Alex Len

[Chaplin]

I can't handle this. I want to believe in McDonough but all common sense was telling me this was a bad pick. I was texting TJ right until pick was made and was sure the Suns would F this up based on the buzz I'd heard on how they viewed Noel, Mclemore, and Len. I'm usually the biggest Kool Aod drinker on my teams drafts and wil talk myself into player 24 hours later and get excited. I can't even do that I'm this case.

What a joke. Who would have though 10 years ago the Cards would have a legit FO and ownership and the Suns would be this frolicking mess.

Ill check back in this time next year where they hopefully don't f*** up the Wiggins pick.

I'm confused as to why you are so adamantly against this pick. I can see preferring McLemore, but I don't see McLemore or Noel or anyone not named Oladipo that would have been overwhelmingly preferred over Len.

Noel's knee is bad news. When the best training staff in sports says that, you LISTEN.

McLemore had not just one terrible workout, but two. Since the Suns didn't pick him, I'm going to assume they were actually telling the truth that he was terrible.

Who besides those two was available and clearly better than Alex Len?

 

[ASUCHRIS]

I'd say it's no better than 50-50 that Len turns out to be a better pro than Lopez. The near-unanimous rejection of Lopez on this board is bizarre to me. He started all 82 games for the Hornets last season and averaged better than 11 points on 53% shooting, along with 1.6 blocks. True, he's a poor rebounder, but Len's rebounding numbers are substandard also. If Len is still with the Suns in his fifth season and putting up Lopez numbers, I'll be pleasantly surprised.

Agreed, watching clips of him play, Rolo seems to be the best comparison. Still, getting a player of Lopez like talent in the top 5 is just not exciting at all.

Even more depressing, Horny talks about getting back to running and gunning, then spends a top 5 pick on a lumbering center.

In what way does that make sense?

 

[Chaplin]

Agreed, watching clips of him play, Rolo seems to be the best comparison. Still, getting a player of Lopez like talent in the top 5 is just not exciting at all.

Even more depressing, Horny talks about getting back to running and gunning, then spends a top 5 pick on a lumbering center.

In what way does that make sense?

Lumbering? Where do you get that from?

 

[3rdside]

Of course if Len is tskitishvilli to McLemore's Stoudemire then I'm sounding pretty stupid but I can't - please tell me i can't - see that happening here!

 

[jagu]

People comparing Len to Lopez need to stop watching basketball. Len is a very good face to face player who uses quick jab steps and moves to get around big men. He's way faster than Lopez and he also passes extremely well out of the post. He's better than Lolopez who crouches like a 6 foot guard and can't get any rebounds.

I'm not saying he is going to be a star but he's better than Lopez.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Lumbering? Where do you get that from?

Watching him play. Again, if you're trying to build a running team, Len seems like an odd pick.

The fact that he often disappeared and didn't contribute much in college is terrifying.

I'll give the guy a chance, but think most here would agree the odds of Len having a great career are less than that of Noel/Mac. Time will tell.

On the bright side, our roster next year should be awful enough for a top 3 pick, and hopefully we can get rid of Gortat ASAP.

 

[Arizona's Finest]

I'm confused as to why you are so adamantly against this pick. I can see preferring McLemore, but I don't see McLemore or Noel or anyone not named Oladipo that would have been overwhelmingly preferred over Len.

Noel's knee is bad news. When the best training staff in sports says that, you LISTEN.

McLemore had not just one terrible workout, but two. Since the Suns didn't pick him, I'm going to assume they were actually telling the truth that he was terrible.

Who besides those two was available and clearly better than Alex Len?

Id love to be wrong but Len looks like your protypical bust to me. Little production, disappears, soft, and valued because of his size. Noel and McLemore are PLUS at at least one thing (defense and shooting) whereas what the hell is Len exceptional at?

 

[JS22]

Agreed, watching clips of him play, Rolo seems to be the best comparison. Still, getting a player of Lopez like talent in the top 5 is just not exciting at all.

