OT: Brian Flores Suing NFL Alleging Racism

[QuebecCard]

I haven't heard it - pure speculation and hope.

I have nothing against VJ but we can't stop the run and we are not using our top 2 picks effectively. That has to change.

Yes...

Answer: Better NT and experience.

 

[Stout]

Cards are keeping their entire coaching staff. They would have already made moves by now. I'm sure they are all in Mobile at the Senior Bowl. Bottom line we are stuck with Keim, KK & VJ for the 2022 season.

I guess the bright side is that no one's been extended.












Yet.

 

[az jam]

I guess the bright side is that no one's been extended.












Yet.

Actually, that is a good point and hopefully they will wait till the FULL 2022 season is over.

 

[juza76]

Actually, that is a good point and hopefully they will wait till the FULL 2022 season is over.

M Bidwill confirming the actual coaching staff is not because he trust them but because he doesn't want to pay another one

 

[tnmike]

If you want to talk about lack of merit look at many of the owners

What did Michael Bidwill do to deserve to be President/Owner? What about Dean Spanos? Mark Davis? The McCaskey’s ? Maras? Rooneys? Haslams? Kroenke? Browns? Yorks?

Yes let's just turn everything over to the government when somebody dies. Just like the cowboy movies where they steal the boots off of the dead guy. This (woke) BS is rapidly getting out of hand.

 

[tnmike]

Yeah its time to make some changes not just on the field and giving the ownership to some black dudes
I hope it happens with the Cardinals

Give?

 

[tnmike]

Well, how about this: Firing VJ has been nothing more than a figment of the imagination of some fans.

lots of imagination on this board

 

[juza76]

Give?

Selling

 

[slanidrac16]

You’re right. Except when 97% of the owners of a monopoly all choose white. Then it becomes a discriminatory issue.

I get it. But if you were an owner would it be fair to you to be made to hire someone you didn’t want to meet a league ratio?
Imagine you were an owner and you just fired your head coach. When looking to replace him you have an opportunity to hire Sean Payton. However to meet the league ratio you’d be forced to hire Byron Leftwich instead of Payton?
I understand the situation. But how can you MAKE an owner hire somebody based on color.
Imagine if we held rosters to that standard. Sorry you have to cut your all pro Black RB because there aren’t enough white RB’s?

 

[tnmike]

In the real world we are all standing in the cheese line waiting our turn. Sometimes the cheese runs out before you get to the front of the line. In reality there is no solution to this situation. Sometimes luck is on your side and sometimes it isn't. Life isn't fair and you can't make it so no matter how hard you try.

 

[slanidrac16]

Except that's not the reality in any company in America. I literally can't promise a job to someone as a senior exec without interviewing every candidate

So you go through the motion of remaining interviews even though in you heart the second candidate you interviewed is the person you want. Basically wasting your time but following protocol.

I remember hearing a little about the Rooney rule was giving minorities an opportunity to experience of the interview process. Nowhere was it a gaurantee to be hired.

Want to level the field? You shouldn’t even be allowed to see the person you are interviewing. The person voice being considered should be altered. Now you remove all bias.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I get it. But if you were an owner would it be fair to you to be made to hire someone you didn’t want to meet a league ratio?
Imagine you were an owner and you just fired your head coach. When looking to replace him you have an opportunity to hire Sean Payton. However to meet the league ratio you’d be forced to hire Byron Leftwich instead of Payton?
I understand the situation. But how can you MAKE an owner hire somebody based on color.
Imagine if we held rosters to that standard. Sorry you have to cut your all pro Black RB because there aren’t enough white RB’s?

The second half of your comment is an immaterial argument because white people aren’t being excluded from playing simply due to the fact they are white.

And I think it’s funny that you’ve shifted to using the word “ratio” (away from the word “quota” others have used). They mean the same thing and the only people using them are the posters that arguing in favor of the current system which has us arrived at the current 1/32 situation. No one fighting for equality has used the word “quota” or now “ratio.”

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

In the real world we are all standing in the cheese line waiting our turn. Sometimes the cheese runs out before you get to the front of the line. In reality there is no solution to this situation. Sometimes luck is on your side and sometimes it isn't. Life isn't fair and you can't make it so no matter how hard you try.

And if black people are told to get in the back of the line sucks for them? They didn’t get there due to bad luck.

And we wonder how racism persists today . . . no we don’t.

 

[slanidrac16]

That’s not the right way to view it. That’s like saying a company isn’t racist because it’s 70% black even though there’s not a single black person at a managerial level or higher.

So it’s fair that a sport that has a a minority that represents 13% of society holds 70% of the jobs?
And yes your scenario would be absurd and deemed racist.
Let me be clear my views on this is more to point out there really is no “ fair” way to deal with this. But when the argument of ratios and quotas come up Its just as unfair to handpick the category.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

So you go through the motion of remaining interviews even though in you heart the second candidate you interviewed is the person you want. Basically wasting your time but following protocol.

