LAL is adding Lonzo - Ennis is 6'3 and 194, in case you don't remember.

I remember Tyler Ennis and Kendall Marshall. IMO, there is not much difference except one is still in the NBA.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I remember Tyler Ennis and Kendall Marshall. IMO, there is not much difference except one is still in the NBA.

I think Tyler Ennis is a little less headstrong and should have a role in this league similar to that of Ronnie Price. But I'd rather take a chance on Jawun Evans if he's still there at 32. Or maybe even trade into the late first round for him? I think he's going to be a high level backup point guard for a decade plus and might even be a starter in the right situation.

 

[Errntknght]

I remember Tyler Ennis and Kendall Marshall. IMO, there is not much difference except one is still in the NBA.

Except you never got to see much of Ennis... he played under 200 minutes for us, in dribs and drabs, mostly in garbage time - unless you tuned into the D-league games, like I did. He's much quicker and faster than Kendall and penetrates a fair amount, while K. never did. The real killer for Kendall was his defense - he couldn't stay in front of anyone, while Ennis is average in that regard. On offense, Ennis plays much like Ulis - he likes to get to the middle of the floor and make plays from there or find an opening to shoot. He's cool under pressure, too, like Ulis. He also lacks Kendall's huge ego, which is enough to set them apart on it's own. All in all, he's not a bad choice for a backup.

I remember watching his first D-league game - he had their offense looking more organized than the Suns off. did within a few minutes.

 

[Mainstreet]

I think Tyler Ennis is a little less headstrong and should have a role in this league similar to that of Ronnie Price. But I'd rather take a chance on Jawun Evans if he's still there at 32. Or maybe even trade into the late first round for him? I think he's going to be a high level backup point guard for a decade plus and might even be a starter in the right situation.

I've seen you mention Jawun Evans before. I have to tell you I like what I see.

I've haven't watched much tape on him but he seems to be in mode of Tyler Ulis in regard to being under 6 foot and the ability to run a team. Question marks surround his ability to get his shot off against bigger opponents in the lane, however, every prospect has some kind of weakness.

I guess I'm hoping the Suns look at Bell or Bam at #32 as insurance if Len signs elsewhere.

However, I'd take a chance on Evans any day over Price and Ennis. This is probably being unfair because Evans appears to have more upside. The main thing is the Suns hit on #32 so I'm game if the Suns draft him.

 

[sunsfan88]

Honestly. I am as much concerned about the second round picks as the #4. I really want to move up and take Jordan Bell. He is a difference maker. Not sure how far we would have to move up to do it.

Isn't Jordan Bell more like an athletic version of Alan Williams?

If the Suns are planning on bringing Williams back (which I absolutely think they should) then I don't see much of a need for Bell.

 

[Finito]

Isn't Jordan Bell more like an athletic version of Alan Williams?

If the Suns are planning on bringing Williams back (which I absolutely think they should) then I don't see much of a need for Bell.

If you can upgrade a position you do it I don't care how much of a fan favorite a guy is

 

[JCSunsfan]

Yep. I think of Bell as a bigger stronger PJ Tucker. He can defend 4 positions. But offensively he is a center or traditional pf.

 

[devilalum]

Isn't Jordan Bell more like an athletic version of Alan Williams?

If the Suns are planning on bringing Williams back (which I absolutely think they should) then I don't see much of a need for Bell.

Williams may be my favorite player but he is a role player. I definitely like him as a backup.


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[chickenhead]

I have no issue with Jackson being the target, but do think the worry that he won't fall to us might be causing us to overrate his trade value. There are some very promising players following him on the board.

 

[Covert Rain]

We are probably not communicating here.

I'm talking about using the #32 pick and adding some enticements (second round picks) to move up e.g., to #30. The Suns would not be able to move up far, but a couple of notches might land them a center/PF they like.

I'm not talking about moving up from #4.

However, I would look at options to trade down at #4 say to #6 with the Magic. Of course the Magic would have to make it worthwhile and the Suns would have to like a player that would be there at this slot.

Yeah, I misunderstood because you mentioned trading down and FOX in the same sentence. Which to me suggested trading down a spot or two and still trying to land FOX. Which I don't think happens because he is gone in the top 5.

Either way, you could do what you said above and move up to #30 as you stated above but at that part of the draft? You are going to get the same type of player even moving up 2 spots.

It REALLY sucks we didn't get the pick we should have gotten. That would have given us a ton of leverage, you could have moved down a spot or two and parlayed that into something I would think.

 

[leclerc]

Someone said we need better players not more players. If Jackson impresses way better than the other options at #4 then I hope McD goes after him.

 

[sunsfan88]

Williams may be my favorite player but he is a role player. I definitely like him as a backup.


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Jordan Bell will never be anything more than a role player either. He will be a backup on any half decent team in the NBA.

