Marshall is a Dolphin

[Crazy Canuck]

Perhaps. Marshall has slightly better numbers and is younger. But, I can live with that.

I do believe improving pass rush will improve the secondary. We will see if Cards will do anything about pass rush which is IMO is one of the top three priority of the off season.

Always room for improvement and a full year of Acho / Scofield will help with that, but the Cards are not bad in the sack department:

Minny / Philly: 50
Balt / NYG: 48
Cinci: 45
Houston: 44

CARDS: 42

 

[joeshmo]

He proves to work and work well in Hortons D and he calls him his "MVP". They were willing to give him 3.5 mill last year. But after he proved himself they weren't willing to pay him 5.33 mill a year to match Miami's offer.

I don't get it.

 

[kerouac9]

Looking at that list I'd save my money and just use Andre Roberts as our #2WR.

What do you think about DeMarco Sampson? I've seen some flashes from him and WRs really improve from year 1 to year 2. Could he be the 6'2" WR we'll need to complement Fitz and Roberts?

I feel the same about DeMarco Sampson as I do about Stephen Williams: they're nothing to think about until they illustrate that they can play on SUNDAYS. Good size/speed, but there's usually a reason that guys are undrafted/7th rounders.

I don't expect much from Sampson in his second year in part because he didn't have much of a first year without an offseason and truncated training camp.

 

[Stout]

Honestly, if that's what happened, I can't fault them for it. You have to place a value on your players, and Richard Marshall just isn't that valuable a piece. He wasn't a good starting cornerback at the beginning of the season, and he wasn't a great nickel cornerback at the end. He's an adequate #2 cornerback and a slightly above-average nickel corner. I don't think you can pay $5 million a year for that.

Marshall was a one-year rental. I think that part of the problem is that Horton loves to talk up his players to the press. Marshall probably appreciates it because it builds his stock up for free agency. But he wasn't interested really in staying a Cardinal. He was a mercenary.

It's just business.

 

[Pariah]

I don't get the hate for Toler.

I don't know how many people are "hating" on Toler. That's a far cry from saying you don't feel comfortable with him starting opposite PP.

I like Toler... a lot. But I think we need another vet back there, too.

 

[PJ1]

He proves to work and work well in Hortons D and he calls him his "MVP". They were willing to give him 3.5 mill last year. But after he proved himself they weren't willing to pay him 5.33 mill a year to match Miami's offer.

I don't get it.

I don't either. Our secondary depth had been an issue for a while. Looked like we had it resolved and now this.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

I wouldn't pay him Marshall that much either. I don't think Jefferson was nearly as bad or Marshall nearly as good as they are made out to be around here. I liked Marshall, and he played well down the stretch, but he not a guy that's irreplaceable. Plus, I think Jefferson will be better this year and will do better in the nickel role.

Liked Marshall too, But, he made his mark when Rhodes was out of the lineup and he played a bit od a rover position. On the edge, he was nothing special, although he tackled well. Can't get him getting burned against Pittsburgh out of my head.

Jefferson was a virtual rookie last year; got schooled, but one can see the natural ability. And, we sometimes forget that there is a former Pitt youngster and Horton protegé that will also be available: Crezdon Butler.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crezdon_Butler

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1145226

 

[kerouac9]

you can maybe argue Julio Jones, Jordy Nelson, Dez Bryant and Desean? In what world do those guys not get automatic consideration?

Because Dez Bryant and Julio Jones are both young players who may be more bridges to the future than #2s (especially considering what Atlanta gave up for Jones). Jordy Nelson might be a #1 at this point, and I don't think that Greg Jennings is in the long-term plans of the Green Bay Packers (they're going to choose between him and Jermichael Finley in a year or two). But I gave them to you, so I don't know what you're quibbling about.

And what about NE having Gronkowski as the best TE in the game and probably the second best TE in the game with Hernandez which rounds out their recieving core? And what about Jimmy Graham for the Saints?

