OT: Brian Flores Suing NFL Alleging Racism

[tnmike]

You are completely missing the point. All throughout this thread people have been crying about "Best person for the job", "Why wouldn't the owner want to hire someone that earned the position, etc"

Just pointing out the double-standard of defending owners who didn't do anything to earn the position/ownership when blacks were excluded from the opportunities that most of that wealth came from and then demanding that the NFL shouldn't do anything to correct past racial inequalities.

No I'm not missing the point. It's a false equivalent. When an owner of property dies you don't do interviews to see who is qualified to get it. It's an inheritance. Nobody's business but the family's

 

[Shane]

No I'm not missing the point. It's a false equivalent. When an owner of property dies you don't do interviews to see who is qualified to get it. It's an inheritance. Nobody's business but the family's

Yup

 

[Krangodnzr]

I've lived in the south most of my life. For the most part here in Nashville there are mostly black sections and white sections of town. If a unknown black man goes up in the white section somebody MAY call the cops to check him out. If a white man goes up in the black section he probably will get robbed and shot. Happens every day and on the news every night. I live in a suburb of Nashville and the crime is creeping from the downtown Nashville area. A year ago a 12 year old kid robbed a woman in my apartment parking lot. Nashville population a little over 600,000. My hometown 15,000. I visited my home town yesterday and remembered how much better it was with practically no major crime. I could go to sleep at night and never lock the door. I never go out at night here. Road rage shootings here nearly every day, drugs, murder, carjackings. It's a truth of life. I know that has nothing to do with NFL coaches, I get that. My point is that there is racism on the black side too and if you don't see that then something is wrong.

This can all be explained by wealth, or lack of.

Since the end of the Civil Rights era, black Americans are actually LESS likely to own a home and the gap in wealth between white Americans and black Americans has grown significantly.

Poor people commit more crime. It's just a fact of life and has been true about early Irish, early Italians, and other immigrants groups before they assimilated and no longer had a reason to commit crime. Obviously the difference between Irish and blacks is that Irish could hide the fact that they were Irish, which many did early on.

 

[Krangodnzr]

When you inherit it from Daddy, what did you do to earn it?

And even then, his daddy had the money to send him to fancy college preps and Georgetown law...

What makes Michael Bidwill so special that he deserves to own a multi-billion dollar company? Or Mark Davis?

Pure nepotism.

Could a black person bought the Cardinals in 1932 when Charles Bidwill did? NOPE. Limited opportunities

Not a chance really, and even then, whites would have likely driven his business into the ground back then.

 

[Bkbobo]

I get it. But if you were an owner would it be fair to you to be made to hire someone you didn’t want to meet a league ratio?
Imagine you were an owner and you just fired your head coach. When looking to replace him you have an opportunity to hire Sean Payton. However to meet the league ratio you’d be forced to hire Byron Leftwich instead of Payton?
I understand the situation. But how can you MAKE an owner hire somebody based on color.
Imagine if we held rosters to that standard. Sorry you have to cut your all pro Black RB because there aren’t enough white RB’s?

You do understand that the black coaches that would be hired are qualified. No-one is asking these owners to hire someone based of their race. One of the issue is that some of these owners haven't considered minority candidates for so long, it is engrained.

I have seen other posters mentioned several people have gotten their foot into the NFL door because their father, uncle, etc. Is/was a coach.

It's a shame that they finally created a HBUC combine.

Long story long, the NFL needs to do a better job considering coaches of different races and ethnicities.

 

[Ronin]

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[Bkbobo]

Then it’s not a league problem, it’s an owner problem, no?

That may be true, but who is to oversee then owners, the NFL. Hence the NFL needs to do a better job, along with the owners

 

[Snakester]

I’d still be good with hiring for that job or the head coach, where I supported a change. He can’t do that with this suit going on, but he’d be a step up.

Me to. I would love to see him as our DC. I agree he would be a step up from Vance Joseph. Actually several steps up.

 

[tnmike]

And even then, his daddy had the money to send him to fancy college preps and Georgetown law...

Pure nepotism.

Not a chance really, and even then, whites would have likely driven his business into the ground back then.

So what is the test whether a family member has earned it or not? Mowing the yard?

 

[Snakester]

You're right, let's fix it with a diversity quota and see where that number goes.

Right let see. How many Head coaches are Asian, Hispanic or Indian. If blacks are 13% of the population, isn’t it racist that they make up 70% of the NFL and not 13%. Shouldn’t their be equal rights for all races and not favoritism for just the black players! Yes I’m being sarcastic but sometimes the people that have the jobs have put in the time and earned them. You can’t just give a job to someone because of their skin color. To me that is just as racist.

