Leinart Worth Keeping...

[ReddBird]

...according to ESPN Mag (12/24/09 issue, anyway). I recently came across the issue at my local library's used book/mag sale and these are the highlights: ...in Arizona, Matt Leinart is considered a bust, through little fault of his own. He started 11 games in 2006, and while his stats weren't too hot, play-by-play analysis pegs him as a victim of a running game that left him facing a perpetual third and long. For all the criticism he weathered, Leinart was a league-average QB....

But, wait, there's more! In fact, Leinart's first-year numbers far surpass what Mark Sanchez and Matthew Stafford have produced so far this season. In his second season, Leinart started five games -- his stats were once again above replacement level -- before breaking his collarbone. ...So is Leinart a dud or just a guy who doesn't fit a particular offense as well as Kurt Warner fits it? We won't know until some team gives him another shot. Which will happen. More than one personnel guy has told me that if he were to take over a team with a hole at QB, he'd call the Cardinals and try to pry Leinart away for a couple of midround picks.

If this article's been addressed elsewhere, I missed it. Most of us thought Matt looked lousy last week and, personally, I've never been dazzled by his abilities.

But could he be our QBOF if he took first team reps and the plays were geared around his talents?

 

[cardsfanmd]

The people who are counting Matt out already don't know very much about football. He is not Kurt Warner, but who is??? Matty will be more than fine as a starter for us next year.

 

[az jam]

The people who are counting Matt out already don't know very much about football. He is not Kurt Warner, but who is??? Matty will be more than fine as a starter for us next year.

We have to at least give him a chance. (Training camp, preseason games all as a starter and then of course the regular season.)

 

[SECTION 11]

I'm totally in Leinart's camp. I think we'll be just fine.

 

[sportznutt]

Isn't he due like $8 million next season?

 

[gamebird98]

I say we give him his chance...but not overly confident from what I have seen!

 

[Buckybird]

Isn't he due like $8 million next season?

after next season

 

[cardsfanmd]

Isn't he due like $8 million next season?

I talked to Mike Bidwill over the summer and he said the bonus isn't nearly as steep as some are making it out to be. Regardless, Graves needs to get on his "A" game and hammer out an extension.

 

[MrYeahBut]

I'm totally in Leinart's camp. I think we'll be just fine.

I remain hopeful for ML. If the likes of Dilfer/Hostetler can win the big one, I believe if they surround Leinart with the right pieces he could be adaquate enough to be a good player for the Cards

 

[gamebird98]

I think the TEAM can win with Matt if the Defense becomes more consistant.

 

[Shane]

The people who are counting Matt out already don't know very much about football. He is not Kurt Warner, but who is??? Matty will be more than fine as a starter for us next year.

Nobody expects Leinart to look like Kurt Warner. But we should certainly expect him to be able to come into a game and manage it, make accurate throws & not throw int's.

Leinart doesnt even look comfortable on the field. After three years in the same sysytem and same coach. Thats pathetic. He looks scared and he plays scared.

I certainly dont think he is incapable of turning it around at some point(but I'm not holding my breath). But you making the blanket statement "Matty will be more than fine as a starter for us next year" shows you aren't no football genius either.

Because from what Matt has shown us you are spitting in the wind with that comment.

 

[Second Deck]

I am wearing a Leinart jersey today so he had better make it. If not this jersey will have to join the Plummer, Hearst, Centers and James jersey's in my closet.

I was very glad when Matt was available when we picked. If he had not been for a terrible preseason last year he would have been the starter. I think he will be Ok and this time behind Kurt may be the best thing for Matt. I would just like to see more fire out of Matt.

 

[Buckybird]

He looks scared and he plays scared.

yeah this


I really think his shoulder injuries are a big reason for his struggles.

 

[dogpoo32]

I'm back on the Leinart wagon, after a week off.

 

[MoeIsBetter]

Some of you guys really suprise me. Most threads you guys are football guru's but when it comes to Leinart, I just don't think some of you have a clue (not based on this thread but most Leinart threads).