I remember hearing a little about the Rooney rule was giving minorities an opportunity to experience of the interview process. Nowhere was it a gaurantee to be hired.

Want to level the field? You shouldn’t even be allowed to see the person you are interviewing. The person voice being considered should be altered. Now you remove all bias.

That would be incredibly poor management style. If you select to interview x number of people, they are all "Good candidates". That is what prescreening is for.

To find the best person for the job, I have to interview each person and weigh their strengths and weaknesses at the end of the interview process.

 

[tnmike]

And if black people are told to get in the back of the line sucks for them? They didn’t get there due to bad luck.

And we wonder how racism persists today . . . no we don’t.

Flores wasn't at the back of the line when he was hired in Miami so I guess the white guys can sue too

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Want to level the field? You shouldn’t even be allowed to see the person you are interviewing. The person voice being considered should be altered. Now you remove all bias.

Also this is literally the prescreening process step 1. Phone interview with someone other than myself with my questions. Then I get the answers and select the good candidates based on answers and qualifications.

The in person interview is to determine how they would fit with you as a manager and your team.

 

[slanidrac16]

First literally NONE of us are qualified to say whether Daboll is a more qualified hire. None of us were privy to their respective pitches. We don’t know what their proposed plans were, who they listed as potential staff, etc.

Second the issue isn’t that the NFL isn’t hiring less talented black coaches, unless it’s your contention that black coaches are just by definition less talented. I don’t think that’s what you believe. The issue is with 1/32 being black they’re obviously not hiring the talented ones, period. That’s a problem, no?

We see the problem but how do you solve it?
How do you define a more talented and candidate? Every head coach ever hired has been deemed by somebody as the best and most talented candidate. That being said 99% of them are eventually fired.
Even blind interviews wouldn’t work because their resume’ would probably expose their color.

 

[slanidrac16]

That would be incredibly poor management style. If you select to interview x number of people, they are all "Good candidates". That is what prescreening is for.

To find the best person for the job, I have to interview each person and weigh their strengths and weaknesses at the end of the interview process.

Of course you would and should. But being human somewhere along the interview process there is a good chance that someone would wow you.

As far poor management style look around the league. There are plenty.

 

[Harry]

In the real world we are all standing in the cheese line waiting our turn. Sometimes the cheese runs out before you get to the front of the line. In reality there is no solution to this situation. Sometimes luck is on your side and sometimes it isn't. Life isn't fair and you can't make it so no matter how hard you try.

Funny how the front of the line is all white

 

[TRW]

I get it. But if you were an owner would it be fair to you to be made to hire someone you didn’t want to meet a league ratio?
Imagine you were an owner and you just fired your head coach. When looking to replace him you have an opportunity to hire Sean Payton. However to meet the league ratio you’d be forced to hire Byron Leftwich instead of Payton?
I understand the situation. But how can you MAKE an owner hire somebody based on color.
Imagine if we held rosters to that standard. Sorry you have to cut your all pro Black RB because there aren’t enough white RB’s?

Imagine you are Michael Bidwill and you have just fired Steve Wilks and have an opportunity to hire Byron Leftwich, Eric Bienemy(sp), Jim Caldwell, Todd Bowles, etc. and picked someone like…Kliff Kingsbury? And the Cards are one of the better diverse hiring organizations around. There are any number of black coaches who seem to have better resumes than the ones hired. I don’t know if the owners care or will care as long as the $$$$$ keep rolling in. It all rests in the hands of the owners until someone mentions lifting their exemption status or forcibly legislates their compliance with some arbitrary quota (which won’t happen).
When Flores’ suit is thrown out or settled it will be business as usual more than likely.

 

[JeffGollin]

When you look at the whole deal in toto, something's rotten. There's a lot of hiring unfairness, good old boy system among the owners etc.

Yet owners have the obligation to their fans to hire the coaches they feel they can best win with.

And all things in between. (If a black coach were available who had a 100 & 0 winning record, some team would snap him up in a heartbeat. But if his record was 60 & 40...uhh maybe not - the bar would be a bit higher)

Dunno the answer, but the NFL mgt policies carry with them a faint aroma, & the effort needs to be consistently made to right what's wrong.

 

[Harry]

Flores wasn't at the back of the line when he was hired in Miami so I guess the white guys can sue too

He was hired to lose and when he won he was fired. He was hired as the guy most likely to lose. That makes sense to you?

 

[slanidrac16]

This is about the fact that BB accidentally told Flores that Dabol had been hired before he had a chance to interview. THAT is BULL****. if I was a Giants fan, I would be pissed off. What if Flores would have been a great coach? What if Dabol was handed the job prematurely?

No doubt. It’s a major slap in the face. But if Flores was white, would this be a story?

 

[slanidrac16]

He was hired to lose and when he won he was fired. He was hired as the guy most likely to lose. That makes sense to you?

Then it’s not a league problem, it’s an owner problem, no?