The Suns with the 2018 #1 overall pick select....

[Mainstreet]

I'm not ready to say he is certain to drop outside of the top three, but I do think that if the draft were tonight, I wouldn't have him in that range.

The fact that Sacramento (No. 2), Atlanta (No. 3) and Memphis (No. 4) all declined to send a single person from the U.S. to watch the Euroleague Final Four tells me something about their interest level.

At this stage, I think a lot of NBA teams have already made up their minds about Doncic, and it isn't quite as flattering as we initially thought.

So the Suns trading for a pick to select Doncic may not be as far fetched as it previously seemed... if he does slide a bit.

 

[SirStefan32]

It talks about Doncic having leverage to help control where he goes, then says he has lost a little ground as a prospect for several reasons:

We've talked about the ridiculous number of games Doncic has played over the past 18 months -- the equivalent of almost two full NBA seasons in that span, handling the ball and being asked to create a huge amount of offense for his team every time out, and I really think that has caught up with him. He looked more athletic to me in September. European basketball is great in many areas, but making sure players are on the right diet and strength and conditioning program is not one of them. Plus, Doncic's affinity for junk food and the Madrid nightlife aren't a great combination here.

This is VERY true. That stuff is completely non-existent in Europe.

I want to see what Doncic looks like after a few months of strength/ weight training.

 

[elindholm]

Doncic still looks clumsy to me. Tatum eases fluidity, and did in the pre-draft highlights I saw as well. It's really not a good comparison.

 

[SirStefan32]

Why would they gamble on college kids over Doncic? Because, being a pro and playing so many games means he is a more finished product. This is going to sound contradictory, but it is not. He has had more experience and more development. While that is good, and he is ahead NCAA freshmen a year removed from high school, it also means he is closer to his peak than those players. Its all speculation. But one of the things you have to speculate on is how close is he to being a finished product. While Luka is 19, he is already a long way down that path. I am guessing here. But it makes sense to me.

I see your point, but I think it's not something to be worried about. Players who work hard tend to keep improving. Doncic, from everything I've heard, lives and breathes basketball, and has since he was a little kid. Couple of obvious areas is strength and conditioning, along with shooting. I don't see how he doesn't improve in those areas.

 

[elindholm]

Doncic, from everything I've heard, lives and breathes basketball, and has since he was a little kid. Couple of obvious areas is strength and conditioning, along with shooting. I don't see how he doesn't improve in those areas.

Why is his diet lousy? Someone who "lives and breathes" basketball surely has been exposed to the viewpoint that nutrition matters. Does he think that those guidelines don't apply to him? I think it's more likely that he "lives and breathes" the celebrity he gets from basketball, not a passion for excelling at the game itself.

 

[SirStefan32]

Doncic still looks clumsy to me. Tatum eases fluidity, and did in the pre-draft highlights I saw as well. It's really not a good comparison.

I don't think Doncic looks clumsy, but I do agree that Tatum is one of the most fluid players I've seen in the past few years.

 

[HeHasRosen]

None of what you just typed is anyone saying he will be magic or counting on it. Words matter.

Ok no one is counting on him being magic. Comparisons are being made however. Feel better?

Good grief let it go man

 

[SirStefan32]

Ok no one is counting on him being magic. Comparisons are being made however. Feel better?

Good grief let it go man

Comparisons of certain aspects of their games. I am one of the bigger Doncic fans, and I can tell you he isn't gonna be a Magic Johnson. I've made a comparison jokingly a couple of times when other proclaimed Ayton to be the next David Robinson. Nobody in their right mind thinks Doncic is actually going to be the next Magic Johnson.

 

[Chaplin]

Pro-Ayton

http://arizonasports.com/story/1536...-more-skilled-joel-embiid-entering-nba-draft/

 

[SirStefan32]

Why is his diet lousy? Someone who "lives and breathes" basketball surely has been exposed to the viewpoint that nutrition matters. Does he think that those guidelines don't apply to him? I think it's more likely that he "lives and breathes" the celebrity he gets from basketball, not a passion for excelling at the game itself.

Well, no matter what I (or anyone else says) will change your mind about Doncic, so I am going to avoid getting involved here, but I will point out that nobody questions Luka's commitment to basketball or his drive/ motor. You can read about his life, and the evidence is overwhelming. Of course he enjoys being a celebrity. Outside of a small group of extreme introverts, who wouldn't? Diet and weight training are not really parts of guidelines in Europe. Hell, it wasn't until the last few years that smoking became a no-no. He will learn, he will get there. Part of the problem is that it's very common to play pretty-much year around- Euroleague, national league, international competitions, so there isn't as much time to spend in the weight room.

 

[GatorAZ]

Well, no matter what I (or anyone else says) will change your mind about Doncic, so I am going to avoid getting involved here, but I will point out that nobody questions Luka's commitment to basketball or his drive/ motor. You can read about his life, and the evidence is overwhelming. Of course he enjoys being a celebrity. Outside of a small group of extreme introverts, who wouldn't? Diet and weight training are not really parts of guidelines in Europe. Hell, it wasn't until the last few years that smoking became a no-no. He will learn, he will get there. Part of the problem is that it's very common to play pretty-much year around- Euroleague, national league, international competitions, so there isn't as much time to spend in the weight room.

Seems odd for the so-called second best league on the planet.

 

[Raindog]

Seems odd for the so-called second best league on the planet.

Not as aware how prevalent it is among contemporary players, but Divac was (and no doubt, still is) a notable chain smoker when he played - as in, lighting up at halftime of games.

