lol @ how dirty the Spurs play..

[Bufalay]

raja does the same stuff........LOL.

if you were a spurs fan you'd love him. this is just a case of people hating him and others on that team because phoenix can't beat them in the playoffs.....that's all. the suns need to play with some physicality and attitude on the court. not in the press conference and not after the whistle......they have that part down pat. if they can do that they may finally beat the spurs and you guys will stop whining so darn much. you have to be physical at both ends it you want to be a champion. bowen is a champion....he may not be great but he is a champion and every great nba player will tell you to a man that he is a relentless defender. maybe the suns need more players like him playing defense....a relentless attitude that is. I won't deny that he and other players on that team have crossed the line in the heat of battle. but anyone who has ever played a sport with some passion should understand that it happens. it's part of the game. just like raja's kobe-slam that everyone on here praised him for. sometimes it's just a homer thing.

Awesome response! Exactly the response that I explicitly said did not apply. Bowen is a dirty player, yes. If he were on the Suns I would like him because he does the same crap as Bell? No, I don't like Bell either. I don't like any BS player who pull cheap crap because he sucks. Bell sucks and Bowen sucks and I don't like either of them.

 

[Phade]

bell does not suck lol..

 

[Proteus]

The Mavs are soft.

 

[arwillan]

That's a great argument for why Bowen isn't dirty. Oh wait...

i wasn't using that point to try and prove bowen is dirty, i was simply pointing out that before suns fans criticize the spurs team as a whole for being dirty, they shouldn't look past a couple of things the suns have done.

 

[arwillan]

Bell has a much larger skill set than bowen. Not only can he dribble the ball without turning it over every time, but he can also shoot the 3 from anywhere on the floor instead of just the corner, hit free throws, hit mid range shots, and play defense without injuring people.

 

[Bufalay]

Bell has a much larger skill set than bowen. Not only can he dribble the ball without turning it over every time, but he can also shoot the 3 from anywhere on the floor instead of just the corner, hit free throws, hit mid range shots, and play defense without injuring people.

True.

 

[shazaam6]

Bell and Bowen don't compare.
Bell threw Kobe down because he was getting elbowed and the refs weren't calling it. He had had enough and didn't try to sneak some retaliation. Bell's story is supported because Kobe elbows Barbosa in the first quarter of the game Bell is suspended in and Leandro has to have stitches.

Bowen is sneaky so you're not sure someone would do what he does on purpose until you see he has done it to alot of people. Now there can no longer be any doubt.

Bowen isn't retaliating, he is instigating and what he does causes injuries. BTW are there any other kicks to the face in the NBA on youtube not involving Bowen? Bowen has twice kicked a player in the face with his foot. How does that happen?

Tell me if you don't follow the pattern
Bowen kicks Ray
Bowen kicks Amare
Bowen kicks Wally
Bowen kicks Paul

Bowen steps under many players and causes ankle injuries.
Bowen knees Nash

Bowen is a jackass.

 

[dodie53]

Bell has a much larger skill set than bowen. Not only can he dribble the ball without turning it over every time, but he can also shoot the 3 from anywhere on the floor instead of just the corner, hit free throws, hit mid range shots, and play defense without injuring people.

this is the most important part

 

[Darth Llama]

I haven't really seen Bell do anything blatantly dirty outside of his chicken **** clothesline on Kobe. I don't like Bell that much, but I wouldn't even put him in the same classification as Bowen. Bowen is the absolute dirtiest player in the game. The only one even close to him is Danny Fortson. Those two are pure scum.

 

[ambchang_]

I have given you some of the most objective opinion available. You are ignoring it to squabble with the namecallers. If you would ignore the provocation (or stop doing the provoking) and get back on topic, you might be taken more seriously.

It has not gone unnoticed by me that you post here lately (last several weeks) much more than you post in Spurstalk. There's plenty of Bruce Bowen hand wringing going on in there, including MANY Spurs fans willing to admit that Bowen employs cheap, punk tactics.

Really? Spurs fans were generally thinking that the suspension is inconsistent and not justified given that he did not make any contact with Paul.

I have shown videos that clearly shown Bowen did NOT kick Paul, and you chose to show a video that shows that it looks like Bowen did kick Paul because of the angle. How is that objective. You just elected to ignore the video that cleared Bowen, and I have shown that it is not possible to show no contact when there actually was contact, but possible to make it appear that there was contact when there was actually no contact involved.

You objective argument was that you felt the suspension was justified with no back up statements, how is that objective?

I have stated that Bowen kicked Allen and was not suspended in the past (which is the dirtiest thing he had done in his career). I have also showed that suspensions has been more severe actions in the past (punches, actual kicks, elbows in the face, flagrant fouls, etc ...)

