The 2007-08 Los Angeles Lakers thread

[KloD]

That's just dumb IMO. I have spent plenty of time reading about the history of the Minny and LA Lakers. I've watched many specials about those teams. I've done the work. I enjoy them even though I wasnt born.

Not sure we are bragging about them per se. They (the 14 titles) exist. Not sure what the issue is.

You've done the work? Reading about a team, watching specials about them is somehow an accomplishment????

 

[abomb]

You've done the work? Reading about a team, watching specials about them is somehow an accomplishment????

Sure, it's called being a fan. If you had your way I suppose we'd all sit on our hands.

 

[D-Dogg]

You've done the work? Reading about a team, watching specials about them is somehow an accomplishment????

The successful pursuit of knowledge is an accomplishment. I would have never seen Gail Goodrich play if I hadn't had Laker dvds of old games, but that guy was a stud. Baylor is one of the greatest players of all time..confirmed by my eyes watching tape and books I've read with other people's comments.

You can't legitimately say that you can't appreciate the history of your team just because you haven't seen it, nor can you revel in that history. With my kids, they don't just see the Lakers current players; I teach them the history. Thus, my daughter smiled when Jerry West was presenting the WCF trophy and was suprised that he was there. She thinks it is very cool that he played for the team, then was the "boss" of the team (as she understands the role) was the man who drafted Kobe, and is the NBA Logo shadow. I think being a fan involves understanding the history of your team and respecting it. The franchise doesn't just live within your lifetime (well, for some it does, but you get the point).

 

[KloD]

I guess that's just what being a fan is all about. Total immersion. To me, the number of titles is a legitimate talking point in this series, due to the title count is so close, and the fact that the C's put a whooping on the Lakers so many times. With the Spurs the old titles argument was not drug out...it was more focused on titles in the current decade. Jazz and Denver? No title talk was thrown around.

I kind of understand what you are saying, but I don't agree completely.

I don't mean to offend, I guess I'm trying to understand the thinking is all. I've been a Red Sox fan since I was three and saw them play. Most would call me a big fan, I hate the Yankees with a passion, but even when the Sox came back being down 0-3, though I was estatic, I didn't feel I had something to brag about to my Yankee friends. I've played in organized sports most of my life and I can't remember talking trash about teams I've played on, let alone just rooted for.

I don't expect anyone to agree with me, I'm just laying out my perspective.

 

[KloD]

Sure, it's called being a fan. If you had your way I suppose we'd all sit on our hands.

Nice edit....

I don't know why you can't see the difference between cheering for a team and bragging about their accomplishments?

 

[KloD]

The successful pursuit of knowledge is an accomplishment. I would have never seen Gail Goodrich play if I hadn't had Laker dvds of old games, but that guy was a stud. Baylor is one of the greatest players of all time..confirmed by my eyes watching tape and books I've read with other people's comments.

You can't legitimately say that you can't appreciate the history of your team just because you haven't seen it, nor can you revel in that history. With my kids, they don't just see the Lakers current players; I teach them the history. Thus, my daughter smiled when Jerry West was presenting the WCF trophy and was suprised that he was there. She thinks it is very cool that he played for the team, then was the "boss" of the team (as she understands the role) was the man who drafted Kobe, and is the NBA Logo shadow. I think being a fan involves understanding the history of your team and respecting it. The franchise doesn't just live within your lifetime (well, for some it does, but you get the point).

I do get the point and I agree. Let me back up... I completely understand and relate to enjoying ones team history.. been there, done that. My only point was the trash talking... that's it. Like I said, I'm just coming from a different perspective. I think you understand my point.

 

[D-Dogg]

I don't mean to offend, I guess I'm trying to understand the thinking is all. I've been a Red Sox fan since I was three and saw them play. Most would call me a big fan, I hate the Yankees with a passion, but even when the Sox came back being down 0-3, though I was estatic, I didn't feel I had something to brag about to my Yankee friends. I've played in organized sports most of my life and I can't remember talking trash about teams I've played on, let alone just rooted for.

I don't expect anyone to agree with me, I'm just laying out my perspective.

Ah, there's the difference. I'm apparently a total trash talker..I never realized it, but my wife couldn't stand watching me play basketball when I was younger because I became "a different person" in her words. Major league cocky ********. Also her words.

So maybe being a bragging ***** is more personality trait than fan thing. I would have been running into every Yankee fan I could find and asking them how they could lose to such a cursed franchise....then demand Babe Ruth back. Then laugh maniacally.