My step dad has been a football coach (now personal QB trainer) almost his entire life. Here are some of the things we always talk about:

1. Our offense is a timing offense. When Warner makes most of his passes its before the reciever even looks at the ball. It makes it very difficult for defenses because you never know when/where the ball could show up because the reciever never has to watch it come from the QB's hand. Matt Leinart doesn't have that kind of timing (yet). That takes ALOT of practice. Not just a week or half the reps but months, maybe even a year or two. To judge him based off a couple meaningless games he got thrown into is almost pointless.

2. Matt Leinart is a left handed passer. Does anybody know how many left handed passers are in the league? Four. Mark Brunnel, Matt Leinart, Michael Vick, and Pat White. What does that mean? When Kurt Warner says hike his reads are mostly formed going right to left. That means most cuts (or when a reciever should be getting open) happen that way too. So when Matt comes in the game he has to look for cross body passes first or he is looking at the right side of the field to late. I know alot of people will say "just flip the play" but its not always that easy at this level. It isn't Madden. Plays are called to set up plays later. You NEED to keep our guys running the same patterns our it affects what you try to run later. Sit down with a coach who coaches at that level and they will tell you, flipping a play just doesn't work like you think it would. So when Matt takes over our playbook WILL change. The coach will take his plays and mess them up to fit a player making his reads left to right.

3. The one knock I have on Matt is something I don't think he is really aware of or can easily change. When he is GIVEN the reigns to see what he has full time I think we see a different Matt Leinart. When he gets put in a game now, its almost to much pressure for him to go out and do well. He tries to do to much on some throws just to show he can do it. He's trying to hard. He needs to just sit back and let it come, because it will with a timing offense. His accuracy can only be determined I say after at least 2-3 months of being the full time starter.

With all of those things combined, it reeks of failure. How you expect to see anything good out of that (or anything you feel you can make a judgement about) is impossible. Give the kid a full offseason/training camp/etc. before we see what direction we need to go in. For all we know, we have the next Aaron Roders and wouldn't that be nice?

 

[cardsfanmd]

shows you aren't no football genius.

Maybe not Shane, but at least I'm able to formulate a sentence with proper english and grammar.

As for Matty, let's make a bet. Any ideas?

 

[MrYeahBut]

Maybe not Shane, but at least I'm able to formulate a sentence with proper english and grammar.

MD, when you finally get the point across to Shane there is a difference between there & their, your & you're, I will consider all your hard work a complete success.

 

[slanidrac16]

Some of you guys really suprise me. Most threads you guys are football guru's but when it comes to Leinart, I just don't think some of you have a clue (not based on this thread but most Leinart threads).

My step dad has been a football coach (now personal QB trainer) almost his entire life. Here are some of the things we always talk about:

1. Our offense is a timing offense. When Warner makes most of his passes its before the reciever even looks at the ball. It makes it very difficult for defenses because you never know when/where the ball could show up because the reciever never has to watch it come from the QB's hand. Matt Leinart doesn't have that kind of timing (yet). That takes ALOT of practice. Not just a week or half the reps but months, maybe even a year or two. To judge him based off a couple meaningless games he got thrown into is almost pointless.

2. Matt Leinart is a left handed passer. Does anybody know how many left handed passers are in the league? Four. Mark Brunnel, Matt Leinart, Michael Vick, and Pat White. What does that mean? When Kurt Warner says hike his reads are mostly formed going right to left. That means most cuts (or when a reciever should be getting open) happen that way too. So when Matt comes in the game he has to look for cross body passes first or he is looking at the right side of the field to late. I know alot of people will say "just flip the play" but its not always that easy at this level. It isn't Madden. Plays are called to set up plays later. You NEED to keep our guys running the same patterns our it affects what you try to run later. Sit down with a coach who coaches at that level and they will tell you, flipping a play just doesn't work like you think it would. So when Matt takes over our playbook WILL change. The coach will take his plays and mess them up to fit a player making his reads left to right.

3. The one knock I have on Matt is something I don't think he is really aware of or can easily change. When he is GIVEN the reigns to see what he has full time I think we see a different Matt Leinart. When he gets put in a game now, its almost to much pressure for him to go out and do well. He tries to do to much on some throws just to show he can do it. He's trying to hard. He needs to just sit back and let it come, because it will with a timing offense. His accuracy can only be determined I say after at least 2-3 months of being the full time starter.

