Target JACKSON

[JCSunsfan]

Whoa no way. I don't even think he can defend any PFs, he's a strict center who isn't all that mobile. Alan Williams can't defend four positions or even PFs and nor can Bell.

He doesn't have any skills offensively besides finishing easy layups and such.

I think Bell's ceiling will be center version of Kenneth Faried and his floor will be Alan Williams.

Bell is alot more versatile defensively than Faried. These articles are why I say he can defend 4 positions. These are just a few. There are many more. He is a 6-9 player who posted a historic record in the shuttle run. I cannot imagine anyone saying Jordan Bell "is not that mobile." He has freaky speed and a 37 inch vertical. Yes his offense lacks. Of course it does or he would be a top 10 pick.


A lot of the intrigue around Bell in the NBA stems from the versatility and impact that he can have on the defensive end of the floor. Despite his lack of ideal size and length, he is a tremendous weak side shot blocker, and shows incredible timing rotating over off the ball and protecting the rim. He averaged 3.1 blocks per 40 minutes, with many of those coming in highlight reel fashion. He controls the paint in the half court as an interior shot blocking presence and has the speed and leaping ability to make chase down blocks in transition. Outside of his shot blocking ability, he also has great anticipation getting into passing lanes, and has the lateral quickness to be able to switch onto smaller guards on the perimeter. His ability to switch ball screens on the perimeter and guard multiple positions will be huge for his ability to stay on the floor at the next level. At just 6'9 he does struggle to guard more traditional big men on the block, but the modern style of the NBA favors Bell's ability to stay on the floor in small ball lineups and spend time plugging gaps and guarding multiple positions. - Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Jordan-Bell-70316/ ©DraftExpress


Bell's do it all defensive and rebounding style of play has definitely played well at the Combine and it would not be surprising to see him potentially get looks from NBA teams at the end of the first round of some draft boards. Bell initially registered a shuttle time of 2.56, which would have been the best mark in the history of our database, but for some reason that was disqualified. - Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Jordan-Bell-70316/ ©DraftExpress

During his junior season at Oregon, Bell showed that he could do everything on the defensive end and received the 2017 PAC 12 Defensive Player of the Year award. His 38-inch vertical made Bell a looming threat on any shot taken in the paint, even in transition where he can keep up with the speed of guards. His jump does not require much preparation allowing him to heavily contest unexpected shot.
https://thesixersense.com/2017/05/1...jordan-bell-drawing-attention-2017-nba-draft/

When Oregon and North Carolina clash in the Final Four on Saturday night, the Tar Heels will have to account for more than Bell’s ability to protect the rim. Not only does Bell choke off passing lanes with his long arms at the head of Oregon’s 2-2-1 press, his presence also allows the Ducks to switch every ball screen because he is mobile enough to stay in front of opposing guards.

“Anytime he switches onto me during practice, it’s always really tough because the dude’s 6-9 and he moves like a guard,” Oregon point guard Casey Benson said. “He has meant so much to our defense. He’s always flying around, being so active and bringing so much energy.” https://sports.yahoo.com/news/how-o...lege-basketballs-best-defender-015401064.html

"He impacts the game in so many ways defensively," one GM said. "His ability to switch and guard four, maybe five positions is his real value in the league." http://www.oregonlive.com/nba/index.ssf/2017/05/jordan_bells_stock_rising_at_n.html

 

[AzStevenCal]

Bell is alot more versatile defensively than Faried. These articles are why I say he can defend 4 positions. These are just a few. There are many more. He is a 6-9 player who posted a historic record in the shuttle run. I cannot imagine anyone saying Jordan Bell "is not that mobile." He has freaky speed and a 37 inch vertical. Yes his offense lacks. Of course it does or he would be a top 10 pick.

I wouldn't read too much into that. First off, I'm pretty sure I read that the "record" claim had been retracted. Also, it's the same test that Booker led in his combine. From what I've read, results are greatly improved by practice and, unlike the NFL, a lot of players do not prepare. The reactive shuttle drill has only been in play for 6 or 7 years and the top athletes often skip it anyway. Regardless of whether he's historically special, he is quick, fast and reacts well.

 

[sunsfan88]

Bell is alot more versatile defensively than Faried. These articles are why I say he can defend 4 positions. These are just a few. There are many more. He is a 6-9 player who posted a historic record in the shuttle run. I cannot imagine anyone saying Jordan Bell "is not that mobile." He has freaky speed and a 37 inch vertical. Yes his offense lacks. Of course it does or he would be a top 10 pick.