 

[ambchang_]

Ok, I'll give you this, yes he is an NBA player and hence better than me. As far as NBA players goes, he sucks. Plain and simple. His shot is overrated garbage, he has no touch. He can hit the corner 3, that's it. Good for him, there are 10000000000 old ass guys at every park in the country that can hit a wide open shot from some select spot on the court. He can't handle the ball, he doesn't rebound. He has mastered the art of subtle cheap shots. Either he does these illegal moves subconsciously or he just works on them constantly.

Some of the stuff he gets away with you can't tell that he is doing them until you watch him in slow motion. The main thing that comes to mind is that kick on Amare. I thought Amare was just whining until I watched it in slow motion. The guy is clearly taking a swipe, can we agree that in slow motion this looks like a kick? If so, what do you think is his motivation for this? I would guess that it he is doing it for intimidation. Obviously, there is no way to know what his intent is, but it just seems that every little cheap trick he uses is completely deliberate.

I don't want to hear some stupid Bowen defense in the form of, "Raja Bell does the same stuff" or "Look Chris Paul is dirty too." That isn't my point, my point is that Bruce Bowen is a cheap bastard.

I can't say that he was kicking Amare. The most telling evidence is Amare's reactions. Check it, he didn't react after the play, after the game, it was after he reviewed the tape and all the media talking about it before he came out. The slow motion tape came up and showed that contact was minimal, if happened at all, and he retracted his statements.

As for Bowen is a terrible player because he's got no offensive game, then you must have neglected the other side of the court. He was voted into all-D teams by coaches. Not media, not fans, but coaches. Coaches will not vote for dirty players whose sole intention is to hurt their own players.

 

[ambchang_]

Stop ignoring points in other posts that clearly refute you and actually show some logic, then we'll see.

such as? I actually would like you to recap those, I am missing them obviously.

Show it, and I will see if I can refute any of them.

 

[ambchang_]

Maybe that's why Suns fans get so angry? Because the NBA rewards dirty play in the playoffs? Because there are two sets of rules? Because cheaters get rewarded? Since all of the above are unquestionably true, it's small wonder you hear a lot about it from Suns fans. And rightfully so.

A hard foul is cheating? Tell you want, the league allows 6 cheats a game on each player, and up to two hard cheats a game.

A hip check is a flagrant foul, and it was accessed as such. In no point in the history of the NBA was a player suspended 2 games for a flagrant 1 foul.

Also, in no point in the last 15 years of the league did any player not get suspended for leaving the bench in an altercation.

 

[msdundee]

Bell and Bowen don't compare.
Bell threw Kobe down because he was getting elbowed and the refs weren't calling it. He had had enough and didn't try to sneak some retaliation. Bell's story is supported because Kobe elbows Barbosa in the first quarter of the game Bell is suspended in and Leandro has to have stitches.

Bowen is sneaky so you're not sure someone would do what he does on purpose until you see he has done it to alot of people. Now there can no longer be any doubt.

Bowen isn't retaliating, he is instigating and what he does causes injuries.

That's in a nutshell--plus the fact that Raja owned up to it without playing innocent or claiming he was "falsely accused," another huge difference.

 

[da_suns_fan]

Really? Spurs fans were generally thinking that the suspension is inconsistent and not justified given that he did not make any contact with Paul.

I have shown videos that clearly shown Bowen did NOT kick Paul, and you chose to show a video that shows that it looks like Bowen did kick Paul because of the angle. How is that objective. You just elected to ignore the video that cleared Bowen, and I have shown that it is not possible to show no contact when there actually was contact, but possible to make it appear that there was contact when there was actually no contact involved.

You objective argument was that you felt the suspension was justified with no back up statements, how is that objective?

I have stated that Bowen kicked Allen and was not suspended in the past (which is the dirtiest thing he had done in his career). I have also showed that suspensions has been more severe actions in the past (punches, actual kicks, elbows in the face, flagrant fouls, etc ...)

You are pathetic if you didn't see that Bruce Bowen kicked Chris Paul.

I saw what you guys were doing on SpursTalk. Slowing the footage down as much as possible to try to mitigate the contact and then claim that Chris Paul was acting.

Bowen kicked Paul. This was clear as crystal. You guys are having a hissy fit because he got caught.

Bowen deserved the suspension, and hopefully its just the first step the league is taking to let Bruce Bowen know that his cheating play isn't going to be allowed anymore. Time to step up and play basketball like a man.

 

[jagu]

Yesterday he stuck his foot out and tripped Paul Pierce, and then threw his hands up in innocence. If this was Iraq, Saddam would chopped off Bowen's feet by now. Dirty bum. It sucks to play streetball with his kids for sure.

 

[msdundee]

That's in a nutshell--plus the fact that Raja owned up to it without playing innocent or claiming he was "falsely accused," another huge difference.

One thing, though: Bowen's reference to his Christianity and the implied comparison of his suspension to the persecution of Jesus did inject some comedy into his denial. At least he apparently has a sense of humor.

 

[jbeecham]

You are pathetic if you didn't see that Bruce Bowen kicked Chris Paul.

