Not enamored.

[Rats]

If they release Matt prior to even taking a snap in the regular season after all these years invested in him, then Whiz and RG would be the biggest f-ing idiots to ever come down the pipe! How the hell would you justify releasing a guy BEFORE the start of a season with no proven other option on the roster?

Completely agree. If this is the aim then this HeadCoach just decided he had had enough of Matt and the season be damned. It would also be a signal that the HeadCoach cannot be trusted. He has praised Matt all offseason and then throws him under the bus. What message does this send to the veterans on the roster. This makes little sense unless he has a great option to turn to. DA has not shown he is that guy.

 

[Shane]

What message does this send to the veterans on the roster.

That is soooo overrated!

 

[earthsci]

What message does this send to the veterans on the roster.

That he will back you but won't be afraid to do what might need to be done.

 

[Rats]

No, I do not think it is that overrated. You go to battle with your leader and if he shows you that he has an agenda that puts your efforts behind the eight ball from the get go...you have to question that. That is what Whis has done here. He stated many times that he loved the effort Matt has given this offseason and then throws him under the bus before the first snap of the regular season. Was he lying to everyone all offseason? Sorry if this is what is transpiring I would not want to be the next guy Whis praises.

 

[Shane]

No, I do not think it is that overrated. You go to battle with your leader and if he shows you that he has an agenda that puts your efforts behind the eight ball from the get go...you have to question that. That is what Whis has done here. He stated many times that he loved the effort Matt has given this offseason and then throws him under the bus before the first snap of the regular season. Was he lying to everyone all offseason? Sorry if this is what is transpiring I would not want to be the next guy Whis praises.

He has not thrown Matt under anything. Matt has failed to perform up to his standards. Period. If Matt isn't starting week 1 he has only 1 person to blame. Himself. The other players are in the film sessions and see every snap. They know why whiz does what he does!

 

[Rats]

He has not thrown Matt u deer anything. Matt has failed to perform up to his standards. Period. If Matt isn't starting week 1 he has only 1 person to blame. Himself. The other players are in the film sessions and see every snap. They know why whiz does what he does!

Really? 13 passes in limited playing time is a small sample to judge by in game situation. Practice is Practice and I enjoyed your off the cuff reports from camp but again that was Practice. I think there is something there besides the performence. Maybe a distrust, maybe a power play now that Warner is gone. Whis wants to be the guy. Sorry I am having a hard time trusting this. Bet several vets will as well with Whis's history with Edge and yo yoing Q. I wouldn't take a bullet for the guy. Ok....maybe that saying is overrated....ha.

 

[Buckybird]

He has not thrown Matt u deer anything. Matt has failed to perform up to his standards.

And DA has? Wiz clearly given favorable reports on Leinarts work all offseason up until the last 2 weeks & then he hasn't said anything negative about him personally then. The HC needs to give him gametime or just let him go. There obvilously is no trust with Wiz on Matt abilities & if I were ML I wouldn't trust Wiz.

 

[Buckybird]

If Matt isn't starting week 1 he has only 1 person to blame. Himself.

This is complete BS Shane & you know it. Let the guy play games not series!!! Leinart hasn't been given a fair shot almost from the start.

 

[Shane]

And DA has? Wiz clearly given favorable reports on Leinarts work all offseason up until the last 2 weeks & then he hasn't said anything negative about him personally then. The HC needs to give him gametime or just let him go. There obvilously is no trust with Wiz on Matt abilities & if I were ML I wouldn't trust Wiz.

As has been said about 100 times. None of you guys are in the film room following the games. You don't know if Matt was flat out making the wrong reads. Wrong checkdowns, Not audibling when he should etc... Etc....

Whiz if you remember was very clear before game 1 against the Texans. He stated he would be looking at how Matt commands and runs the offense. Would be watching for his leadership and how he manages the huddle etc. All of which he said was what he was focusing on rather than performance.

Well after the game whiz was pretty pissed. He stated the first team O was lining up in wrong spots etc.... Well that is on the QB to call them out and correct it or make sure they are at least lining up correctly. Especially from a #1 qb who has been in the system for almost 4 years and should know exactly where everyone is supposed to be. Rather than just running a play with people in the wrong place. IE leadership. It's not just 13 pass attempts. OBVIOUSLY!

 

[Shane]

This is complete BS Shane & you know it. Let the guy play games not series!!! Leinart hasn't been given a fair almost from the start.

No I don't know that and guess what? Neither do you.

 

[Buckybird]

As has been said about 100 times. None of you guys are in the film room following the games. You don't know if Matt was flat out making the wrong reads. Wrong checkdowns, Not audibling when he should etc... Etc....

Whiz if you remember was very clear before game 1 against the texans. He stated he
would be looking at how Matt commands and runs the offense. Would be watching for his leadership and how he manages the huddle etc. All of which he said was what he was focusing on rather than performance.