Because those guys are tight ends, and not wide receivers. I've said multiple times that I think that the Cards intend for Rob Housler to develop into the seam-stretching, zone-busting 2nd option for whomever is the quarterback, but you've insisted that the Cards need an established #2 wide receiver every time I've suggested that was the plan.

So is it okay for a good passing attack to not have an established veteran #2 WR, or not?

And where in the world is Victor Cruz as far as the Giants are concerned?

Second-year former undrafted free agent? One year wonder? Let's see if he's able to do it again before we decide that he's an established veteran #2 option for the Giants. The Other Steve Smith looked pretty good a couple of years ago, too. Now, according to you, he's not garbage.

This year's Victor Cruz could easily be next year's The Other Steve Smith.

Right there, that's 7 out of the 10 teams you listed who had MULTIPLE true difference makers in the receiving core.

Only if you count Tight ends as wide receivers. I'm not arguing that you need multiple playmakers catching passes. I'm arguing that you need multiple wide receivers that are established playmakers to succeed as a passing attack. Apparently you agree with me.

You want to limit this just to a discussion of number 2 WRs

Because we're talking about #2 wide receivers, right?

(and yet exclude obvious number 2 WRs as maybes for some reason) but it's really about having a legit second option in your receiving core and 7 of those ten you listed above have those.

We have ONE true difference maker in our receiving core and a bunch of guys.

We're developing Rob Housler and Andre Roberts. Jimmy Graham was nothing his rookie season. Rob Gronkowski was just another guy, as was Aaron Hernandez.

I agree with you that we need more playmaking in our receiving corps; I just don't agree that of necessity that we need to turn to free agency to get that.

 

[crisper57]

I don't know how many people are "hating" on Toler. That's a far cry from saying you don't feel comfortable with him starting opposite PP.

I like Toler... a lot. But I think we need another vet back there, too.

My trepidation with Toler is his health. I really liked his growth when he was on the field and felt good with him as a starter long term based on his ceiling.

 

[Cheesebeef]

He proves to work and work well in Hortons D and he calls him his "MVP". They were willing to give him 3.5 mill last year. But after he proved himself they weren't willing to pay him 5.33 mill a year to match Miami's offer.

I don't get it.

agreed.

 

[crisper57]

agreed.

First victim of Manning.

I think the call went like this:

Marshall: Hello, Cards? Yeah, they want to give me 3 years, $16 million.

Graves: We really like you, but we are tied up until Manning makes his choice. But if he doesn't sign with us, we could swing that.

Marshall: Well if I leave the facility, the deal is off the table.

Graves: Can't you stall?

Marshall: Until Friday? No...

Graves: Okay. Take the sure thing. Good luck to you.

 

[Shane]

He proves to work and work well in Hortons D and he calls him his "MVP". They were willing to give him 3.5 mill last year. But after he proved himself they weren't willing to pay him 5.33 mill a year to match Miami's offer.

I don't get it.

agreed.

How too you know they weren't willing to match? How do we know Marshall didn't just say screw it South Beach is my kinda town and where I wanna be?

Sorry if this has been answered. But I haven't read the whole thread? Did the Cards comment and say it was to rich?

 

[crisper57]

How too you know they weren't willing to match? How do we know Marshall didn't just say screw it South Beach is my kinda town and where I wanna be?

Sorry if this has been answered. But I haven't read the whole thread? Did the Cards comment and say it was to rich?

Marshall tweeted that he personally called the Cards and they refused to match.

 

[Shane]

Marshall tweeted that he personally called the Cards and they refused to match.

Ok Gotcha thanks.

 

[MadCardDisease]

The Cards still need 2 OTs. They couldn't afford Marshall at that price because of the holes on the OL.

 

[Dayman]

I have mixed feelings about this one. I wanted to keep Marshall around. Not only was a key piece to the defense, he was a large part of the return game.