With all of those things combined, it reeks of failure. How you expect to see anything good out of that (or anything you feel you can make a judgement about) is impossible. Give the kid a full offseason/training camp/etc. before we see what direction we need to go in. For all we know, we have the next Aaron Roders and wouldn't that be nice?

When I think of Leinart , I like to think back of the promise he showed as a rookie and 2nd year. I think most fans are "show me now", no matter what the circumstance.
Also skewing our thoughts is watching other teams. It seems when other teams lose their starter, their back-up comes in and the drop off seems minimal. Leinart played well against the Titans. Not pro-bowl worthy, but he didn't lose the game for us. However, many times recently when he does come into a game it is under controlled a controlled circumstance, like last week. I'm not making excuses for him, but his latest opportunities are not enough to judge his capabilities.

We had all better get use to the thought of Matt as our next QB, especially if Warner retires after this year.

 

[slinslin]

Well I am not a NFL guru but I watch pretty much all Cardinals games and at least 1 other game on the weekend and I have to say that everytime I have seen Leinart he has been an absolute failure.

The Cardinals should get rid off him, maybe Carrol wants to give up some value to get him for the Seahawks.

Also I think the Cards could get a better guy than Leinart.

Either signing or trading for someone like McNabb or Vick if Warner retires or drafting a QB early as players like Roethlisberger, Flacco, Ryan and Sanchez for example have shown what rookie QBs can do and Leinart has done none of that really.

 

[Goldfield]

I think the TEAM can win with Matt if the Defense becomes more consistant.

And the running game.

 

[SoCal Cardfan]

I've done plenty of Matt bashing.. so I'll keep this to a minimum.

When I was watching Sanchez yesterday, I was amazed by his poise/leadership in the huddle, pre-snap.. he looks as comfortable as anyone to me.

Now cue up any Leinart footage you might have.. He looks fearful pre-snap, and usually locks on to his first read.
His expressions show zero confidence, and his teammates no doubt see it, and are affected as well.

 

[MoeIsBetter]

Well I am not a NFL guru but I watch pretty much all Cardinals games and at least 1 other game on the weekend and I have to say that everytime I have seen Leinart he has been an absolute failure.

The Cardinals should get rid off him, maybe Carrol wants to give up some value to get him for the Seahawks.

Wow that could be the most bone headed move I'd ever think of. We can all say we have absolutely NO idea how good/bad Matt Leinart really is and you want to give him to a rival AND a coach that Leinart REALLY excelled under? I can see the post 5 years from now:

Jan 1. 2015
And there we go watching the Seahawks take another playoff run. Wow, how dumb were we for trading Leinart to a DIVISION RIVAL? Stupid Whiz...

 

[slinslin]

And the running game.

Well then you would definately trade Boldin, I don't see the value of having two expensive WRs in a team with a below average QB that can't utilize them anyway and a team that is build for running and defense because you lack a good QB.

 

[MoeIsBetter]

Well then you would definately trade Boldin, I don't see the value of having two expensive WRs in a team with a below average QB that can't utilize them anyway and a team that is build for running and defense because you lack a good QB.

I agree. The offense will change when Warner retires, even if it isn't Matt taking snaps. With Fitz being the guy here, Boldin's days are numbered here. He may have even played his last game as a Cardinal already. Whiz has said all along that he wants to play smash mouth football but also knows we have a shot at a SB with Warner. Just wait lol. We are going to see a COMPLETLY different product a couple years from now.

 

[MoeIsBetter]

I've done plenty of Matt bashing.. so I'll keep this to a minimum.

When I was watching Sanchez yesterday, I was amazed by his poise/leadership in the huddle, pre-snap.. he looks as comfortable as anyone to me.

Now cue up any Leinart footage you might have.. He looks fearful pre-snap, and usually locks on to his first read.
His expressions show zero confidence, and his teammates no doubt see it, and are affected as well.

LoL Funny you bring up Sanchez when compared to Matt's rookie year, Matt had the better stats. Another HUGE difference with both guys is Sanchez knew he was the guy from day one. Leinart doesn't even start, let alone know what his future holds. Great argument though.