Anyone watching Jeremy Lin?

[Covert Rain]

westbrook is a scoring point guard like rose. that makes it even worse that he leads the league in turnovers because it means that he probably has a poor turnover to assist ratio. I don't know the number so I could be wrong. But i'm certain that nash typically has more assists than turnovers which is where a PG should be judged.

OKC is improving their defense and they have some big guys that can't score to save their life, but can block shots and rebound the ball.

The top 5 including Nash all have more assists versus turnovers. Nash has the best ratio among them. What I am saying is if you look at the overall performance of those teams a good defensive team can afford more turnovers than a bad one.

 

[Lorenzo]

The top 5 including Nash all have more assists versus turnovers. Nash has the best ratio among them. What I am saying is if you look at the overall performance of those teams a good defensive team can afford more turnovers than a bad one.

true, and turnovers against the wrong team lead to layups at the other end.

 

[MrYeahBut]

Espn leada with "A ***** in the Armor" re Knicks loss tonight and Lins 9 turnover.

I am dumbfounded. Care about racial derogatory terms doesnt seem to apply to asians.

They supposedly apologized but I couldn't find it on their website...

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/story/...-for-racial-slur-in-headline-about-knicks-lin

 

[Superbone]

Espn leada with "A ***** in the Armor" re Knicks loss tonight and Lins 9 turnover.

I am dumbfounded. Care about racial derogatory terms doesnt seem to apply to asians.

Please tell me you're joking.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Please tell me you're joking.

Nope. I saw it on the site. It was up for about 2 hours and then pulled. Someone is going to lose their job over this. I suppose someone could have just had a brain freeze and not thought about the double meaning, but wow.

 

[elindholm]

The headline was offensive, of course, but I confess I find it hilarious that someone either (a) didn't think about the double meaning or (b) knew exactly what he was doing and figured no one would mind. Either way, it's a level of obliviousness that's irresistibly funny.

 

[jagu]

I understand what you are trying to say about turnovers but you do realize that our two time MVP has been one of the league leaders in turnovers from his position year in and year out right? Nash is currently #5 in the NBA.

I am not saying that it's not an important stat because I think turnovers are important when your on a bad to mediocre defensive team which I think is the real issue and a staple on D'Antoni teams. Poor defensive teams have a much smaller margin of error and the reason why I have always felt the Suns could not get over the hump. This team never got stops when it counted and poured salt in the wound with stupid turnovers.

Westbrook (#1 in turnovers) and LeBron (#4 in turnovers) are on two of the best defensive teams and I don't think those turnovers are as big a deal IMO. Just saying that looking at the pure # of turnovers only is not enough.

It wasn't me who said that stat. Lin's turnovers would be less magnified for me (before people flip out) if it was against good competition. Some of these teams play very little defense so I question how he'll look against teams that work together on defense and actually do something other than stand around and have the best seats on the court. I haven't been overly impressed with his court vision or passing IQ as much as some of the hype around him has been. I don't know if you can teach court vision but more of an inherent trait, I don't think it's something that can be developed (again my opinion). Maybe because I'm a "self-hating Asian?"

Maybe he's a scoring guard who plays better with the hand in his ball and high usage? I know that Amare+Lin+Carmelo is over 100% usage so something has to give.

 

[Superbone]

Nope. I saw it on the site. It was up for about 2 hours and then pulled. Someone is going to lose their job over this. I suppose someone could have just had a brain freeze and not thought about the double meaning, but wow.

Yeah, I googled it after reading your post. There is no way the author wasn't aware of the double meaning.

http://deadspin.com/5886218/espns-headline-writers-join-in-the-linsanity-*****-in-the-armor-edition

 

[Superbone]

The headline was offensive, of course, but I confess I find it hilarious that someone either (a) didn't think about the double meaning or (b) knew exactly what he was doing and figured no one would mind. Either way, it's a level of obliviousness that's irresistibly funny.

I don't believe it's a result of obliviousness. More likely, the author's co-workers dared him to publish it.

 

[Lorenzo]

Who know's what happened. but this is just another black eye for the four letter. while it may be funny I admit, they are incredibly unprofessional and some of these goons should apply for jobs at comedy central or saturday night live.
max bretos originally said the statement on ESPN news on wednesday. they brought on a different anchor to apologize on his behalf(what did they do fire the guy on the spot?) then they use his line again on a headline? makes no sense. they don't care about professionalism at all.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/s...r-used-in-headline-on-lin.html?ref=basketball

 

[AzStevenCal]

Who know's what happened. but this is just another black eye for the four letter. while it may be funny I admit, they are incredibly unprofessional and some of these goons should apply for jobs at comedy central or saturday night live.
max bretos originally said the statement on ESPN news on wednesday. they brought on a different anchor to apologize on his behalf(what did they do fire the guy on the spot?) then they use his line again on a headline? makes no sense. they don't care about professionalism at all.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/02/19/s...r-used-in-headline-on-lin.html?ref=basketball

I'm no fan of ESPN but I think too much is being made of this. ESPN is ultra politically correct and this error probably has upper management in panic mode. There is no way they would have countenanced such a thing, and they'll probably air pro-Asain public service ads for the next billion years in an attempt to show how unbiased they are. They're ****** and they piss me off regularly but they aren't typically racially insensitive.