I saw what you guys were doing on SpursTalk. Slowing the footage down as much as possible to try to mitigate the contact and then claim that Chris Paul was acting.

Bowen kicked Paul. This was clear as crystal. You guys are having a hissy fit because he got caught.

Bowen deserved the suspension, and hopefully its just the first step the league is taking to let Bruce Bowen know that his cheating play isn't going to be allowed anymore. Time to step up and play basketball like a man.

I wouldn't be surprised if they removed a few frames from the video so that there is no contact.....that's what Laker fans tried to do to say Kobe wasn't elbowing Raja. They just find a different angle, slow down the video, remove a few frames and viola......Kobe is elbowing Raja in the shoulder and Raja's flopping like he got his head knocked off (according to some Laker fans). Then the video gets posted on Youtube like it's real.

 

[da_suns_fan]

One thing, though: Bowen's reference to his Christianity and the implied comparison of his suspension to the persecution of Jesus did inject some comedy into his denial. At least he apparently has a sense of humor.

No joke....Saint Bruce!!!

 

[jagu]

One thing, though: Bowen's reference to his Christianity and the implied comparison of his suspension to the persecution of Jesus did inject some comedy into his denial. At least he apparently has a sense of humor.

I think his faith in Christianity is what prevents him from getting his jaw knocked out by some other player.

 

[jagu]

Passion of the Bruce, coming soon to theaters near you.

"Watch young Jesus jumpkick and trip Romans who try to persecute him!"

 

[da_suns_fan]

Passion of the Bruce, coming soon to theaters near you.

"Watch young Jesus jumpkick and trip Romans who try to persecute him!"

Awesome!

 

[Cheesewater]

Really? Spurs fans were generally thinking that the suspension is inconsistent and not justified given that he did not make any contact with Paul.

I said there are many Spurs fans admitting Bowen's transgressions. It's true.

I have shown videos that clearly shown Bowen did NOT kick Paul, and you chose to show a video that shows that it looks like Bowen did kick Paul because of the angle. How is that objective. You just elected to ignore the video that cleared Bowen, and I have shown that it is not possible to show no contact when there actually was contact, but possible to make it appear that there was contact when there was actually no contact involved.

No. You have not shown videos that clearly show Bowen did NOT kick Paul. Bowen kicked at Paul twice. Contact or no contact, it is a dirty, cheap act punishable by suspension. Parse the video all you want, Bowen has been found guilty.

You objective argument was that you felt the suspension was justified with no back up statements, how is that objective?

Objective, because I have no interest in all the other players/teams affected by Bowen's documented cheap shots.

I have stated that Bowen kicked Allen and was not suspended in the past (which is the dirtiest thing he had done in his career). I have also showed that suspensions has been more severe actions in the past (punches, actual kicks, elbows in the face, flagrant fouls, etc ...)

Don't compare one suspension to another. There are relatively few degrees of suspension available. He got the least available. Also, you keep ignoring the history of questionable play. You are in serious denial.

 

[Lorenzo]

Awesome response! Exactly the response that I explicitly said did not apply. Bowen is a dirty player, yes. If he were on the Suns I would like him because he does the same crap as Bell? No, I don't like Bell either. I don't like any BS player who pull cheap crap because he sucks. Bell sucks and Bowen sucks and I don't like either of them.

well you got me. I fell into your trap. if you don't like bell either than I admire that.....because that means you aren't being hypocritical. I don't buy that getting elbowed justifies slamming someone to the ground like some have said......at that the team's star player. I don't like horry's foul on nash either. what I will say is for whatever reason in the heat of battle players get frustrated and lose control. bell probably didn't help things when he went at horry in retaliation.....but it happens they are human. You can call those guys dirty if you want. I know if it were me I want a guy on my team who plays with passion. Not a weak minded fellow who follows every rule in the book. I don't know many of those who make it in bball.....much less the playoffs. Their is a lot of head trauma on here......at least when it comes to the spurs. gosh I hope the suns eliminate the spurs so it will all end.

 

[Cheesewater]

well you got me. I fell into your trap. if you don't like bell either than I admire that.....because that means you aren't being hypocritical. I don't buy that getting elbowed justifies slamming someone to the ground like some have said......at that the team's star player. I don't like horry's foul on nash either. what I will say is for whatever reason in the heat of battle players get frustrated and lose control. bell probably didn't help things when he went at horry in retaliation.....but it happens they are human. You can call those guys dirty if you want. I know if it were me I want a guy on my team who plays with passion. Not a weak minded fellow who follows every rule in the book. I don't know many of those who make it in bball.....much less the playoffs. Their is a lot of head trauma on here......at least when it comes to the spurs. gosh I hope the suns eliminate the spurs so it will all end.

Still, there is a gulf of difference between a guy that snaps once and pulls a ninja take-down of someone and a guy that has a documented history of dangerous and cheap "defensive" moves.