What's the Rationale for Drafting Te'o?

[kerouac9]

Lots of groundswell around here for the Cards using their Top 8-ish pick on Notre Dame Linebacker Manti Te'o. I don't really get it. Let me explain why.

Last year, I wanted the Cards to draft a defensive rush linebacker or offensive tackle in the draft. My reasoning was that our defense could go from good to elite with an edge rushing threat, and that our offensive line was so bad that it needed help either at left of right tackle.

Instead, we drafted a wide receiver because Larry Fitzgerald knew him in high school.

Inside linebacker is one of the lowest-value positions in football--along with strong safety. They're the lowest paid in free agency; you can get a really good starter for super-cheap money. We could've signed 2 Stephen Tullochs (a guy who actually plays) for what we paid for Stewart Bradley.

Even after the Seattle debacle, the Arizona Cardinals defense is 12th in yardage, 18th in scoring, 4th in defensive completion rate, 10th in passing TDs against, 2nd(!!) in opposing QB rating, and 6th in DVOA.

On the other hand, our offense is 32nd in yardage, 32nd in points, 32nd in rushing, 28th in passing yardage, 31st in passing completion percentage, 32nd in quarterback rating, and 32nd in DVOA.

So... what's the marginal gain of adding a great prospect to an already-good defense? We shave off 1 point per game (which would be really remarkable)?

The 2012 Arizona Cardinals currently average 14.3 points per game (the NFL median is 22.5). After last week the defense allows 22.5 PPG (more or less the median).

Is adding Manti Te'o going to make the difference of a touchdown per game allowed? Of course not.

So what's the argument for drafting him for this team right now other than "****!!! MANTI TE'O IS TEH AWESOME SAUCE!!! BIRDGANG!!!"? I get that Paris Lenon is getting old, but there are going to be between 5-8 solid-or-better ILBs available in free agency.

Our offense is horrible. Our offensive line regularly requires that we keep 2 extra blockers in to give the quarterback time to throw. Our quarterbacks look like high school backup JV players.

What difference is an instant-Pro Bowl ILB going to make in the wins and losses column?

 

[sundevil04]

This is not to say that Teo is #1 on my board but if we were to take him I'd be happy about it. The reason... Leadership. With AW and DD aging and likely out the door soon and with Fitz being uber talented but by no means a vocal leader, throw position out the window, we need a leader. Who on this team, post AW and DD could be seen as a leader?

 

[Jersey Girl]

This is not to say that Teo is #1 on my board but if we were to take him I'd be happy about it. The reason... Leadership. With AW and DD aging and likely out the door soon and with Fitz being uber talented but by no means a vocal leader, throw position out the window, we need a leader. Who on this team, post AW and DD could be seen as a leader?

Campbell. Washington.

I am a big fan of taking the best guy on the board. If Te'o is that guy, you take him. I wouldn't mind a minute if the Cards drafted him. I watch a lot of Notre Dame football. I like the kid and I like the way he plays.

 

[PitchShifter]

Who on this team, post AW and DD could be seen as a leader?

Calais Campbell or Darryl Washington could fill that role IMHO.

Edit: Jersey Girl must type much faster than me :->

 

[187]

Agreed. You can sign a guy to play inside next to Daryl in FA or find one in the mid rounds in the draft. Navorro Bowman was a 3rd round pick. Would much rather have an olineman or impact edge rusher since I am not a big fan of any of the QB's when we might be picking inside the top 5.

This is not to say that Teo is #1 on my board but if we were to take him I'd be happy about it. The reason... Leadership. With AW and DD aging and likely out the door soon and with Fitz being uber talented but by no means a vocal leader, throw position out the window, we need a leader. Who on this team, post AW and DD could be seen as a leader?

A leader on defense isn't going to magically make our offense not be craptacular. Funny how cards fans are talking about intangibles after the Max Hall disaster..you don't take a guy top 5-10 because of his intangibles.

 

[Duckjake]

The defense is also 30th in rushing yards allowed. Over 560 yards in just the last 3 games. Need to fix that.

The Cards aren't going to win for another 2-3 years while they groom a young QB so at least we can watch a bad ax defense in the interim.

We need somebody who can knock the snot out of ball carriers instead of just jumping on them and dragging them down.

That's all I got right now.

If SILB is so easy to find why do we have a 35 year old starting there? Who replaced another 30 year old with a bad back. Who replaced wrong gap Ronnie who started for the Cards for 9 years! Oh yeah they're the Cardinals. I forgot for a minute.

 

[Timm Rosenbach]

It's the classic "best player available" buffoonery.

That philosophy is for good teams, not teams with 9 game losing streaks because of a cancerous offense

 

[Jersey Girl]

It's the classic "best player available" buffoonery.

That philosophy is for good teams, not teams with 9 game losing streaks because of a cancerous offense

Because drafting for need has worked out so well for this team, yes?