Steve

 

[Lorenzo]

I'm no fan of ESPN but I think too much is being made of this. ESPN is ultra politically correct and this error probably has upper management in panic mode. There is no way they would have countenanced such a thing, and they'll probably air pro-Asain public service ads for the next billion years in an attempt to show how unbiased they are. They're ****** and they piss me off regularly but they aren't typically racially insensitive.

Steve

maybe so, and i understand that you can't blame a whole company for the actions of one or two individuals. I get that...it just bothers me that they had the same exact thing happen twice. it has to be someone that knew what they were doing and did on purpose?

 

[cly2tw]

It wasn't me who said that stat. Lin's turnovers would be less magnified for me (before people flip out) if it was against good competition. Some of these teams play very little defense so I question how he'll look against teams that work together on defense and actually do something other than stand around and have the best seats on the court. I haven't been overly impressed with his court vision or passing IQ as much as some of the hype around him has been. I don't know if you can teach court vision but more of an inherent trait, I don't think it's something that can be developed (again my opinion). Maybe because I'm a "self-hating Asian?"

Maybe he's a scoring guard who plays better with the hand in his ball and high usage? I know that Amare+Lin+Carmelo is over 100% usage so something has to give.

I get what you point out here. Lin was a scoring PG of sort back in college. I'd say he has great court vision based on experience. As MDA criticized in the postgame press, Lin was trying too much too risky plays/passes out there that resulted in most of his turnovers. It's a combination of momentary vision over the court and decision over alternatives of plays to run. Nash didn't have the same court vision his first 3 years in the league which he now has. I remember seeing him repeatedly get trapped around the basket back then, just like Lin was experiencing in the Hornets or Wolves games. But he improved to most viewers' surprise and won MVP twice. What indeed cannot be taught is the basic capacity to be able to learn this way in the first place. Players like Marbury, Iverson, Monte Ellis, Dragic, Brooks, Toney Douglas don't have this learning capacity. Lin has it based on what he showed us so far.

I believe it'd do him good to reduce his dribbles and emulate more Stockton than Nash to start his career. He is good enough of a shooter to be useful when Melo goes on ISO plays. And he is so good with his drivings, he'd be less TO prone after the ball rotated to him with 10 sec on the clock when the defense maybe a little in disorder compared to the start of the clock with fully set defense designed to stop him. In fact, I believe the reason he has less TOs in the 4th is reduced defensive focus due to tired legs so that it's easier to find a little more room to operate with.

 

[Lorenzo]

I'm watching him in the dallas game now and the mavericks are trapping him like he is kobe. no reason, play him straight up.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'm watching him in the dallas game now and the mavericks are trapping him like he is kobe. no reason, play him straight up.

I missed the start of the game so I don't know how it's working here but it's certainly part of what I'd do to contain the guy. Trap him frequently and play him as physically as the refs will allow. In fact, take your fouls and beat him up the same way successful teams play Nash. I hate that style of play but there's no doubt it's effective.

Steve

 

[Lorenzo]

I missed the start of the game so I don't know how it's working here but it's certainly part of what I'd do to contain the guy. Trap him frequently and play him as physically as the refs will allow. In fact, take your fouls and beat him up the same way successful teams play Nash. I hate that style of play but there's no doubt it's effective.

Steve

that's exactly what they did to him in the first half and he looks like he struggled to talk in the halftime interview. the mavericks are only losing because they aren't rebounding the ball....not because Lin is doing anything extraordinary. they are getting stops but they are giving the knicks too many second shots. the mavs are using their full bench and D'Antoni is riding his guys into the ground. we will see how that plays out in the 4th qtr.

 

[Absolute Zero]

Lin has 12 points, 6 assists and only 1 turnover in the first half, not too shabby! He is getting more shots than Amare, not watching the game yet so I just presume that is what the defense is giving.

 

[Lorenzo]

Lin has 12 points, 6 assists and only 1 turnover in the first half, not too shabby! He is getting more shots than Amare, not watching the game yet so I just presume that is what the defense is giving.

he's playing well and is handling the double teams well. looks a lot like steve nash potential eventhough he's young. the mavericks are playing great defense until it comes time to rebound. that is really the difference in the game. the knicks are going to be a good team in the playoffs if d'antoni uses all of his arsenal. my only question with him is that he falls in love with that short rotation and that doesn't work.

