Some quick notes from Red/White Practice

[Crimson Warrior]

Not a damn one of those guys throw the football as well as Murray.

He has a stronger arm, faster release, and is more accurate.

He works harder.

And none of this even approaches his athletic ability.

At this point, after watching how he's handled training camp, I'm starting to feel a little like the Cardinals won the lottery by getting Murray. Still a long way to go though, I know.

 

[Solar7]

At this point, after watching how he's handled training camp, I'm starting to feel a little like the Cardinals won the lottery by getting Murray. Still a long way to go though, I know.

You thought this before we even picked him.

 

[Krangodnzr]

You thought this before we even picked him.

I was ecstatic to take Murray....and I like him even more now.

 

[Garthshort]

I feel confident about KM, and even okay about our OL, in part because of Kyler's athleticism. Afyer watching Thursday night it was our DL that I was most concerned about. And now with Philion's arrest, my concern just doubled. Only bright sky, for me, was that I thought that Dogbe was one of two defensive "under the radar" guys who played well the other night. Along with Miles Brown.

 

[PACardsFan]

I feel confident about KM, and even okay about our OL, in part because of Kyler's athleticism. Afyer watching Thursday night it was our DL that I was most concerned about. And now with Philion's arrest, my concern just doubled. Only bright sky, for me, was that I thought that Dogbe was one of two defensive "under the radar" guys who played well the other night. Along with Miles Brown.

I agree, but by the time Dogbe got into the game, the Chargers had future dog catchers on their O-Line.

 

[gimpy]

Why even play these preseason games? IF, you see someone that plays good, even though it is against lesser competition, you won't give him extra looks or consideration?

I don't understand people's thinking on here a lot of times.

 

[PACardsFan]

Why even play these preseason games? IF, you see someone that plays good, even though it is against lesser competition, you won't give him extra looks or consideration?

I don't understand people's thinking on here a lot of times.

Lighten up Frances

Don't worry, coaches will give these guys the opportunity they deserve. As fans, we have learned over the decades that when a guy plays well late in PS game 1, it generally means nothing. Get Dogbe in the Oakland game asap & let him show his worth.

 

[MadCardDisease]

Why even play these preseason games? IF, you see someone that plays good, even though it is against lesser competition, you won't give him extra looks or consideration?

I don't understand people's thinking on here a lot of times.

They get most of their looks during practice. If they are playing in the last quarter of a preseason game then they haven’t done enough to move up to the second or third string. We don’t get to see most of the behind the scenes stuff that happens at practice.

 

[JeffGollin]

They get most of their looks during practice. If they are playing in the last quarter of a preseason game then they haven’t done enough to move up to the second or third string. We don’t get to see most of the behind the scenes stuff that happens at practice.

Just to stir the pot a little - are you basing your downplaying of late PS game performance on how the Cards view this or how other teams do? In other words, does Cardinals approach differ from other more successful teams and should we change our approach?

 

[MadCardDisease]

Just to stir the pot a little - are you basing your downplaying of late PS game performance on how the Cards view this or how other teams do? In other words, does Cardinals approach differ from other more successful teams and should we change our approach?

All teams know that guys playing late in preseason games are playing late for a reason. If a player truly deserves a shot at the next level coaches will recognize it 99% of the time and they will get a shot.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

You thought this before we even picked him.

No.

Yes, I was super excited that my college football hero would go on to play for my Cardinals. It was dream come true, but only for ARZ/OU fans (all six of us).

I've always understood that Murray might bust out. In fact, I'm still not sure about how his game will translate to the NFL level. Still not sure about his ability to read NFL defenses, and pro-level decision making.

But the physical ability was apparent Thursday night. HOF-level, as advertised.

And, the very early returns on some of Murray's pro intangibles (e.g. maturity, dedication, self-confidence) are encouraging, and that's important. That's the reason I've gained a little more confidence in K1 the last few weeks.

Because if he's got what it takes from a mental perspective, then yes Solar7, he is the proverbial franchise savior. He is the winning lottery ticket.

 

[PACardsFan]

No.

Yes, I was super excited that my college football hero would go on to play for my Cardinals. It was dream come true, but only for ARZ/OU fans (all six of us).

I've always understood that Murray might bust out. In fact, I'm still not sure about how his game will translate to the NFL level. Still not sure about his ability to read NFL defenses, and pro-level decision making.

But the physical ability was apparent Thursday night. HOF-level, as advertised.

And, the very early returns on some of Murray's pro intangibles (e.g. maturity, dedication, self-confidence) are encouraging, and that's important. That's the reason I've gained a little more confidence in K1 the last few weeks.

Because if he's got what it takes from a mental perspective, then yes Solar7, he is the proverbial franchise savior. He is the winning lottery ticket.