Even more depressing, Horny talks about getting back to running and gunning, then spends a top 5 pick on a lumbering center.

In what way does that make sense?

Did you actually watch the clips of Len? How you could call him "lumbering" is perplexing.

Check out the move around 33 seconds. Comparing him to Lopez and calling him a "lumbering center" just seems odd.

 

[Phrazbit]

I watch Len... I see Timofey Mozgov... without the hustle. I really really hope I am wrong but I dont see a favorable comparison to Len anywhere in the league. His college play was extremely underwhelming, he has a serious injury concern (stress fractures in a big as young as him is a serious red flag). I do not understand the hype at all.

I said before the draft that of the guys considered in the top 5 or 6 I could talk myself into any of them except for Len. Again, I hope I am wrong, but there were two guys on the board who carried their own risks but had elite skill sets, while Len carries the same risks and has IMO a much lower upside.

I preferred McLemore, that kind of shooting touch combined with his level of athleticism is rare for a player as young as him. He may have disappeared at times but he also put up strong numbers in the vast majority of games, Len was the opposite.

 

[tobiazz]

I'd say it's no better than 50-50 that Len turns out to be a better pro than Lopez. The near-unanimous rejection of Lopez on this board is bizarre to me. He started all 82 games for the Hornets last season and averaged better than 11 points on 53% shooting, along with 1.6 blocks. True, he's a poor rebounder, but Len's rebounding numbers are substandard also. If Len is still with the Suns in his fifth season and putting up Lopez numbers, I'll be pleasantly surprised.

*Switching to Len defense mode*

Len is a significantly better rebounder than Lopez, if college stats are to be trusted, and I have a hard time believing he'll be a worse pro when you factor in rebounding.

http://www.nbadraft.net/nba-draft-prospect-analysis-numbers

Lopez is not terrible be any means in non-rebounding areas, but I expect Len to be better in most of them except perhaps one-on-one defense against bulky centers. Taking Len at #5 feels a bit like taking Lopez at #13.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Did you actually watch the clips of Len? How you could call him "lumbering" is perplexing.

Check out the move around 33 seconds. Comparing him to Lopez and calling him a "lumbering center" just seems odd.

It also seems odd to base your entire opinion of a guy on highlight clips. Check out some of Rolo's for comparison. I'm talking about watching actual games, which for the most part, he's been a non-factor.

Like I said, we'll see if he ends up being a good pro, and I hope he does. But it's bizzare to me that people keep talking about how athletic and mobile he is.

Compare him to the guy that was one pick later, and tell me that Len is the one that is athletic and mobile.

 

[tobiazz]

Len is more likely to be a long term starter than McElmore an all-star. If there's a 70% chance of making $1000 or a 10% chance of making $2000, which game do you play? McElmore may end up the better player but taking him at 8 was a no-brainer, taking him at 5 with Len still on the board wasn't.

Why does McLemore have to be an all-star and Len only has to be a starter? McLemore has a better chance of being a long term starter than Len. On the Suns, Len will play behind Gortat at first and McLemore might be a starter on Day One.

I mean, could McLemore's workouts with the Suns be *that* bad that the guy doesn't beat out Dudley for the SG spot after pre-season? I really wish I could be a fly on the wall during those practices that made McLemore look worse than a guy in crutches who wasn't exactly stellar in college.

 

[JS22]

It also seems odd to base your entire opinion of a guy on highlight clips. Check out some of Rolo's for comparison. I'm talking about watching actual games, which for the most part, he's been a non-factor.

Like I said, we'll see if he ends up being a good pro, and I hope he does. But it's bizzare to me that people keep talking about how athletic and mobile he is.

Compare him to the guy that was one pick later, and tell me that Len is the one that is athletic and mobile.

Huh? You did the exact same thing:

Agreed, watching clips of him play, Rolo seems to be the best comparison.