 

[AzStevenCal]

that's exactly what they did to him in the first half and he looks like he struggled to talk in the halftime interview. the mavericks are only losing because they aren't rebounding the ball....not because Lin is doing anything extraordinary. they are getting stops but they are giving the knicks too many second shots. the mavs are using their full bench and D'Antoni is riding his guys into the ground. we will see how that plays out in the 4th qtr.

Looking at the box score it doesn't really seem like you're correct here. The starters for NY have played more minutes but Dallas is really just playing one more guy than the Knicks are (9 guys vs 8). Lin has logged 22 minutes but their offense falls apart when he's off the court and he should still have fairly fresh legs as he only just started playing. I'd be more worried about Dirk's 19 minutes and the impact of extra minutes on him than I would about Lin.

Steve

 

[Lorenzo]

Looking at the box score it doesn't really seem like you're correct here. The starters for NY have played more minutes but Dallas is really just playing one more guy than the Knicks are (9 guys vs 8). Lin has logged 22 minutes but their offense falls apart when he's off the court and he should still have fairly fresh legs as he only just started playing. I'd be more worried about Dirk's 19 minutes and the impact of extra minutes on him than I would about Lin.

Steve

even with terry coming back dallas is down 2 guards that normally log more minutes which is why their rotation is shorter right now. kidd
s mins are being tightly managed and the mavericks will play their whole rotation and give dirk rest for long periods if needed. since they play boston tomorrow my guess is he will probably play less than 19 in the second half. my point is that D'antoni always plays a short rotation and that is why his teams blow so many 4th quarter games that they lead. dallas used to do it all the time with don nelson who coaches the same exact way.

 

[AzStevenCal]

even with terry coming back dallas is down 2 guards that normally log more minutes which is why their rotation is shorter right now. and the mavericks will play their whole rotation and give dirk rest for long periods if needed. since they play boston tomorrow my guess is he will probably play less than 19 in the second half. my point is that D'antoni always plays a short rotation and that is why his teams blow so many 4th quarter games that they lead. dallas used to do it all the time with don nelson who coaches the same exact way.

I don't think that holds as true for Mike today as it used to. Let's see what happens when this team fully integrates JR Smith and Baron Davis to an already reasonably deep team (once Melo re-enters the lineup). If Melo finds a way to play with Dantoni's offense instead of being the ball-stopper he has been this might become one of the best teams in the league.

Steve

 

[Lorenzo]

I don't think that holds as true for Mike today as it used to. Let's see what happens when this team fully integrates JR Smith and Baron Davis to an already reasonably deep team (once Melo re-enters the lineup). If Melo finds a way to play with Dantoni's offense instead of being the ball-stopper he has been this might become one of the best teams in the league.

Steve

I agree with you there 100%

my question for that is how is he going to use baron davis. I know lin is young, but age doesn't really play that big of a role if you are playing 42-48 mins a game you are going to wear down and burn out. especially against physical defensive teams. he has to learn from what he did with nash. davis is a great asset and if he gets playing time they can go far.

 

[Lorenzo]

Dallas is playing very sloppy. this lead should be more than 10...their defense is great they just need to slow down and play their game with dirk making all of his shots against guards. amare and chandler don't even want to think about trying to guard him.

 

[Absolute Zero]

JR Smith was clearly a huge acquisition based upon what I am seeing here. And Nowak or Novak or whatever his name is, Lin is finding him and he is draining everything. Great game by Lin who also just drained a three.

 

[Lorenzo]

JR Smith was clearly a huge acquisition based upon what I am seeing here. And Nowak or Novak or whatever his name is, Lin is finding him and he is draining everything. Great game by Lin who also just drained a three.

JR was a great pick up especially when melo comes back. he can help take some pressure off of Lin, but Lin has it going right now. I thought Lin played very poorly in the 3rd vs dallas and they were fortunate not to get blown out of the arena because dallas didn't really do anything with all of those turnovers, but Lin finished strong which to me is where I judge a player. how do you play with the game on the line? Lin obviously is a great talent and has a lot of potential even after only 7 or 8 games. JR is going to make shots during the game, but you have to watch him because he will shoot you out of a game as well.

Lin looks like a guy that will win games late in the 4th. sorry melo, but I would put the ball in lin's hands late in the game and let him create wide open shots for other people like he did today vs dallas. that's big for the knicks. great win for them they created a lot of turnovers and scored a lot of easy points vs. dallas getting the mavs out of the half court.

it's kind of strange to think that melo one of the league's most popular player is now the guy that will have to come in and play second fiddle to lin. he will have to fit in now. I think melo is at a crossroads in his career now. He can come in and take it to the next level and help his team compete in the playoffs.