A lot of the intrigue around Bell in the NBA stems from the versatility and impact that he can have on the defensive end of the floor. Despite his lack of ideal size and length, he is a tremendous weak side shot blocker, and shows incredible timing rotating over off the ball and protecting the rim. He averaged 3.1 blocks per 40 minutes, with many of those coming in highlight reel fashion. He controls the paint in the half court as an interior shot blocking presence and has the speed and leaping ability to make chase down blocks in transition. Outside of his shot blocking ability, he also has great anticipation getting into passing lanes, and has the lateral quickness to be able to switch onto smaller guards on the perimeter. His ability to switch ball screens on the perimeter and guard multiple positions will be huge for his ability to stay on the floor at the next level. At just 6'9 he does struggle to guard more traditional big men on the block, but the modern style of the NBA favors Bell's ability to stay on the floor in small ball lineups and spend time plugging gaps and guarding multiple positions. - Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Jordan-Bell-70316/ ©DraftExpress


Bell's do it all defensive and rebounding style of play has definitely played well at the Combine and it would not be surprising to see him potentially get looks from NBA teams at the end of the first round of some draft boards. Bell initially registered a shuttle time of 2.56, which would have been the best mark in the history of our database, but for some reason that was disqualified. - Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Jordan-Bell-70316/ ©DraftExpress

During his junior season at Oregon, Bell showed that he could do everything on the defensive end and received the 2017 PAC 12 Defensive Player of the Year award. His 38-inch vertical made Bell a looming threat on any shot taken in the paint, even in transition where he can keep up with the speed of guards. His jump does not require much preparation allowing him to heavily contest unexpected shot.
https://thesixersense.com/2017/05/1...jordan-bell-drawing-attention-2017-nba-draft/

When Oregon and North Carolina clash in the Final Four on Saturday night, the Tar Heels will have to account for more than Bell’s ability to protect the rim. Not only does Bell choke off passing lanes with his long arms at the head of Oregon’s 2-2-1 press, his presence also allows the Ducks to switch every ball screen because he is mobile enough to stay in front of opposing guards.

“Anytime he switches onto me during practice, it’s always really tough because the dude’s 6-9 and he moves like a guard,” Oregon point guard Casey Benson said. “He has meant so much to our defense. He’s always flying around, being so active and bringing so much energy.” https://sports.yahoo.com/news/how-o...lege-basketballs-best-defender-015401064.html

"He impacts the game in so many ways defensively," one GM said. "His ability to switch and guard four, maybe five positions is his real value in the league." http://www.oregonlive.com/nba/index.ssf/2017/05/jordan_bells_stock_rising_at_n.html

Most of those are saying that he has the capability to switch on the guards and forwards.

That doesn't mean he can guard them full time like Tucker to do for us.

It just means that Bell can switch on screens for spot duty and maybe not get embarrassed.

I'll say maybe his ceiling is higher than Kenneth Faried and maybe it's more similar to a poor man's Tristian Thompson who of course famously defended Steph Curry and Klay Thompson well in the Finals last season when switched on them. That doesn't mean the Cavs will ever make him their initial defender on them like I assume nobody would make Bell the initial and primary defender on any guard or even SF.

Don't get me wrong, if he lives up to the hype then I would be thrilled if we can get a poor man's Tristian Thompson type player in the 2nd round.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I would trade up to get him. Both second rounders and BK to someone who wants a guard? BK cannot be considered negative value in this scenario.

 

[leclerc]

I don't see Bell being too similar to Alan Williams other than both being undersized centers. Bell has a lot more speed, both are high motor players as well. I agree with @JCSunsfan, he's more like a big PJ Tucker, at least the Tucker we had the first 2 years he was here.

I hope we can swing a trade to get a pick in the early to mid 20's, trading our 2 second rounders and maybe a future 2nd. Maybe Knight to Brooklyn for their 27th pick. I mentioned they're a team that might gamble on Knight given their current situation and their pick doesn't hold much value, surely Knight is better than who they'd pick there.

Sure, yes please to Jordan Bell and please oh please trade Knight for anything.

