The Official 2012 NBA Finals Thread: MIA vs. OKC

[chickenhead]

Using stats to try to make definitive comparisons across eras presents a fallacy because, as other have pointed out, those stats were not earned against the same competition and often with different rules and officiating. Awards and that sort of thing are even less definitive.

With teams it's a little easier, I think. My take is that the Celtics and the Lakers would do pretty well against the best teams of today, and that's because I think they'd be better able to systematically break down other teams' game plans. Even a team like the Spurs that has had the same ability: I just don't think they have an answer for the Celtics front court. If Duncan is handling Parish, can the other forwards handle Bird and McHale? And on the other end, are you suddenly relying on a "defensive specialist" Bowen to score while his teammates are wrapped up?

However, I do think it's likely that some mediocre teams from today could beat mediocre teams from the 80s because some of today's stars could light it up with pure athleticism (unless the hard fouls and different officiating were used to take them out of the game).

 

[sunsfan88]

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[slinslin]

That's because there were other great defensive bigs in the NBA when he played.

Serge Ibaka just led the NBA in blocked shots, he wouldn't have started for the Celtics in the 80s, or the Lakers, or the 76ers.

OMFG

And Mark Eaton lead the league in blocks 4 times in the 80s and he would not start on several NBA teams right now.

 

[slinslin]

Quoting Bill Simmons on Dwight Howard

...

 

[dodie53]

2012 finals thread?

 

[Phrazbit]

2012 finals thread?

It got derailed when Magic Johnson retroactively became a forward.

 

[sunsfan88]

If I start a thread with a poll and ask the question "Was Magic Johnson a guard or a forward" can we end the quarrel here and start focusing on the actual NBA Finals?

 

[chickenhead]

Yes, until someone mentions Gortat.

Although mentioning the Suns does remind me that I wonder how winning the championship would affect Miami's interest in Nash. Less desperation? Or more motivation for a dominant repeat?

I want to say that the Thunder have it in them to win tonight and force a monster game 6 on home court, but I'm not sure. I wonder what the stats are for a team that lost 3 in a row winning the fourth. I seem to recall that in a sweep situation, at least, they aren't great.

 

[D-Dogg]

If I start a thread with a poll and ask the question "Was Magic Johnson a guard or a forward" can we end the quarrel here and start focusing on the actual NBA Finals?

 

[Russ Smith]

OMFG

And Mark Eaton lead the league in blocks 4 times in the 80s and he would not start on several NBA teams right now.

No he wouldn't, not sure what has to do with the idea that the best teams in the 80's were as good or better than the best teams today. That was my point, Ibaka is starting on the Thunder but wouldn't have started for any of the best teams in the 80's.

I also love how you suddenly dropped your entire percentage of total rebounding line of commentary when I pointed out Moses Malone had actually bested Howard's best number 4 times. Suddenly that entire stat seems to have become unimportant to you, wonder why? It was so important to supporting your statement he was a much better rebounder than malone right up until it no longer supported that point, then like that, it's gone.

We're not going to agree that's obvious but continuing to act like you know everything about an era you didn't personally see because you can look up numbers on the internet, and use them, but ignore them if they don't actually support your point is getting a little tiresome. Personally I don't think Eaton deserved DPOY (I think he won it twice) he's a classic example of being too obsessed with stats. He was certainly a force on D but his lack of mobility also hurt them he couldn't defend the pick and roll for example. I always thought he was vastly overrated(and he went to UCLA), you won't find me arguing that he was some great player.

 

[ozzfloyd]

Mark Eaton would be the 3rd best C in the NBA this season, but that's mostly due to the fact that C's suck in the current NBA,

 

[Mainstreet]

Yes, until someone mentions Gortat.

Although mentioning the Suns does remind me that I wonder how winning the championship would affect Miami's interest in Nash. Less desperation? Or more motivation for a dominant repeat?

I want to say that the Thunder have it in them to win tonight and force a monster game 6 on home court, but I'm not sure. I wonder what the stats are for a team that lost 3 in a row winning the fourth. I seem to recall that in a sweep situation, at least, they aren't great.

They (the announcers) say no team has come back from a 3-1 deficit in the Finals.

 

[Russ Smith]

They (the announcers) say no team has come back from a 3-1 deficit in the Finals.

Yeah I think normally that's because a team that's behind 3-1 is just not as good as the other team. I'm not sure that's true this year. OKC could have swept, all 3 games they lost they were in a position to win, by the same token MIA could have swept too they had a big lead in the game they lost.

MIA has simply done a better job closing in 3 of the 4 games. OKC COULD reverse that, it just seems unlikely.

They really need Harden to wake up and frankly Durant too, he's scoring but he's not rebounding and his defense the last 2 games has been a major problem.

 

[chickenhead]

They (the announcers) say no team has come back from a 3-1 deficit in the Finals.

Thanks. If they can win tonight, the Thunder still have a chance at a close-out game on their home court. Durant and Harden have a chance to get back into it and Lebron has a chance to revert (although the former is more important and more likely IMO).

Still a little hard to cheer for the ex-Sonics, and I've lived through enough Lakers championships to be able to continue my life if the villain wins, but I just don't like the Heat team as much.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It got derailed when Magic Johnson retroactively became a forward.

lol.

 

[sunsfan88]

Haha if this Magic wasn't a PG crap continues then I will create the thread

And nah I think Miami wraps it up today. They'll do it front of their home crowd after they embarrassed their home crowd last year in game 6 at Miami.

OKC is out of energy. They lost all momentum. Their a young team, their gonna panic. Plus Harden supposedly has a "bruised" hand so their chances diminish even further...

But I'm not expecting a blow out though...should be a great game.

 

[D-Dogg]

OKC wins this one in a walk. Series turns.

 

[95pro]

All this talk about the aggressors drawing fouls. Westbrook finally gets a call. And yet they call durant for a weak one.

 

[95pro]

Sefolosha's second foul is BS. Just because it's Lebron.

 

[95pro]

Foul should have been called on battier when Perkins went up.

 

[95pro]

It's pretty obvious the MO is to get the thunder in early foul trouble, throwing them off their game and setting up an early handicap.

 

[95pro]

OKC needs to learn how to set solid screens. They need to set them instead of slipping every single one of them.

 

[95pro]

Wow no offensive interference...

 

[95pro]

Cole or whatever knew he fouled Westbrook on that missed dunk. Of course, no call.

 

[95pro]

Could have easily been a foul called on Lebron.