Why Beasley was the #2 pick

[Cheesebeef]

So what should he be paid, you forget the contract he signed had to do with him when he was a free agent. Look at Ryan Anderson, 9mil a year. Frye had a bum shoulder last year and when he was a free agent the Suns got him at a good price.

says who? most people thought we over-paid Frye as did a lot of outside media.

 

[SweetD]

says who? most people thought we over-paid Frye as did a lot of outside media.

You have to remember what was going on. Amare was leaving and Drew Gooden got 5 Years $32Million, Darko got 4years $20Million.

 

[SunsTzu]

says who? most people thought we over-paid Frye as did a lot of outside media.

Not that I think Frye's deal is good but iirc he did turn down slightly more money from the Clippers to return to the Suns. I also think Frye's remaining contract is better than Anderson's. However I can never understand how people justify bad signings by comparing them to worse ones.

 

[Cheesebeef]

You have to remember what was going on. Amare was leaving and Drew Gooden got 5 Years $32Million, Darko got 4years $20Million.

so, because other players got terrible contracts, the Suns had to give one out also? that excuse doesn't hold any water for me.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Not that I think Frye's deal is good but iirc he did turn down slightly more money from the Clippers to return to the Suns. I also think Frye's remaining contract is better than Anderson's. However I can never understand how people justify bad signings by comparing them to worse ones.

agreed.

 

[Chaplin]

Frye's contract isn't terrible. It's an average contract for an average player. Simple as that.

 

[SweetD]

Not that I think Frye's deal is good but iirc he did turn down slightly more money from the Clippers to return to the Suns. I also think Frye's remaining contract is better than Anderson's. However I can never understand how people justify bad signings by comparing them to worse ones.

Hindsight is 20/20 how can you say a contract is good or bad when you sign it? If you look at the stats/current market value/players fit into the system/impact on team you come up with a value. Coming back and saying that was a bad signing can be said about almost every single player in the NBA.

Heck the media and people on this board also thought Nash was a bad contact, when he signed with us from Dallas.

 

[SunsTzu]

Hindsight is 20/20 how can you say a contract is good or bad when you sign it?

What hindsight?

http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/f7/coro-suns-lock-down-frye-5-30m-154175.html

 

[Cheesebeef]

Hindsight is 20/20

it's not hindsight when you're saying it's a bad contract when it's signed.

how can you say a contract is good or bad when you sign it? If you look at the stats/current market value/players fit into the system/impact on team you come up with a value.

and the suns value was more than I, a lot of people on the board and the media thought it should be.

Coming back and saying that was a bad signing can be said about almost every single player in the NBA.

bull.

Heck the media and people on this board also thought Nash was a bad contact, when he signed with us from Dallas.

you're right... they did and they were wrong. but they weren't wrong on this contract.

do you realize what you're basically saying? that every contract when signed is the right contract because of the value that specific team put on the player. that's ridiculous.

 

[Phrazbit]

Frye's contract isn't terrible. It's an average contract for an average player. Simple as that.

Its not good. And I wouldnt call Frye an average player. He had one year where he brought his play up to near average, and really, claiming even that year was a average season is iffy, so the Suns toss him a five year deal?! And last year Frye was not an "average" player. Throwing long term deals to "average" players is really really stupid. Especially when they've had one good season.

Trying to compare him to Ryan Anderson doesnt make sense... Anderson is quite a bit better than Frye in every way imaginable, he should be paid a lot more than Channing.

 

[SweetD]

The market sets the value just like in business and stocks. You pay the price at the current value, plan and simple or you don't. Just like stocks you can choosen when to take your loss or gain. Frye is an average player who got just above average deal that is it. So he makes 1-2Million more than he should currently.

 

[Cheesebeef]

What hindsight?

http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/f7/coro-suns-lock-down-frye-5-30m-154175.html

bingo.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The market sets the value just like in business and stocks. You pay the price at the current value, plan and simple or you don't. Just like stocks you can choosen when to take your loss or gain. Frye is an average player who got just above average deal that is it. So he makes 1-2Million more than he should currently.

let me ask you this. seeing as we're a rebuilding club right now (just as a lot of KNEW we were when we signed the Frye deal), would you go out and blow 30 million for 5 years RIGHT NOW on a player like Frye? And if so, why?

 

[Phrazbit]

The market sets the value just like in business and stocks. You pay the price at the current value, plan and simple or you don't. Just like stocks you can choosen when to take your loss or gain. Frye is an average player who got just above average deal that is it. So he makes 1-2Million more than he should currently.

Whether he was worth giving him 6 mil per year is debatable. But whats not is giving him a 5 year deal at that rate. You dont make long term plans around marginal role players, especially with the future the Suns were looking at.