 

[KloD]

Ah, there's the difference. I'm apparently a total trash talker..I never realized it, but my wife couldn't stand watching me play basketball when I was younger because I became "a different person" in her words. Major league cocky ********. Also her words.

So maybe being a bragging ***** is more personality trait than fan thing. I would have been running into every Yankee fan I could find and asking them how they could lose to such a cursed franchise....then demand Babe Ruth back. Then laugh maniacally.

You may be right!

 

[Joe L]

Ah, there's the difference. I'm apparently a total trash talker..I never realized it, but my wife couldn't stand watching me play basketball when I was younger because I became "a different person" in her words. Major league cocky ********. Also her words.

So maybe being a bragging ***** is more personality trait than fan thing. I would have been running into every Yankee fan I could find and asking them how they could lose to such a cursed franchise....then demand Babe Ruth back. Then laugh maniacally.

...did you ever end up looking like this after some trash talk:

You must be registered for see images attach

I had friends end up like that for the very same reason. Just asking.

 

[Darth Llama]

Funny thing is, when I was a little kid, I actually hated the Lakers. I'm from California, I was born in Inglewood, and EVERYONE loved the Lakers, it was all you ever heard about. I was totally into baseball till junior high school, I really only cared about the Angels even though they always sucked. It was about 8th to 9th grade that I started liking basketball, and I got really into the Lakers. Am I a life long fan? I guess techinically not, but I started liking then when I was around 14-15 so I guess I have liked them for a while.

There are a ton of people on forums all over the net that argue peoples fan hood. Rather you always liked a team, how long you liked them, where you live, where you're from, it's all just silly. I'm proud of what the Lakers accomplished over the history of their career, to me it's like being proud of the history of your state or your country, or your family lineage. I don't claim I was there, and I don't take any personal credit. I'll be the first one to admit that the three titles we won from 2000-2003 are by far the most meaningful to me. Not that I don't appreciate the Lakers of old, I do, but the current rendition is the one that matters most to me. It's funny to think I didn't get into them till after the Showtime Era. When I started liking the Lakers, they actually weren't all that good.

 

[D-Dogg]

...did you ever end up looking like this after some trash talk:

You must be registered for see images attach

I had friends end up like that for the very same reason. Just asking.

I've had my share of fights on the court...but not too many. I got a lot of bloody noses from catching elbows guarding people too tight. Any shock why I like Sasha?

 

[Joe L]

I've had my share of fights on the court...but not too many. I got a lot of bloody noses from catching elbows guarding people too tight. Any shock why I like Sasha?

Speaking of sasha, I wonder if he decides to leave after this season. I don't think so but I am sure he could start for a lot of teams. If he catches the "I should start" bug, I wonder if he would be willing to leave and get "paid" somewhere else? Over at the Clippers board his name keeps popping up and would love to have him. I guess I am to blame for throwing his name out. He is my favorite Laker and if we get the chance to get him I would have to steal your avatar.

*wishful thinking...I know.

 

[KloD]

Funny thing is, when I was a little kid, I actually hated the Lakers. I'm from California, I was born in Inglewood, and EVERYONE loved the Lakers, it was all you ever heard about. I was totally into baseball till junior high school, I really only cared about the Angels even though they always sucked. It was about 8th to 9th grade that I started liking basketball, and I got really into the Lakers. Am I a life long fan? I guess techinically not, but I started liking then when I was around 14-15 so I guess I have liked them for a while.

There are a ton of people on forums all over the net that argue peoples fan hood. Rather you always liked a team, how long you liked them, where you live, where you're from, it's all just silly. I'm proud of what the Lakers accomplished over the history of their career, to me it's like being proud of the history of your state or your country, or your family lineage. I don't claim I was there, and I don't take any personal credit. I'll be the first one to admit that the three titles we won from 2000-2003 are by far the most meaningful to me. Not that I don't appreciate the Lakers of old, I do, but the current rendition is the one that matters most to me. It's funny to think I didn't get into them till after the Showtime Era. When I started liking the Lakers, they actually weren't all that good.

*sigh*
My point was about braggin about number of championships when the person wasn't even a fan (for whatever reason) for the vast majority of them.

As far as the bandwagon comment... I used to have these women in my office who decided to become Packers fans right after they won the Superbowl. They would talk trash all the time. Same thing happened with N.E.. It's hard for me to take that kind of "fan" serious. I will restate my position after some thought... If one is willing to stick through the bad years too, I have no issue with that.