Well after the game whiz was pretty pissed. He stated the first team O was lining up in wrong spots etc.... Well that is on the QB to call them out and correct it or make sure they are at least lining up correctly. Especially from a #1 qb who has been in the system for almost 4 years and should know exactly where everyone is supposed to be. Rather than just running a play with people in the wrong place. IE leadership. It's not just 13 pass attempts. OBVIOUSLY!

While you might be partly right about what we as fans don't see behind closed doors I don't see others getting their jobs taken away or play limited because they continue to blow execution during the games: Levi or Faneca's terrible non blocking. Differant rules for differant players!!! Listening to Leinarts interviews today its sounds as if the HC hasn't even given reasons to him personally explaining the things that have him #2 this week.

 

[Rats]

Come on, the 1st team has played two poor Quarters of football during the meaningless preseason. This does not reflect on the leadership of the Qb. Most of the guys heads are straight up there keester until it counts. Leinart to be fair has never been cozy with the relationship he and Whis has so being in the system for 4 years and told you are a screwup hardly gives you confidence in your headcoach. More like gives you more reason to distrust the guy. So the leadership thing is more a lack of it on Whis's part. He has done this with several vets so he has a history. Matt has said he just wants to playball and let the chips fall. Whis is determined to not let it happen in Matts favor lest he lose more cred IMO. I will come out and say I distrust this headcoach and believe Warner made us a viable team. We need to see if Leinart learned enough to keep us viable. We won't be with DA and Whis calling plays.

 

[Shane]

While you might be partly right about what we as fans don't see behind closed doors I don't see others getting their jobs taken away or play limited because they continue to blow execution during the games: Levi or Faneca's terrible non blocking. Differant rules for differant players!!! Listening to Leinarts interviews today its sounds as if the HC hasn't even given reasons to him personally explaining the things that have him #2 this week.

What you are completely ignoring is the fact that this supposed leader/#1 qb who has been in the system for 4 years mind you. Was allowing players to line up in the wrong position and running plays that way. Any was you slice it that is pretty damn bad. It doesn't show a command of the offense and it doesn't show leadership. In fact IMO it is unacceptable. Whiz wasn't pissed because it's fun for him I'm betting.

 

[Shane]

Come on, the 1st team has played two poor Quarters of football during the meaningless preseason. This does not reflect on the leadership of the Qb. Most of the guys heads are straight up there keester until it counts. Leinart to be fair has never been cozy with the relationship he and Whis has so being in the system for 4 years and told you are a screwup hardly gives you confidence in your headcoach. More like gives you more reason to distrust the guy. So the leadership thing is more a lack of it on Whis's part. He has done this with several vets so he has a history. Matt has said he just wants to playball and let the chips fall. Whis is determined to not let it happen in Matts favor lest he lose more cred IMO. I will come out and say I distrust this headcoach and believe Warner made us a viable team. We need to see if Leinart learned enough to keep us viable. We won't be with DA and Whis calling plays.

Sorry but this is asinine! Why would you not trust you coach because he tells you that your a screw up? Especially if it's true? That makes zero sense whatsoever!

 

[Buckybird]

Sorry but this is asinine! Why would you not trust you coach because he tells you that your a screw up? Especially if it's true? That makes zero sense whatsoever!

Apparently by listening to Leinarts interviews today he doesn't tell him he's a screw up. Sounds like the HC & QB don't have a good relationship to talk about things as Wiz & KW did for whatever reason.

 

[MrYeahBut]

Clif, I'll say one thing for you...you've got stones as big as Whiz for starting this thread.

Many long time fans take umbrage with this because they have suffered so long and I can't blame them. The Cards finally are winning despite the issues you have raised.

I will say I'm not so sure about Grimm. I don't trust Davis at all and I hope Whiz doesn't turn into Shanahan w/o Elway as there is now no Warner.

 

[Longcolts]

What you are completely ignoring is the fact that this supposed leader/#1 qb who has been in the system for 4 years mind you. Was allowing players to line up in the wrong position and running plays that way. Any was you slice it that is pretty damn bad. It doesn't show a command of the offense and it doesn't show leadership. In fact IMO it is unacceptable. Whiz wasn't pissed because it's fun for him I'm betting.

When does it come down on the coaches not having the people they are in charge of not trained well enough to know where they're supposed to be? Is it the QB's job to make sure they know where they're supposed to be in the game at all times? Also how is the QB supposed to tell them what route they should be running? Should he have a training session before every snap?

 

[jefftheshark]

If I'm stealing somebody else's point, sorry, but I didn't see this thought posted so there's my disclaimer if I stepped on your toes.

How in the hell is this situation not Graves' fault? Whiz has been here for 4 GD years and has displayed his disdain for Leinart (rightfully, or not) on too many occasions to count, and yet we do absolutely nothing during the offseason to bring in a replacement? (Other than DA, which from what I saw last Monday is as big a car wreck as Leinart, except his car wreck is at least involving cheaper vehicles, so call it a bike wreck)

Don't these two (KW & RG) knuckleheads talk to each other?