Also, I'm not talking about his skill as a player. I'm purely responding to you calling him a "lumbering center." Which is something that you can immediately see as false after watching 20 seconds of video.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'd say it's no better than 50-50 that Len turns out to be a better pro than Lopez. The near-unanimous rejection of Lopez on this board is bizarre to me. He started all 82 games for the Hornets last season and averaged better than 11 points on 53% shooting, along with 1.6 blocks. True, he's a poor rebounder, but Len's rebounding numbers are substandard also. If Len is still with the Suns in his fifth season and putting up Lopez numbers, I'll be pleasantly surprised.

It's not like "better than 11 points" as a starter is going to win anyone over to the Lopez side. Especially since we're talking about someone that is a mediocre defender and a poor rebounder? He had, easily, the second best year of his career this past season and it still wasn't all that promising. Considering how bad his down years have been I think we're going to be a very unhappy board if Len peaks around Robin's level.

Steve

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Huh? You did the exact same thing:



Also, I'm not talking about his skill as a player. I'm purely responding to you calling him a "lumbering center." Which is something that you can immediately see as false after watching 20 seconds of video.

Pay attention. I said multiple times that I watched him in actual games, and am not judging him based on highlight films. Hell, anyone can look good in those.

Unfortunately, in things that actually matter, like actual game performance and impact, he wasn't good enough to make all ACC. Quibbling over whether he's athletic or not is tiresome.

The bottom line is I'm very concerned as to whether he'll make a major impact on the NBA level. He certainly didn't in college. Pretty terrifying.

 

[Griffin]

I think the Suns might be thinking of next year's draft with this pick. Next year's draft appears to be very deep with some really talented superstar-potential players, but not likely at the center position. With Len on the team now, it will be easier to fill the SG hole next year, even if the Suns don't get into top 5 again. Had the Suns picked McLemore now, they would still need a center and next year there will likely be better SG options available than McLemore when the Suns pick, but not likely better center options.

I wonder where would McLemore be drafted in next year's draft, if he already slid to #7 in much weaker draft.

And as far as not taking Noel, it's probably mostly due to the knee concerns. That and they wanted a more offensively-polished player.

McLemore would have definitely been a more exciting player to watch now, but there's a good chance the Suns might be able to pick someone better up next summer.

 

[elindholm]

I think the Suns might be thinking of next year's draft with this pick. Next year's draft appears to be very deep with some really talented superstar-potential players, but not likely at the center position. With Len on the team now, it will be easier to fill the SG hole next year, even if the Suns don't get into top 5 again. Had the Suns picked McLemore now, they would still need a center and next year there will likely be better SG options available than McLemore when the Suns pick, but not likely better center options.

McLemore would have definitely been a more exciting player to watch now, but there's a good chance the Suns might be able to pick someone better up next summer.

That's all true, but I wonder whether this moribund franchise can tolerate another entire season of waiting for next year. Last year's squad had no exciting young talent to develop, and now this year's squad is shaping up to be the same, unless Goodwin pans out. Len may prove to be competent, eventually, but he'll never be exciting, and excitement is what this fan base is sorely missing.

If the Suns had gone with McLemore and he bombed, it would still have been a better choice, because it would make the franchise look courageous and aggressive, plus put them in a better position for next year's draft anyway. McLemore was a win-win. Almost no one thinks that Len is going to step in and contribute right away, so there's very little reason to follow next year's team at all.

 

[Raindog]

I think the Suns might be thinking of next year's draft with this pick. Next year's draft appears to be very deep with some really talented superstar-potential players, but not likely at the center position. With Len on the team now, it will be easier to fill the SG hole next year, even if the Suns don't get into top 5 again. Had the Suns picked McLemore now, they would still need a center and next year there will likely be better SG options available than McLemore when the Suns pick, but not likely better center options.