I'll also say that if the Cards ever do win anything, I won't say a word about the trash talk that will follow... those folks have earned it after the hell they put up with season after season.

 

[D-Dogg]

Speaking of sasha, I wonder if he decides to leave after this season. I don't think so but I am sure he could start for a lot of teams. If he catches the "I should start" bug, I wonder if he would be willing to leave and get "paid" somewhere else? Over at the Clippers board his name keeps popping up and would love to have him. I guess I am to blame for throwing his name out. He is my favorite Laker and if we get the chance to get him I would have to steal your avatar.

*wishful thinking...I know.

Sasha is one of those guys I really hope we pay for...perfect roleplayer on this team. Phil has a ton of confidence in him, and he's one of those players that can really shine in the triangle. He's a restricted FA, along with Ronny. I'm curious to see how we respond to those guys.

I sure hope you never get my avatar.

 

[Darth Llama]

*sigh*
My point was about braggin about number of championships when the person wasn't even a fan (for whatever reason) for the vast majority of them.

As far as the bandwagon comment... I used to have these women in my office who decided to become Packers fans right after they won the Superbowl. They would talk trash all the time. Same thing happened with N.E.. It's hard for me to take that kind of "fan" serious. I will restate my position after some thought... If one is willing to stick through the bad years too, I have no issue with that.

I'll also say that if the Cards ever do win anything, I won't say a word about the trash talk that will follow... those folks have earned it after the hell they put up with season after season.

Oh, I got your point, sorry if my reply didn't exactly address what you were saying. I guess I was more just thinking out loud then replying to you. I totally agree with you though about fans sticking with team in good times as well as bad. I agree with a lot of what you said.

 

[abomb]

The Lakers are 34-7 with Gasol in the lineup.

 

[Mulli]

The Lakers are 34-7 with Gasol in the lineup.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

The Lakers are 34-7 with Gasol in the lineup.

MVP !! MVP !! MVP !!

:notworthy

 

[abomb]

MVP !! MVP !! MVP !!

:notworthy

Haters, they gon....ah, nevermind!

 

[abomb]

Memphis owner is having trader's remorse;

Memphis owner now questions value of Gasol deal

By Adrian Wojnarowski, Yahoo! Sports 1 hour, 23 minutes ago



Yahoo! Sports

For months now, maybe the man most responsible for Los Angeles’ championship run has been ripped over the Pau Gasol trade. The mere mention of suspicions over Memphis’ motives gets the Grizzlies owner’s voice rising on the telephone, gets him going on the gossip that suggests something unseemly happened on the way to a Lakers renaissance.

Michael Heisley starts to ask, well, who is ripping Minnesota for the Kevin Garnett trade?

How about Seattle and Ray Allen?

“Is anybody jumping on Popovich in San Antonio because he traded that center to Houston for virtually nothing?” Heisley wondered.


Heisley was talking about Luis Scola, the forward, whom had been a long-ago draft pick of the Spurs. Only problem was, Scola never played a minute for the four-time champions. Gasol was the Grizzlies’ franchise player, and it was Spurs coach Gregg Popovich saying on the record what most of his peers had only the guts to say without attribution: What in the world was Memphis management thinking on the Gasol trade?

When much of the league was determined to make a serious bid for the 7-footer, how could Memphis settle so long before the February trade deadline for such a paltry offer out of the Lakers?

For the first time, even Heisley wondered whether his general manager, Chris Wallace, blew it by caving so soon to the Lakers.

“I don’t know if I got the most value,” Heisley confessed. “Maybe our people should’ve shopped (Gasol) more and maybe we would’ve gotten more, done a better deal. Maybe Chris did call every team in the league. I don’t think he did, but maybe he should’ve…”

Around the league, nothing will change this belief: Whatever the reasoning, this was one of the NBA’s worst trades in years. Most of all, rival executives wonder why they never had a chance to submit a best offer. For Gasol, the 7-footer who transformed the Lakers in the absence of Andrew Bynum, the Grizzlies were willing to take back the expiring contract of Kwame Brown, rookie point guard Javaris Crittenton, two future No. 1 picks and the draft rights to Gasol’s brother, Marc.

Crittenton is nothing special, and those draft picks in 2008 and 2010 will be near, if not at the end of, the first round. Gasol had demanded a trade out of Memphis, had been moping around, giving less than his best. Yes, he had to go, but you don’t trade your franchise player without getting back a minimum of a sure-thing young star and/or two solid young starters. For Memphis, salary-cap space will probably turn out to be money that’ll never make it back into the roster.