And in general, Europeans smoke like crazy, especially in Eastern Europe. It's a huge part of the social culture there.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Doncic does play with fire but so does Dragic and he's never been a true franchise player, nor could he have been on a successful team. It's taken him over a decade to make an All-Star team and that was as a reserve. Doncic figures to be a slightly bigger Dragic. That's not a bad thing but it's not #1 overall pick good. He's not a good defender and it's unlikely he'll ever be. Fire doesn't equal skill. He could burn a team just as much as he helps them. For every game his fire helps win a game there will be games where his fire takes his team out of games because he's just not hitting his shots, will he accept it when his shots not falling and defer to others or will he try to will his team back into the game? We saw that happen with Dragic and ultimately that ended up being an issue of sorts once he was playing with All-Star level teammates in IT and Bledsoe. Rather than beat them on the court he didn't like the challenge and sought out his own team, where he wouldn't be challenged by teammates.

I know they're different players but Dragic is Doncic's mentor. There is the potential that he'll clash with guys like Booker and Jackson because of his drive and since he has a history with Kokoskov, who knows how that would play out? They all play similar positions and there's no guarantee they'll be able to co-exist. With Ayton, he plays a different position and there is little overlap with Booker and JJ so there shouldn't be much of a clash with their egos on the court because they do different things. It seems like Jackson and Booker have made their picks clear also, they want Ayton. The team shouldn't listen to them entirely but what if there is a resentment if the Suns take Doncic? Doncic will be taking the ball from their hands and minutes from them also. That could blow up. If Doncic was guaranteed to be an All-Star then to hell with them, they need to make it work, but there isn't a guarantee he'll be that good but since his former coach is here there is reason to believe he'd be given a long leash and that could be an issue if the team isn't winning.

Man i think there’s a lot of misdirected conjecture here. What is the primary attribute of doncic’s that seems to garner the most praise? His ability to see the floor and pass. In other words, to make his team better. He’s certainly not a volume scorer. And you think he’s going to TAKE AWAY opportunities from booker and Jackson?!? Seems much more likely he’ll make them even better. You’re hunting for reasons at this point . . .

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Lets not get it twisted fellas... I am a minority so best we dont open that can of worms

You brought the can of worms.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

That's one of the issues with Doncic. He's not a finished product and right now he's a 6'8 PG or Point Forward. Where will he play when he is in his prime? I think that is holding some teams back from picking him. He may fit now as a PG but once he gets bigger and stronger he may not be able to PG and unless he's all he's hyped to be and more, do they have space to move him to the wing?

When he’s bigger and stronger he’ll be LESS capable?!? Huh? Is this backwards day and someone forgot to tell me?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Doncic still looks clumsy to me. Tatum eases fluidity, and did in the pre-draft highlights I saw as well. It's really not a good comparison.

I don’t think krang is comparing the players but the scenarios.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Ok no one is counting on him being magic. Comparisons are being made however. Feel better?

Good grief let it go man

Dude there are differences in what you say. WORDS HAVE MEANING. If we as a society decide to just play fast and loose with what we are saying, or worse, when we are trying to state what OTHERS are saying (which is what you were doing) the conversation becomes disingenuous, leads to further argumentation verses intellectual exploration and expansion, and leads to confrontation rather than consensus-building and truth-finding. But if you’d rather just bicker, by all means play loose and free with peoples statements and positions and continue to put words in their mouths.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Seems odd for the so-called second best league on the planet.

Everything in context. If it’s not the norm in Europe why is it odd? Smoking wasn’t the norm amongst nba players when blade came over but he was a huge smoker . . . because it wasn’t unusual in Europe. You know, where he lived and played.

 

[GatorAZ]

Everything in context. If it’s not the norm in Europe why is it odd? Smoking wasn’t the norm amongst nba players when blade came over but he was a huge smoker . . . because it wasn’t unusual in Europe. You know, where he lived and played.

I didn’t say it was odd for Europe. I said it was odd for the second best league in the world.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I didn’t say it was odd for Europe. I said it was odd for the second best league in the world.

I guess words only matter... sometimes?

 

[Raindog]

I didn’t say it was odd for Europe. I said it was odd for the second best league in the world.

It does make one further wonder about the quality of the athletes in the Euro league, at least in terms of conditioning. I don't know if Doncic smokes, or how prevalent it is among current players over there, but you would tend to believe it is certainly more commonplace than here.

 

[SirStefan32]

It does make one further wonder about the quality of the athletes in the Euro league, at least in terms of conditioning. I don't know if Doncic smokes, or how prevalent it is among current players over there, but you would tend to believe it is certainly more commonplace than here.

People question just how much he can improve. Strength, conditioning, weight training will certainly help him be better. The kid is already strong at 230lb and no history of weight training.

EDIT: Luka does not smoke. Smoking is no longer prevalent among the players. Halftimes are no longer a smoke-break.

 

[SirStefan32]

I didn’t say it was odd for Europe. I said it was odd for the second best league in the world.

It's only odd if you are of a mindset that the US is the only place in the world. Different cultures are, well.. different.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I didn’t say it was odd for Europe. I said it was odd for the second best league in the world.

So not directed at Doncic but rather the league, got it. Yeah in that context it is odd.

 

[pokerface]

Like as others have said ..Doncic doesn't have a clearly defined position so that makes it a tad harder to draft him at #1.


Pass on the unicorn at your own peril...Ayton is our guy for better or worse. He's a center and we know we will get ample ppg rpg out of him. And yes his defense will improve. I have no doubts there.