 

[SweetD]

Its not good. And I wouldnt call Frye an average player. He had one year where he brought his play up to near average, and really, claiming even that year was a average season is iffy, so the Suns toss him a five year deal?! And last year Frye was not an "average" player. Throwing long term deals to "average" players is really really stupid. Especially when they've had one good season.

Trying to compare him to Ryan Anderson doesnt make sense... Anderson is quite a bit better than Frye in every way imaginable, he should be paid a lot more than Channing.

What are you talking about. Ryan Anderson has only had 2 ok years same with Frye, all you keep doing is show how much Frye is = or >Anderson

Ryan Anderson stats - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Anderson_(basketball))

Channing Frye stats - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channing_Frye

 

[SweetD]

Whether he was worth giving him 6 mil per year is debatable. But whats not is giving him a 5 year deal at that rate. You dont make long term plans around marginal role players, especially with the future the Suns were looking at.

That was an average deal with the CBA that was in place? It is not like they were building around him. So you think we should have given him a Ryan Anderson type of deal?

 

[Phrazbit]

What are you talking about. Ryan Anderson has only had 2 ok years same with Frye, all you keep doing is show how much Frye is = or >Anderson

Ryan Anderson stats - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Anderson_(basketball))

Channing Frye stats - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channing_Frye

That was an average deal with the CBA that was in place? It is not like they were building around him. So you think we should have given him a Ryan Anderson type of deal?

lol, no, we should have let him walk if thats what some dumb team wanted to pay!

Once again pointing a bad contract as justification for signing a different bad deal is just... beyond comprehension. And Anderson's season last year crushed anything Frye has ever done.

 

[Cheesebeef]

What are you talking about. Ryan Anderson has only had 2 ok years same with Frye, all you keep doing is show how much Frye is = or >Anderson

Ryan Anderson stats - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryan_Anderson_(basketball))

Channing Frye stats - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Channing_Frye

lol... Frye's best season up to that point was his 5th where he averaged 11 ppg and 5 rebounds. Anderson just came off his fourth season where he averaged 16 ppg and 8 rebounds. That's a hell of a lot better than what Frye got and most people think anderson's over-paid as well.

 

[SweetD]

let me ask you this. seeing as we're a rebuilding club right now (just as a lot of KNEW we were when we signed the Frye deal), would you go out and blow 30 million for 5 years RIGHT NOW on a player like Frye? And if so, why?

New CBA inplace would limit the type of contact and market for Frye. At this time with a Frye (3years ago) would make him 2 years older than Anderson, I would have to say the market would put him at 3-4Million less of Anderson with one less year. So somewhere around 4-5Million for three years.

 

[Cheesebeef]

That was an average deal with the CBA that was in place? It is not like they were building around him. So you think we should have given him a Ryan Anderson type of deal?

and good work putting words into someone's mouth here.

let me ask you this SweetD, have the Suns ever done ANYTHING wrong as far as your concerned?

 

[Cheesebeef]

New CBA inplace would limit the type of contact and market for Frye. At this time with a Frye (3years ago) would make him 2 years older than Anderson, I would have to say the market would put him at 3-4Million less of Anderson with one less year. So somewhere around 4-5Million for three years.

you didn't answer that question. would you have signed him for 6 million for three years if he was available this off-season? and if so, why?

 

[Phrazbit]

New CBA inplace would limit the type of contact and market for Frye. At this time with a Frye (3years ago) would make him 2 years older than Anderson, I would have to say the market would put him at 3-4Million less of Anderson with one less year. So somewhere around 4-5Million for three years.

There were not guidelines that forced teams to hand out 5 year deals to bench players. The new CBA only protects owners from their own stupidity (to an extent).

 

[SweetD]

lol, no, we should have let him walk if thats what some dumb team wanted to pay!

Once again pointing a bad contract as justification for signing a different bad deal is just... beyond comprehension. And Anderson's season last year crushed anything Frye has ever done.

So your saying you should pay Anderson since he had one above average season, but not Frye?

 

[SunsTzu]

So you think we should have given him a Ryan Anderson type of deal?

Why do you keep bringing up other bad deals? Anderson has more value now than Frye did because Anderson has shown steady improvement over his career where as Frye had 1 year of being a stretch 4 that surprised many. Anderson has been a more consistent shooter and better rebounder, while Frye is the better defender imo. They both have had major struggles in the playoffs where teams are more prepared defensively.

So Ryan Anderson's bad deal doesn't excuse the fact the Suns gave Frye a bad deal. Anderson's deal isn't even as bad as the deals Jeff Green and Landry Fields got.

How about instead of comparing Frye to other bad deals we compare him to a good deal. Dudley is making about 1/3 less than Frye while having a bigger impact. Dudley actually has positive trade value on his contract, while the Suns would have to include assets to move Frye.

 

[Cheesebeef]

So your saying you should pay Anderson since he had one above average season, but not Frye?

why do you keep putting words in other people's mouths? do you have any idea how much that distorts an honest discussion?