The one-sided nature of the trade inspired a lot of people to believe that retired Memphis GM, Jerry West, a Lakers’ legend, played a part in facilitating the deal. West was instrumental recruiting Wallace as his replacement in Memphis and still holds a close relationship with Heisley. His history in Los Angeles, especially his bond with Lakers GM Mitch Kupchak and star Kobe Bryant, made even the fair-minded cynical about the scenario.

Several sources close to the process insist West played no part, and Heisley swears, “Jerry didn’t know about the trade until after it was done.”

Still, it hasn’t stopped a rampant anger around the league that this wasn’t so much of a trade, as much as it was the word that Bryant himself used: a “donation.” Privately, the Lakers were thrilled that they were able to keep negotiations with the Grizzlies quiet because Los Angeles officials were blown away that they could get Gasol for so little.

One source with knowledge of the process said the Bulls had made the most credible offer. For Gasol and Memphis’ Hakim Warrick, the Bulls were willing to part with Andres Nocioni, Tyrus Thomas, Joakim Noah, Thabo Sefolosha, possibly Adrian Griffin and draft picks.

Heisley didn’t offer up those names, but insisted, “Chicago wouldn’t offer us any of their good, core players,” he said. “Our people told me that we weren’t able to get equal trade value for Gasol and that we needed to do a deal that would give us cap space and draft picks. It was no secret in the league that we were considering offers for him, but the Lakers were the one team that stepped up.”

Heisley has been losing money in Memphis, a small market where the franchise has come to flounder. He tried to sell the team, but no one has reached his asking price. Around the league there are those who believe that Wallace was forced to turn the Gasol trade into a salary dump, and there are league officials, including a close friend, who believe, “There is no way that Chris ever would’ve made that trade on his own.”

“I have no buyer’s remorse,” Heisley said. “Listen, I can’t tell you how many people would tell me, wherever I went in Memphis, ‘Get rid of Gasol. …Trade Gasol.’ And then some of the same people are booing us because we traded him. But I don’t mind that. I’m a big boy. I can take it.”

He could live with watching Gasol playing an immense part in bringing the Lakers to the Finals, but he just wonders: When do we get our just reward for gutting this roster, for relentless futility? He keeps watching teams with better records get the luck of the bouncing balls in the draft lottery and the Grizzlies never get that transcendent player to save the franchise’s fortunes. Memphis missed on LeBron James and just one year ago, with the worst record in the sport, they still didn’t get a top two pick to take Greg Oden or Kevin Durant.

“We’ve been in the lottery more than anyone in the NBA, and we’ve definitely had the worst record twice as much as anyone else,” Heisley said. “This is sure a fantastic system we have – isn’t it? – where we’ve never gotten the No. 1 pick. Our ticket sales just stopped last year when we didn’t get one of the top picks. What’s the sense in of all this?”

The Grizzlies have been waiting for something, for someone to save them – maybe the bouncing the ball, maybe dumb luck – but they’ve done little to help themselves. The owner of the Memphis Grizzlies says, yes, come to him with criticism for the Gasol trade because he had the power to stop it. Now, he’s watched the Lakers rush to the NBA Finals, the immense impact Gasol has had with Bryant, and he’s asking the same question the rest of the league hasn’t stopped grumbling for months.

Did the Grizzlies get the best value possible for Pau Gasol?

“I don’t know if I got the most value,” he said.

Even so, you get the idea that, yes, the man most responsible for the Lakers’ championship run does know now.

Between February and now, that truth hasn’t changed. The answer’s still the same.

No way.

Not even close.

 

[Mulli]

They should get rid of this franchise.

 

[abomb]

The worst seats in either venue are selling for around $400 on Stubhub.

 

[abomb]

As far as Bryant is concerned, none of us knows the whole truth, and we're not about to. At least not from him.

"It's called moving forward, bro," Bryant declares. "That's what I'm doing. Life is so beautiful right now."

Perhaps Bryant won't look back because he doesn't have to. His plan is to let his game make the only historical statement that matters.

"He should," said Shaquille O'Neal, reaching out to offer a few words about Bryant this past weekend. "He's been great all year. He was great in the playoffs and he's showing everyone what he's made of. He's on the verge of being the latest great one with four rings.

"He's come a long way. All I can say is, I'm happy for him. And I'm proud of him."

 

[Darth Llama]

It's amazing how gracious Shaq can be when he has no other choice.

 

[Joe L]

We'll see how gracious Kobe is when he has to walk off Boston's floor in game 6.