 

[sunsfan88]

If you can upgrade a position you do it I don't care how much of a fan favorite a guy is

I don't care about him being a fan favorite, if we have a player that's very similar already then what's the point?

I'm only for upgrading players with similar skill sets if it means we're replacing a starter (such as Fox for Bledsoe for example).

Replacing Alan Williams isn't a priority. And like I said, I'm not at all sure I see the big differences between the two besides an athleticism edge.

 

[sunsfan88]

Yep. I think of Bell as a bigger stronger PJ Tucker. He can defend 4 positions. But offensively he is a center or traditional pf.

Whoa no way. I don't even think he can defend any PFs, he's a strict center who isn't all that mobile. Alan Williams can't defend four positions or even PFs and nor can Bell.

He doesn't have any skills offensively besides finishing easy layups and such.

I think Bell's ceiling will be center version of Kenneth Faried and his floor will be Alan Williams.

 

[Mainstreet]

Yeah, I misunderstood because you mentioned trading down and FOX in the same sentence. Which to me suggested trading down a spot or two and still trying to land FOX. Which I don't think happens because he is gone in the top 5.

Either way, you could do what you said above and move up to #30 as you stated above but at that part of the draft? You are going to get the same type of player even moving up 2 spots.

It REALLY sucks we didn't get the pick we should have gotten. That would have given us a ton of leverage, you could have moved down a spot or two and parlayed that into something I would think.

In the second round, moving up a spot or two from #32 can mean the difference between getting a player that can contribute or one that does not make the roster. This is why I was toying with the idea of adding another second round pick or two to move up slightly. That said, I still think the Suns can land a good player at #32. Tyler Ulis was drafted at #34.

I agree, if the Suns landed the 1st or 2nd pick in the lottery they would have a better chance of moving around a bit in the 1st round and still get a player they want. Maybe they still do.

I'm hoping the Suns stay at #4 and watch teams trip over each other with the first three picks.

 

[GatorAZ]

Yep. I think of Bell as a bigger stronger PJ Tucker. He can defend 4 positions. But offensively he is a center or traditional pf.

Fastest shuttle time in combine history. Dude is a freak.

 

[Hoop Head]

I don't see Bell being too similar to Alan Williams other than both being undersized centers. Bell has a lot more speed, both are high motor players as well. I agree with @JCSunsfan, he's more like a big PJ Tucker, at least the Tucker we had the first 2 years he was here.

I hope we can swing a trade to get a pick in the early to mid 20's, trading our 2 second rounders and maybe a future 2nd. Maybe Knight to Brooklyn for their 27th pick. I mentioned they're a team that might gamble on Knight given their current situation and their pick doesn't hold much value, surely Knight is better than who they'd pick there.

 

[Raze]

After watching film on the top 9 freshmen I'm flabbergasted that Jackson isn't widely considered the top prospect in the draft. It's as if people completely forget that you have to play all 3 aspects of the game: Offense, Defense, and Transition. He is a great Defender, runs well and is alert in transition, and his aggressiveness on offense makes up for his lack of form on his shot. This guy oozes effort and desire and is in on EVERY single play. He's also probably the most gifted athlete in the draft.

Sure, his shot is questionable and his FTs are worse. But I'm far more concerned with Fultz's lackadaisical approach the game. I've seen Fultz on multiple occasions quit on a play on D or just gear down in transition to let a man score. Not to mention his questionable finishing around the rim, some times lazy handles, and seeming lack of ability to carry his team to wins. Great shooter to be sure, attacks the lane, nice shots in the lane, nice jab step to release, athletic and strong... but what about heart? I have concerns about his love for the game and desire to be great. That's one thing I don't question about Jackson.

Jackson on the other hand is a great finisher, has good handles at 6-8, attacks the rim, smart and athletic Defender (shows great body position when off the ball), and hustles on every play including transition. He will be an immediate upgrade in all facets of the game. This guy wants to win and wants to be great. At least that's what the film shows.

If Jackson is there at #4 you run to the podium and take him.
If we think he's going at #3 and the cost is right, make the trade. We have a plethora of young talent so future picks become less valuable (if the meter is rising).
If he isn't there, Tatum and Isaac are talented big men that will be great consolation prizes. Don't touch Ball unless you want Phoenix to become a circus.

 

[mojorizen7]

#4 J.Jackson
#32 B. Adebayo

That's an A+ draft for me, and more importantly for the Suns IMO.
But...Philly will take Jackson and Bam will be gone.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I hinted about this in another post but IMO, if Jackson works out and confirms what the better videos show of him, he won't be there at 4 or 3. Boston will either take him first or trade with Philly and I don't see us competing with the Celtics offer in that Fultz looks tailor-made to play alongside Simmons.