 

[Cardinals.Ken]

I think it's too early for anyone to hitch their wagon to any particular player. At this point, no one really jumps out at me as a "must have".

If our pick comes around, and Te'O is on available, I wouldn't be at all displeased if we took him, or traded down for multiple picks (unlike 2003 when Suggs was available and we traded down...ugh!)

In the absence of an obvious need-based first round pick (ie. Luck/RGIII QBOTF or a Kalil/Boselli cornerstone LT) a move down for more picks appears to be the logical choice...as long as it isn't fouled up with head-scratching picks.

 

[Stout]

The defense is also 30th in rushing yards allowed. Over 560 yards in just the last 3 games. Need to fix that.

The Cards aren't going to win for another 2-3 years while they groom a young QB so at least we can watch a bad ax defense in the interim.

We need somebody who can knock the snot out of ball carriers instead of just jumping on them and dragging them down.

That's all I got right now.

If SILB is so easy to find why do we have a 35 year old starting there? Who replaced another 30 year old with a bad back. Who replaced wrong gap Ronnie who started for the Cards for 9 years! Oh yeah they're the Cardinals. I forgot for a minute.

Yep. And this guy is an elite prospect. Sure, that may not pan out, but the same was said about Willis. If he turns out to be as good as Willis, nobody will complain that we didn't go offense. I really wanted the future HOF QB in the '04 draft. I've found a way to live with Fitz instead.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Te'o would be a BPA at a position of need. That's why you draft him. Clarify, he's the BPA at a postion of need and a highly ranked overall player. I would be okay with him, Joeckel, Moore, or any other player who's not a WR and is ranked among the top 5 prospects. That's is exactly why I question taking Smith early. Prospect-wise, he'd be somewhat of a reach but definitley fills a need.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

I don't know.

Can't see how a 4-3 LB, out of a school that just gave this organization its latest bust is an option when you NEED a QB and OL.

And don't give me this "don't draft for need" B.S. because you have to have your roster set up for that luxiary. The Cardinals NEED a QB, the Cardinals NEED some young interior linemen with talent.

Drafting BPA, is just going to further the bleeding.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Te'o would be a BPA at a position of need.

Really ?

Top 10 defense, and probably the best in the league. What other top 10 defense has been on the field for more plays, and more time in this league ?

I just can't agree that there is a "NEED" any where on defense when it is woefully obvious the problems with the current team are on offense.

SILB is not a need on this team. I would be more than fine with Reggie Walker next year, if it means getting an top-of-the-food-chain interior lineman.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

Because drafting for need has worked out so well for this team, yes?

Cause drafting BPA has worked out so well for this team, yes ?

How many games have we lost in a row ?

How many drafts have we not picked a QB or OL in the 1st round ?

How bad is our historically bad offense ?

We really need another Michael Floyd or Beanie Wells, or Ryan Williams on this team ?

 

[az jam]

I do like Te'o but our Offense is the worst in the league and needs an total overhaul starting with the Qb. Free agency and trades start before the draft and of course so do coaching changes. Bottom line is that our team should look different before we have to make a decision on who we go after with our first pick.

 

[FORKTUNG]

We passed on Urlacker in 2000 for Thomas Jones.

Go figure

 

[thephoenixson28]

Because whatever holes that can be filled, they can be done in free agency. But Te'o is a great talent. I won't be able to promise you one less touchdowns, but he does have a knack for the football.

 

[Cardinals.Ken]

We passed on Urlacker in 2000 for Thomas Jones.

Go figure

In 2000 we had Jake Plummer and LJ Shelton.

Just saying

 

[kerouac9]

Te'o would be a BPA at a position of need. That's why you draft him. Clarify, he's the BPA at a postion of need and a highly ranked overall player. I would be okay with him, Joeckel, Moore, or any other player who's not a WR and is ranked among the top 5 prospects. That's is exactly why I question taking Smith early. Prospect-wise, he'd be somewhat of a reach but definitley fills a need.

ILB is not a position of need. We have Daryl Washington. What makes Mante Te'o a better prospect than Rolando McClain or Aaron Curry? ILBs just don't have that much value or impact.

It's interesting to me that the guy who bangs on the front office for signing Stewart Bradley is thrilled at the idea of paying far more for an unproven prospect like Manti Te'o.

I'd rather do what the Jets did three or four years ago--take an incomplete quarterback prospect that you can work with and give some support to your defense who's ready to win now.

 

[Dr. Jones]

OLB - OL

It has to be addressed with all of our first 4 picks.

We need to find a QB elsewhere with this draft class.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

People just like to say Manti Te'o.

 

[thephoenixson28]

Just imagine another Daryl Washington

 

[football karma]

ok -- so lets say the Cards win, somehow, 2 of their final 3 -- one of the home games and a meaningless game (to SF) in SF. They draft around 8.