 

[BritCard]

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Flores isn't coming out of this at all well and it's still early

 

[Krangodnzr]

So what is the test whether a family member has earned it or not? Mowing the yard?

I think that's irrelevant. The point being made is that many of these guys didn't achieve the wealth on their own.

Someone like Shad Khan who is different than Michael Bidwill. Khan started out washing dishes when he immigrated here. Far different than Michael Bidwill, the son of probably the worst owner in pro sports after Donald Sterling.

 

[phillycard]

I don't have a definition of what "qualified" is, but I think owners should be able to do whatever they'd like with their own team and have the freedom to hire whoever they'd like. If they want to implement diversity in their coach hiring, so be it. Forcing them to do it is ridiculous. If they push for it, we could talk about increasing player diversity as well since we want to be fair and equal.

I can agree with that completely, but my issue is when you claim to be giving equal thrift to all candidates, yet you hire the scoreboard operator from Pomona College over an African American candidate, who has proven his mettle, played in the league in many cases, and has experience on the NFL level, yet you say your hire is "qualified" to lead your team over the minority candidate. I have a problem with that, and will always.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Flores isn't coming out of this at all well and it's still early

I think there is a little bit of sour grapes mixed in with some real issues.

 

[tnmike]

I can agree with that completely, but my issue is when you claim to be giving equal thrift to all candidates, yet you hire the scoreboard operator from Pomona College over an African American candidate, who has proven his mettle, played in the league in many cases, and has experience on the NFL level, yet you say your hire is "qualified" to lead your team over the minority candidate. I have a problem with that, and will always.

Maybe he should have had Scoreboard operator on his resume

 

[RON_IN_OC]

Flores isn't coming out of this at all well and it's still early

Were you expecting Elway's statement to say, Yup, I was sauced....sorry 'bout that.? LOL They are all going to "Vehemently Deny"...that's nothing new.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I was living near Hampton, VA when Curry and Vick were in High School. Curry was the most dominating high school football player that I have ever seen. Vick was good, but Curry was generational. Me and a buddy had a Public TV sports show covering the Hampton / Newport News High School Sports called ..."THIS IIIIS SPORTS!!!" and we interviewed each of them.. Vick had a chip on his shoulder while Curry was as cordial as he was athletic.

And curry could ball out on the basketball court. I always think of him and iverson as peas in a pod.

 

[Krangodnzr]

And curry could ball out on the basketball court. I always think of him and iverson as peas in a pod.

I remember watching ASU play Chapel Hill at Sun Devil Stadium, and Ronald Curry balled out. Andrew Walter was pretty damn good too, but Dirk Koetter's stupid 40 yard passes on 3rd and 2 screwed the Sun Devils out of the win.

 

[Snakester]

Except that's not the reality in any company in America. I literally can't promise a job to someone as a senior exec without interviewing every candidate

As a business owner I have my managers bring in at least three candidates for every hiring. Sometimes their might be a favorite but we always look for that number two as well. A lot of times there are two that are close and we offer the number two a job as well. If we don’t when a spot opens up that person may be at the top of our list to call.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Flores isn't coming out of this at all well and it's still early

Rarely does the cog look good when he’s fighting the full weight of the rigged machine.

 

[BritCard]

I think there is a little bit of sour grapes mixed in with some real issues.

There are real issues. Just none of them are contained in Flores suit. Feels like pure sour grapes.

 

[BritCard]

Were you expecting Elway's statement to say, Yup, I was sauced....sorry 'bout that.? LOL They are all going to "Vehemently Deny"...that's nothing new.

It was a morning interview...

Either way, its monumentally dumb to include anything in his suit he can't categorically prove.

"John Elway looked a bit rough when he interviewed me two years ago" is ridiculous even on the face of it. Even more so when it's 5 execs vs 1.

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

Here we go again. Let's hire people who may be unqualified for a certain position because their race/ethnicity/diversity fills an arbitrary diversity criteria.

Complete oversimplification and one that assumes it elevates unqualified candidates. Why do you assume they would be unqualified?

 

[tnmike]

Complete oversimplification and one that assumes it elevates unqualified candidates. Why do you assume they would be unqualified?

Let's hire a surgeon that has experience as a butcher at Kroger

 

[LoyaltyisaCurse]

Let's hire a surgeon that has experience as a butcher at Kroger

Complete misdirection... and not a serious answer to a legitmate question.