However, the contract seems a little high. Dwight Lowery, who plays the CB/S role in Jacksonville, signed for 4 yrs/$13.6 million with a $3 million signing bonus. Marshall is making #2 CB money. He might not seem worth it in two years.

 

[Shane]

I have mixed feelings about this one. I wanted to keep Marshall around. Not only was a key piece to the defense, he was a large part of the return game.

However, the contract seems a little high. Dwight Lowery, who plays the CB/S role in Jacksonville, signed for 4 yrs/$13.6 million with a $3 million signing bonus. Marshall is making #2 CB money. He might not seem worth it in two years.

In two years the cap is going to dramatically increase. If anything it should seem like more of a bargian.

 

[az1965]

Toughest departure: Richard Marshall from Arizona to Miami. Free agency tends to be overrated. The Cardinals started 1-6 last season after basking in almost universal acclaim for the aggressiveness they showed in free agency and in acquiring a quarterback. Of all the deals Arizona made last year, the one for Marshall represented the greatest value. The money Marshall got from the Dolphins did not appear prohibitive. Cardinals coaches had held up Marshall as a leader and key contributor. Seems like the team would have been better off keeping him around.

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest

Obviously, I agree with Sando...

 

[Shane]

Obviously, I agree with Sando...

I think we all do.

 

[az1965]

I think we all do.

Not if you read the rest of the thread.

 

[Phrazbit]

The Cardinals started 1-6 last season after basking in almost universal acclaim for the aggressiveness they showed in free agency and in acquiring a quarterback.

http://espn.go.com/blog/nfcwest

Its sad that our team is thought so little of around the league that we get praised for our "aggressiveness" in searching for a (crappy) QB. Makes us seem like a kid in the special Olympics. Yes he ran backwards for a bit, yes he fell down frequently, but he sure did try hard.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think we all do.

not those pimping a guy who comes off ACL surgery... and certainly not those bringing up Credoz (or whatever the hell his name is) Butler.

seriously... this kind of move makes no sense to me. It's a passing league, right now we have NO ONE proven at CB except PP and the deal isn't breaking the bank for a guy who our coaches called the defensive MVP AND is young. You find a guy who fits your squad, is young and didn't break the bank and you don't want him back? head scratcher.

 

[Shane]

not those pimping a guy who comes off ACL surgery... and certainly not those bringing up Credoz (or whatever the hell his name is) Butler.

seriously... this kind of move makes no sense to me. It's a passing league, right now we have NO ONE proven at CB except PP and the deal isn't breaking the bank for a guy who our coaches called the defensive MVP AND is young. You find a guy who fits your squad, is young and didn't break the bank and you don't want him back? head scratcher.

Oh I agree. 100%

I think a majority of us wanted him back. I just think many are rationalizing it going that we didn't match in order to land Peyton. I will admit f Peyton picks here and it took that little bit of money savings on Marshall to make it happen then I am totally OK with it.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Oh I agree. 100%

I think a majority of us wanted him back. I just think many are rationalizing it going that we didn't match in order to land Peyton. I will admit f Peyton picks here and it took that little bit of money savings on Marshall to make it happen then I am totally OK with it.

i would be too, but there's a lot of dead weight on this roster that could have been jettisonned in my opinion to not have us stuck at the salary cap like we are... just another reason why having franchise tag CC and not being proactive there sucked.. and why not getting any of our guys signed to extensions when we had 7 million bucks of cap space during the season made no sense to me.

 

[Shane]

i would be too, but there's a lot of dead weight on this roster that could have been jettisonned in my opinion to not have us stuck at the salary cap like we are... just another reason why having franchise tag CC and not being proactive there sucked.. and why not getting any of our guys signed to extensions when we had 7 million bucks of cap space during the season made no sense to me.

I agree. but Most if not all of that dead weight is going to have to be jettisoned to accommodate Peyton BIG IF it happens.