Joekel the tackle is off the board. Jarvis, Moore, and Werner as well. Top rated QB is gone as well. Lotuleilei gone.

Te'o might very well be the best player sitting there. And if the scouted "gap" between him and someone like Jonathan Jenkins, or Mingo, or Matthews is large ---absent a trade down opportunity, dont you have to take him?

 

[Russ Smith]

Lots of groundswell around here for the Cards using their Top 8-ish pick on Notre Dame Linebacker Manti Te'o. I don't really get it. Let me explain why.

Last year, I wanted the Cards to draft a defensive rush linebacker or offensive tackle in the draft. My reasoning was that our defense could go from good to elite with an edge rushing threat, and that our offensive line was so bad that it needed help either at left of right tackle.

Instead, we drafted a wide receiver because Larry Fitzgerald knew him in high school.

Inside linebacker is one of the lowest-value positions in football--along with strong safety. They're the lowest paid in free agency; you can get a really good starter for super-cheap money. We could've signed 2 Stephen Tullochs (a guy who actually plays) for what we paid for Stewart Bradley.

Even after the Seattle debacle, the Arizona Cardinals defense is 12th in yardage, 18th in scoring, 4th in defensive completion rate, 10th in passing TDs against, 2nd(!!) in opposing QB rating, and 6th in DVOA.

On the other hand, our offense is 32nd in yardage, 32nd in points, 32nd in rushing, 28th in passing yardage, 31st in passing completion percentage, 32nd in quarterback rating, and 32nd in DVOA.

So... what's the marginal gain of adding a great prospect to an already-good defense? We shave off 1 point per game (which would be really remarkable)?

The 2012 Arizona Cardinals currently average 14.3 points per game (the NFL median is 22.5). After last week the defense allows 22.5 PPG (more or less the median).

Is adding Manti Te'o going to make the difference of a touchdown per game allowed? Of course not.

So what's the argument for drafting him for this team right now other than "****!!! MANTI TE'O IS TEH AWESOME SAUCE!!! BIRDGANG!!!"? I get that Paris Lenon is getting old, but there are going to be between 5-8 solid-or-better ILBs available in free agency.

Our offense is horrible. Our offensive line regularly requires that we keep 2 extra blockers in to give the quarterback time to throw. Our quarterbacks look like high school backup JV players.

What difference is an instant-Pro Bowl ILB going to make in the wins and losses column?

For me the rationale would be there doesn't appear to be a player on the board at that point on offense who's better than he is.

Certainly not a QB. Taking a RB that high is dumb. So we come down to OL. You don't draft guards that high hell everyone told me that last year at 13 when I wanted DeCastro, so drafting a lower rated guard higher would be dumb too. So we're left with taking a Tackle.

I'm actually ok with taking a tackle there but I think we all agree we need to fix the INTERIOR of the OL more than the T's at this point?

I'd certainly take a tackle but my hunch is we'll end up picking at a spot where the top 1-2 Ol's are gone.

So you're saying do we take a guard like Warmack, or the best player which could be Te'O. I would take an OLB too it just depends who is actually there.

For me without knowing exactly where we pick etc I think it's more likely Te'O is there than a stud OL or OLB.

 

[kerouac9]

For me the rationale would be there doesn't appear to be a player on the board at that point on offense who's better than he is.

Certainly not a QB. Taking a RB that high is dumb. So we come down to OL. You don't draft guards that high hell everyone told me that last year at 13 when I wanted DeCastro, so drafting a lower rated guard higher would be dumb too. So we're left with taking a Tackle.

I'm actually ok with taking a tackle there but I think we all agree we need to fix the INTERIOR of the OL more than the T's at this point?

I'd certainly take a tackle but my hunch is we'll end up picking at a spot where the top 1-2 Ol's are gone.

So you're saying do we take a guard like Warmack, or the best player which could be Te'O. I would take an OLB too it just depends who is actually there.

For me without knowing exactly where we pick etc I think it's more likely Te'O is there than a stud OL or OLB.

If it's a pure value proposition, I would probably look for a partner to trade down with. If I were forced to exercise the pick, and the Utah DL was off the board, then I would probably take Warmack, whom I think is a better prospect than DeCastro is.

Honestly, as I said, if Geno Smith is on the board, I'd take him. I think that Barkley will be on the board, and the Cards would take him if he interviews well and wants to play here. I understand that everyone wants the next Drew Brees. He's not walking through that door. But even in this offense with our current personnel, a guy like Mark Sanchez would IMO have us at .500. And I've considerably soured on Sanchez since listing him as a Top 10 QB at the beginning of the year.

If the option were T'eo or the 3rd OT, I'd trade down at a discount (like a 3rd or a 2014 2nd).

If we traded down from 6 to 10, we could get Warmack or Cooper and an additional 3rd rounder? I'd be all in on that.