That is a good point. In fact, I don't know if there are really any top level center prospects coming up in any of the next few drafts - possibly Okafor's cousin (if he doesn't turn out as one-dimensional as him).

I wasn't really bothered by the Suns taking some projects, given that the entire draft this year was a shot in the dark. But I can sympathize with the concern that Len could easily be another Skeet/Milicic - a guy who had impressive measurables and looked swell in workouts, but who didn't consistently show much in actual game action against top level competition. There are flocks of those type of Euro players every draft and 90% of them turn out to be non-factors in the league.

 

[SirStefan32]

I really don't get the Len hatred. I would have picked McLemore, but then again I wanted Tskitishvilli over Amare back in the day, so I don't know if I am the right person to make a pick. Having said that I would have picked McLemore, I just don't understand why people are freaking out about Len.
Guy who are 7'1, 250lb, can move like that, can play D, can block shots, have some nice moves on offense don't grow on trees. Don't get me wrong, I would rather have Tim Duncan, David Robinson, Patrick Ewing, Shaq, or Hakeem, but none of them were available.

 

[Cheesebeef]

And as far as not taking Noel, it's probably mostly due to the knee concerns. That and they wanted a more offensively-polished player.

McLemore would have definitely been a more exciting player to watch now, but there's a good chance the Suns might be able to pick someone better up next summer.

I've thought about both of those things...and they both make me upset. If true, it just wreaks of this team continuing to value offense over defense with Noel...and wanting to "win now". Noel is more of a project offensively then Len (even though he averaged 1 point less while getting to the FT line more) and Noel won't help as much this season. but a #5 pick, when you're franchise is literally awful with no hope shouldn't be about the upcoming year. it should be about the future. we apparently value offense and now as opposed to defense and the future... just like we always have.

and no one knows what will happen in next year's draft or where the chips may fall. thus, planning on addressing SG next year is faulty thinking, especially because next year will not only be stronger at SG, but likely stronger at the Power positions as well.

This team continues to value "polished

 

[JS22]

Pay attention. I said multiple times that I watched him in actual games, and am not judging him based on highlight films. Hell, anyone can look good in those.

Unfortunately, in things that actually matter, like actual game performance and impact, he wasn't good enough to make all ACC. Quibbling over whether he's athletic or not is tiresome.

The bottom line is I'm very concerned as to whether he'll make a major impact on the NBA level. He certainly didn't in college. Pretty terrifying.

Once again, I'm only referring to your comment that he is a lumbering center. When I think "lumbering," I think Tsakalidis, Ostertag, etc. Len is the complete opposite of those types of centers.

As far as how good he could be? Who knows?

 

[Phrazbit]

While I really dislike this pick...

On a positive note, at least we were not the team to draft Cody Zeller 4th. That had me doubled over in laughter when Stern announced it.

 

[Cheesebeef]

While I really dislike this pick...

On a positive note, at least we were not the team to draft Cody Zeller 4th. That had me doubled over in laughter when Stern announced it.

that's the only way the pick could have been worse.

 

[BC867]

People comparing Len to Lopez need to stop watching basketball. Len is a very good face to face player who uses quick jab steps and moves to get around big men. He's way faster than Lopez and he also passes extremely well out of the post. He's better than Lolopez who crouches like a 6 foot guard and can't get any rebounds.

I'm not saying he is going to be a star but he's better than Lopez.

Maturity, or lack of it, is part of a ballplayer's potential.

I have more confidence in this 20 year old Ukrainian than a 25 year old comic book reading American.

And he doesn't really have to develop into a star, just a good 255 lb. Center on a team trying to work its way back into (high) playoff contention.

The reality is that we have a long way to go before ever being considered an elite team, something we've never quite reached.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

2. Len was projected to go higher than 5 by almost everyone AND many think he has the highest ceiling of anyone in the draft.

This is absolutely not correct. See the super secret draft board post above where No GM gave him a 10. None. In the whole league.

We were clearly one of the 9s.