#4 should be a starter, I don't think anyone there is as raw as Bender, so hopefully earn the starting PG or SF by preseason or before the break. At least this time give the new guy 15 consistent mpg instead of the Bender nonsense last year, promising one thing early on and then be wildly inconsistent with the PT.

Len/Chandler (subject to change)
Chriss, Bender, A1
Warren, new guy/trade
Booker, need someone here
Bledsoe/new guy, Ulis

I hope we resign Len and get Jackson, Tatum or Isaac. If Fox is really good then move Bledsoe. I doubt Bledsoe is willing to be sixth man of the year SG...

 

[pokerface]

Mannnn all it would take to lock up Jackson is our #4 and some Miami pick which we have no idea the value would be. Big deal. We got two picks from Miami for Dragic...all we need is one of them for Jackson.


Jackson with Chriss would be DA BOMB

 

[Folster]

Mannnn all it would take to lock up Jackson is our #4 and some Miami pick which we have no idea the value would be. Big deal. We got two picks from Miami for Dragic...all we need is one of them for Jackson.

Jackson with Chriss would be DA BOMB

Is this speculation or did you read/hear it somewhere?

 

[hsandhu]

Surprised people are hesitating giving up the first miami pick. Im higher on tatum than most, but would have no problem giving up that pick to swap with philly.

It's a top 7 protected pick next year, only way we get an unprotected pick in 2019 is if miamI is one of the 7 worst teams, highly unlikely since they finished the season 31 -10. It will very likely be a mid round pick, late lottery at best.

I understand not giving up the 2021 unprotected, if miami strikes out with big time free agents between now and then that could be a high pick.

 

[Hoop Head]

Mannnn all it would take to lock up Jackson is our #4 and some Miami pick which we have no idea the value would be. Big deal. We got two picks from Miami for Dragic...all we need is one of them for Jackson.


Jackson with Chriss would be DA BOMB

I'd like Jackson but not at that cost. The Miami pick(s) are too much, especially at this stage. I don't think it would be worth it to trade 1 of the Miami picks and ours to move up to #1 to ensure we get who we want.

Teams haven't held individual workouts yet, we don't know how Jackson's workout with the Suns, Sixers, and most likely Lakers and Celtics will play out. At this stage there are too many questions to try and move up just 1 spot to target anyone. That 1 spot might mean nothing if he ends up going to Boston or LA, and it's possible that happens.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I'd like Jackson but not at that cost. The Miami pick(s) are too much, especially at this stage. I don't think it would be worth it to trade 1 of the Miami picks and ours to move up to #1 to ensure we get who we want.

Teams haven't held individual workouts yet, we don't know how Jackson's workout with the Suns, Sixers, and most likely Lakers and Celtics will play out. At this stage there are too many questions to try and move up just 1 spot to target anyone. That 1 spot might mean nothing if he ends up going to Boston or LA, and it's possible that happens.

I disagree. This really overvalues those picks. If Jackson is the player we think he is, you give up that pick to get him and don't look back.

I don't usually agree with Pokerface, but I am all in on this one.

 

[leclerc]

His horrendous shooting bothers me though...

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'd like Jackson but not at that cost. The Miami pick(s) are too much, especially at this stage. I don't think it would be worth it to trade 1 of the Miami picks and ours to move up to #1 to ensure we get who we want.

Teams haven't held individual workouts yet, we don't know how Jackson's workout with the Suns, Sixers, and most likely Lakers and Celtics will play out. At this stage there are too many questions to try and move up just 1 spot to target anyone. That 1 spot might mean nothing if he ends up going to Boston or LA, and it's possible that happens.

I disagree. This really overvalues those picks. If Jackson is the player we think he is, you give up that pick to get him and don't look back..

It appears you two are disagreeing but IMO there's not much difference here. I agree with both of you, or at least my interpretation of both posts. Jackson might be worth the extra pick but we don't know that yet nor do we know if it will even be enough.

 

[JCSunsfan]

His horrendous shooting bothers me though...

You mean horrendous free throw shooting? He went 34/90 from the 3 this year and 55% from the two.

 

[JCSunsfan]

It appears you two are disagreeing but IMO there's not much difference here. I agree with both of you, or at least my interpretation of both posts. Jackson might be worth the extra pick but we don't know that yet nor do we know if it will even be enough.