I was raised in upstate NY & now live in central PA. So, I had no heartstrings attached to K1 or OU football. I actually tuned in to OU football to watch Murray because it nauseated me to hear the announcers say he may even be better than Mayfield. See, I love watching Mayfield. So, if anything, I was anti-Murray last year at this time. I’ve watched football for a long time, and Murray changed my opinion of him very quickly. Call me a believer, but I’m not a hometown homer either. And there’s nothing wrong with that. I just made my projections based on my head & not my heart.

 

[Solar7]

No.

Yes, I was super excited that my college football hero would go on to play for my Cardinals. It was dream come true, but only for ARZ/OU fans (all six of us).

I've always understood that Murray might bust out. In fact, I'm still not sure about how his game will translate to the NFL level. Still not sure about his ability to read NFL defenses, and pro-level decision making.

But the physical ability was apparent Thursday night. HOF-level, as advertised.

And, the very early returns on some of Murray's pro intangibles (e.g. maturity, dedication, self-confidence) are encouraging, and that's important. That's the reason I've gained a little more confidence in K1 the last few weeks.

Because if he's got what it takes from a mental perspective, then yes Solar7, he is the proverbial franchise savior. He is the winning lottery ticket.

Oh come on, there hasn't been a single post in your history regarding Kyler Murray that hasn't been oozing over the top positivity. It's not the 7 attempts in a preseason game that suddenly made you go from "well, we'll see..." to "we hit the lottery."

You have felt this way for months. Of anyone on the board, I think you're the most allowed, since it's the QB for both of your favorite teams, but don't be silly now.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Oh come on, there hasn't been a single post in your history regarding Kyler Murray that hasn't been oozing over the top positivity. It's not the 7 attempts in a preseason game that suddenly made you go from "well, we'll see..." to "we hit the lottery."

You have felt this way for months. Of anyone on the board, I think you're the most allowed, since it's the QB for both of your favorite teams, but don't be silly now.

I would argue that while there is limited sample size, the sample size we do have points to greatness.

It's like DJ Humphries said, this kid had been cool since he was 4 years old. His dad said when he was 5 years old he would get him to go outside to throw the football. Few QBs can say they have have an expert QB coach working with them since they were a small child.

The guy has lost THREE football games in his life. Three. At all levels. But as others have pointed out, his extensive baseball background will prepare him for failure, since you fail at baseball more than any other sport.

I'm not going to make a big deal about his preseason performance because he met my minimum expectations. He can play a lot better than he did. When he avoided that sack, few players can do what he did, the way he moved. Hes special.

IMO all this talk about faster defenders points to one thing: teams are going to need faster, more mobile QBs to deal with them. Watson, Mahomes, Wilson, Newton, Jackson...this is the way of the future. It's not running QBs...its mobile QBs...the ones who run too much are going to hurt their team in the long run.

 

[Solar7]

I would argue that while there is limited sample size, the sample size we do have points to greatness.

It's like DJ Humphries said, this kid had been cool since he was 4 years old. His dad said when he was 5 years old he would get him to go outside to throw the football. Few QBs can say they have have an expert QB coach working with them since they were a small child.

The guy has lost THREE football games in his life. Three. At all levels. But as others have pointed out, his extensive baseball background will prepare him for failure, since you fail at baseball more than any other sport.

I'm not going to make a big deal about his preseason performance because he met my minimum expectations. He can play a lot better than he did. When he avoided that sack, few players can do what he did, the way he moved. Hes special.

IMO all this talk about faster defenders points to one thing: teams are going to need faster, more mobile QBs to deal with them. Watson, Mahomes, Wilson, Newton, Jackson...this is the way of the future. It's not running QBs...its mobile QBs...the ones who run too much are going to hurt their team in the long run.

You and I have been over this again, and again, and again... I'm just trying to point out that @Crimson Warrior hasn't suddenly just developed the idea we hit the lotto.

You can claim he's only lost three games, but he didn't get a chance to play in many games in college. If he starts the whole season for A&M, are we saying this? If he doesn't get one of the most talented teams in the nation with the best coaching, are we saying this?

Kyler deserves credit for what he's done to date, but "cool" does nothing for me when he's been winning the whole time. How cool will he be when we're a five win team? When he's taking sacks every 3rd play?

 

[Krangodnzr]

You and I have been over this again, and again, and again... I'm just trying to point out that @Crimson Warrior hasn't suddenly just developed the idea we hit the lotto.

You can claim he's only lost three games, but he didn't get a chance to play in many games in college. If he starts the whole season for A&M, are we saying this? If he doesn't get one of the most talented teams in the nation with the best coaching, are we saying this?