If management knew KW was going to run Leinart off (and let's be honest, the handwriting's been on Graves' wall for 3 years, or it would have been if he'd only opened the countless emails I'm sure various members of this board have sent him over the years) then at least trade him for a journeyman MLB and bag of chips, or WTF, the chips alone. But get something, anything, other than "that old Cardinal deer in the headlights look" we all used to love so much.

My bias was always ML over Warner, but even so I eventually saw the light that '08 & '09 vintage Kurt was the better player. We had over 3 years to do something about this situation and we (Graves) sat there with his thumb stuck in a very stinky place and did nothing. As usual. Did he really think that Warner was going to play until he was ole enough to collect social security?

Great.

So here we are, Game 3 of preseason, you know the one Denny Green ranted about by saying, and I quote "who the hell takes a third game of the preseason like it's ********, ********!?" Well the answer to Denny's question is now revealed - It's Rod Graves! It's Ken W! It's the Cards!

But as long as we're channeling Denny Green, I guess the answer is to go all the way! Like in Tropic Thunder, let's go full (insert the politically incorrect term for "special") Let's make wholesale changes in the o-line, let's jerk the starting QB around and what the hell, let's mess with the cheerleaders too! It worked so well for Denny, shuffling men in and out like a Jenna Jamison *********, it's gotta work as well for us, too!

Especially since we have a proven Super Bowl MVP as a backup for Matt, let's make the change. In the immortal words of Bluto Blutarsky, "LET'S DO IT!!!!!"

Oh, what? Really? Anderson? Is it at least Kenny Anderson? No?

Never mind.

JTS

 

[WisconsinCard]

Its also been reported that many of the staff wanted the team to go after Mark Bulger. If this is true and that "staff" is our coaching staff, then it wouldn't be a ringing endorsement for either of our QB's. It is also proff that the coaches don't always get what they want and have to play the cards they are dealt. And I think Whiz has gotten the most out of what he has had to work with. Better the nay coach we've had in AZ.

Some people just can't stand success.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Sorry but this is asinine! Why would you not trust you coach because he tells you that your a screw up? Especially if it's true? That makes zero sense whatsoever!

Shane, I commend you for trying to attack this ridiculousness, but you're efforts are futile. The irrational man love for Leinart is out of control. You'd think they were benching Peyton Manning.

 

[Solar7]

Shane, I commend you for trying to attack this ridiculousness, but you're efforts are futile. The irrational man love for Leinart is out of control. You'd think they were benching Peyton Manning.

They're not benching Peyton Manning, but it's like anointing Jeff George the starter. Anderson has never done anything to show anyone in the NFL that he's anything more than an inaccurate quarterback with below average decision making and accuracy.

Leinart's at least got some potential, and his struggles were more a consequence of the offensive line's horrific play than his ability to get the ball there. If the team was starting Marc Bulger this week instead of Anderson, I don't imagine that there'd be this kind of backlash. But Anderson has looked atrocious, by all accounts.

 

[slinslin]

Leinart has a weak arm, no athleticism, no mobility and no vision.

Those are a few flaws too many for a starting QB in the NFL in my opinion. Especially when he has no strength to make up for his weaknesses like Peyton Manning who isn't mobile and athletic but has simply perfect vision and accuracy.

I can't believe some people still trusted in Leinart after all these seasons.

 

[Shane]

They're not benching Peyton Manning, but it's like anointing Jeff George the starter. Anderson has never done anything to show anyone in the NFL that he's anything more than an inaccurate quarterback with below average decision making and accuracy.

Leinart's at least got some potential, and his struggles were more a consequence of the offensive line's horrific play than his ability to get the ball there. If the team was starting Marc Bulger this week instead of Anderson, I don't imagine that there'd be this kind of backlash. But Anderson has looked atrocious, by all accounts.

How has DA been annointed? Hes being given a chance to earn it. Nothing more or less.

 

[Buckybird]

a Jenna Jamison *********

Good stuff Jeff


BTW I'm not sure Jenna has ever been gang banged, but if you have seen it please tell me where I can watch that

 

[Shane]

When does it come down on the coaches not having the people they are in charge of not trained well enough to know where they're supposed to be? Is it the QB's job to make sure they know where they're supposed to be in the game at all times? Also how is the QB supposed to tell them what route they should be running? Should he have a training session before every snap?

When you are out on the field lining up for the play it falls 100% on the QB. He is the coach on the field. He is the guy that is supposed to know the playbook and formations frontwards and backwards. Especially when you have been in the system for 4 seasons. If someone is in the wrong position he should recognize it and address it. Either by yelling to the player to move like we have seen Warner do a thousand times. Or by calling a time out and getting it fixed.

Instead Matt would run the play. It is on each individual player to know their plays and line up properly I agree. But if they don't the QB has to be there to correct them when in the game and on the field.

That is what leadership is all about. That is the epitome of commanding the offense.