Wouldn't it be funny if he went to LA? So Boston takes Fultz. LA takes Jackson, and then who does Philly take? They do not need a primary distributing PG like Ball. They need a combo guard or shooting 2.

 

[AzStevenCal]

[QUOTE="JCSunsfan, post: 3511444, member: 369"]Wouldn't it be funny if he went to LA? So Boston takes Fultz. LA takes Jackson, and then who does Philly take? They do not need a primary distributing PG like Ball. They need a combo guard or shooting 2.[/QUOTE]

I think if he works out like many believe he will, he'll be gone by the time the Lakers pick. But it certainly would make for an intriguing draft if the Lakers did take him at their spot. I can just imagine the Lavar interviews. The first one should go viral, the one he does the day after will frame the situation in a wholly different light and will likely paint him and Lonzo as victims and/or heroes in some way.

 

[pokerface]

It appears you two are disagreeing but IMO there's not much difference here. I agree with both of you, or at least my interpretation of both posts. Jackson might be worth the extra pick but we don't know that yet nor do we know if it will even be enough.

A #4 plus a Miami pick would seem like a very hard offer to turn down. At least from the perspective of another team trying to trade up in the draft. Thats the point of doing a Miami pick with our #4 because it probably blows most other offers out of the water and gets a deal done.


We really shouldn't do a mickey mouse trade for Jackson.. get it done!

 

[JCSunsfan]

A #4 plus a Miami pick would seem like a very hard offer to turn down. At least from the perspective of another team trying to trade up in the draft. Thats the point of doing a Miami pick with our #4 because it probably blows most other offers out of the water and gets a deal done.


We really shouldn't do a mickey mouse trade for Jackson.. get it done!

If Jackson is our guy, we have assets. You give up assets to get him. This is basketball. Only 5 on the court at a time. A single better player beats multiple players every time.

 

[Raze]

If Jackson is our guy, we have assets. You give up assets to get him. This is basketball. Only 5 on the court at a time. A single better player beats multiple players every time.

True, and we're already loaded with young talent. Where are these future picks going to play? Right now we have 4 teenagers in Booker, Bender, Chriss, and Jones. Len, Warren, and Ulis are all sub 23.

Ulis and Booker are the future at back court. (Although I see Ulis as a 6th man)
Bender, Warren, and Chriss are the future at front court.
Len is C.

We're pushing it by even adding 1 more sub 23 year old. But Jackson is worth it.

Maybe we can even package up some combo of #32, the Miami pick, EB, BK, or Warren to grab another top 10 pick (Sacramento maybe). Dennis Smith is an actual PG with a very high ceiling. I'd love to add a PG with range, a pass first mentality, a rim attacker, and NOT be under 6 feet tall.

Then we have:

PG Smith, Ulis
SG Booker
SF Jackson, Bender
PF Chriss
C Len

We'd have two pass first PG's to set up Booker and have field days setting up Jackson and Chriss near the rim. Plus we'd have guys actually playing natural positions. We'd have good depth on the bench with vet leaders at least until the young guys meet their potential. In 2 years that'd be a heck of a team.

 

[pokerface]

If Jackson is our guy, we have assets. You give up assets to get him. This is basketball. Only 5 on the court at a time. A single better player beats multiple players every time.

I agree. It would be different if we needed to add youth because our team is older but that is not the case.

Also, we need to keep in mind that the faster we get this team on track and back in the playoffs the faster we start attracting quality free agents.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Dennis Smith is an actual PG with a very high ceiling. I'd love to add a PG with range, a pass first mentality, a rim attacker, and NOT be under 6 feet tall.

We'd have two pass first PG's to set up Booker and have field days setting up Jackson and Chriss near the rim. Plus we'd have guys actually playing natural positions. We'd have good depth on the bench with vet leaders at least until the young guys meet their potential. In 2 years that'd be a heck of a team.

You're much higher on Smith than I am. I wouldn't spend a top 10 pick on a player with his knees even if he were a complete player and Smith, while incredibly explosive, is far from complete. I also wouldn't call him a pass first PG.

He has the skills to be a very good playmaker but he's shown the tendency to shoot first more often than not. That might be due to the lack of talent around him but that's hard to tell. And he's not exactly ideal in size either. He's not much taller than Bledsoe but he gives up 4.5 inches in wingspan which is a huge difference when it comes to getting your shot off in a crowd and especially when it comes to defending.

And when it comes to defense, Harden appears to be his NBA model despite having the lateral quickness and athleticism to thrive on D. I think I'd prefer Fox or even Ulis over Smith as our starter, even if he were already on our team and we weren't having to even consider investing a top pick in him.

 

[Raze]

You're much higher on Smith than I am. I wouldn't spend a top 10 pick on a player with his knees even if he were a complete player and Smith, while incredibly explosive, is far from complete. I also wouldn't call him a pass first PG.

He has the skills to be a very good playmaker but he's shown the tendency to shoot first more often than not. That might be due to the lack of talent around him but that's hard to tell. And he's not exactly ideal in size either. He's not much taller than Bledsoe but he gives up 4.5 inches in wingspan which is a huge difference when it comes to getting your shot off in a crowd and especially when it comes to defending.

And when it comes to defense, Harden appears to be his NBA model despite having the lateral quickness and athleticism to thrive on D. I think I'd prefer Fox or even Ulis over Smith as our starter, even if he were already on our team and we weren't having to even consider investing a top pick in him.

Yes, but the problem with Fox is that he's a small OG that CAN pass. But he's not a true PG. He's always looking to score first. We have two of those Kentucky players already on the team. And yes, I'm tired of signing these guys. With a weapon like Booker you want a back court mate that is looking to set him up. I don't see Fox doing that. In fact, he had a sharp shooter in Monk and still spent most of his time looking for his own shot. I'm just not a fan of those guys when they're 6-3 and can't shoot outside. Remember, that guy just shot 24% from 3. That is absolutely awful. (Although I think his form is fixable and he'll end up a good shooter).

With the near extinction of pass first PGs that can shoot, Dennis is about as close as it comes. His 6.2 assists on a crappy team speaks volumes for his play making ability. DraftExpress put it this way "he posted a solid 6.8 assists per-40 pace adjusted, the fourth best rate in our Top-100, as he is capable of creating space, surveying the floor and passing the ball with either hand out of pick and roll situations, sometimes in very impressive fashion." - Source: http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Dennis-Smith-76448/ ©DraftExpress

When I watch film, I look for patterns in play. I see his head always up. I see him surveying the floor. I see him taking matters into his own hands presumably because his team NEEDED him to. I see highly instinctive passing that can not be taught both in the half court and in the full court. I see him running the offense, at times, like his HC wants. However, like you said he was looking to shoot possibly because of the lack of talent. I see a shot that can be easily tinkered with to increase success. (Not like the absolute freak show in Ball). I see a lot of tools in his belt. He reminds me of a less twitchy Tim Hardaway. I know, BOLD comparison. But if you actually look at Timmy's college stats they aren't that much different. (And Tim was a senior.)

I'm not saying he doesn't have warts. They all do. And I agree about his ACL. That's a huge cause for concern. I would want a complete clearance from my medical staff on him. And yes, has to commit to D. But he's extremely talented and I think he'd be a better fit with Booker than Fox. There's a good chance he slides out of the top 10 because of that knee. If he slides to, say 13 I'd pounce on it. But I'm still fine with taking a shot on his talent at 10-ish. (presuming we'd even get a trade.)

 

[Russ Smith]

So the question on Jackson now becomes the anger management situation. Is it standard when sentencing someone to anger management to require they abstain from using drugs and alcohol, or was that put in specifically because of something? My guess is it's standard but that's really going to be the key to how this revelation impacts his draft stock IMO. If they put that in there because of a past history with him, it'll probably hurt him, if it's just standard in all anger management sentences, then it won't hurt him at all. We knew one of the incidents was outside a bar and it's certainly no revelation a college student drinks, so my guess is it's just part of a standard punishment and not specific to him.

 

[elindholm]

It's a top 7 protected pick next year, only way we get an unprotected pick in 2019 is if miamI is one of the 7 worst teams

Or if they are a low lottery seed but move up to the top three.

highly unlikely since they finished the season 31 -10. It will very likely be a mid round pick, late lottery at best.

Their roster looks thin to me, they have a lot of players to re-sign, and they don't have a lot of financial space to work with. They deserve a lot of credit for how they finished the season, but how do they get better?

 

[leclerc]

The question is how bad can they get? Seems like Miami is not the tanking types.

 

[Finito]

The question is how bad can they get? Seems like Miami is not the tanking types.

They sucked and drafted Wade