Kyler deserves credit for what he's done to date, but "cool" does nothing for me when he's been winning the whole time. How cool will he be when we're a five win team? When he's taking sacks every 3rd play?

Rosen didnt get sacked every 3rd play. You're being ridiculous to even make this statement.

Who knows what would've happened at A&M, that's irrelevant. OU was talented but they didnt look that talented against their top competition (Texas and Alabama). Murray carried them in all three games.

 

[gimpy]

Apparently (I don't know), K 1 has excelled at every level of ball (especially football) (and baseball) that he's played since being a child. But yet, you don't give him his due. There's always a reason why, and it's not because of his ability. You seem to always throw in a but somewhere. But he played in a weak conference. But he only played one season. But, but, but...

Maybe we should have drafted that Jones guy that the Giants got with their first round pick. Maybe you would be happy then? .

I was one who wanted to stick with Rosen and draft Bosa. So, how would I look now with Bosa hurt ?

 

[Solar7]

Rosen didnt get sacked every 3rd play. You're being ridiculous to even make this statement.

Who knows what would've happened at A&M, that's irrelevant. OU was talented but they didnt look that talented against their top competition (Texas and Alabama). Murray carried them in all three games.

What does this have to do with Rosen? Kyler had to escape pressure and literally lay down for a sack... pretty much every third snap.

What would have happened at A&M is not irrelevant. It was so relevant that he left to another school. So relevant that he only played one year of significant football over four years. He can't run to a program with better talent now. He is here. This is where he makes his stand. It's relevant. Stop hand-waving. You do it in almost every thread.

 

[SECTION 11]

Aaaaaaand back to ignore.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Oh come on, there hasn't been a single post in your history regarding Kyler Murray that hasn't been oozing over the top positivity. It's not the 7 attempts in a preseason game that suddenly made you go from "well, we'll see..." to "we hit the lottery."

You have felt this way for months. Of anyone on the board, I think you're the most allowed, since it's the QB for both of your favorite teams, but don't be silly now.

Wow.. you're misquoting me horribly. lol.. My exact words were "starting to feel a little like the Cardinals won the lottery".

Look I don't want to belabor this point, because it's not worth the bandwidth, but for the record, that's the first time I've mentioned the lottery.

To be fair to you, yes, I've always hyped Murray the prospect. A lot. And like I said, when we drafted him, I personally got super lucky.

But it's also true that when I've talked about what Murray means to the Cardinals, I've hedged my bets a little. Not much, but a little. Always admitted that there was a chance he could bust. At least I tired Solar7.

And so when I said "starting to feel a little like..." I was again trying to choose my words carefully.

Because we've only seen a tiny glimpse of Murray as a pro. But since April 25, he's lived up to the high expectations that have been set for him. Maybe even exceeded them in some areas.

 

[Krangodnzr]

What does this have to do with Rosen? Kyler had to escape pressure and literally lay down for a sack... pretty much every third snap.

What would have happened at A&M is not irrelevant. It was so relevant that he left to another school. So relevant that he only played one year of significant football over four years. He can't run to a program with better talent now. He is here. This is where he makes his stand. It's relevant. Stop hand-waving. You do it in almost every thread.

You are being ridiculous. We've gone over what happened at A&M a dozen times. Every meaningful QB on the depth chart TRANSFERRED because of how they were treated by Sumlin. Mayfield left TTU because he got beaten by what's his face. You must not follow college football at all if you think this is a concern.

Run to a program with better talent? You make the most ridiculous arguments sometimes that I can explain away in a few seconds. Texas A&M always has has LOTS of talent. When he was there they had two 5 star QBs. Miles Garrett. Christian Kirk. Ricky Seals Jones. TONS OF TALENT.

You honestly think what you saw from the offensive line is how it's going to be in the regular season?? Ridiculous.

 

[Solar7]

Aaaaaaand back to ignore.

I hope it's not me. I'm not sure how that works here, if I can still see someone ignoring me.

I'm exhausted with the arguments too, but I can't seem to give Kyler a little praise without either being fully on his side as the best QB we've ever had, or his greatest detractor. I'm just unable to sit here and clap clap clap and sip the koolaid when our leadership is making bad moves at every corner.

Apparently (I don't know), K 1 has excelled at every level of ball (especially football) (and baseball) that he's played since being a child. But yet, you don't give him his due. There's always a reason why, and it's not because of his ability. You seem to always throw in a but somewhere. But he played in a weak conference. But he only played one season. But, but, but...

Maybe we should have drafted that Jones guy that the Giants got with their first round pick. Maybe you would be happy then? .

I was one who wanted to stick with Rosen and draft Bosa. So, how would I look now with Bosa hurt ?

I'm not sure if I was supposed to be quoted here, but I'm assuming it was directed at me. There is no doubting that Kyler is a talented athlete, and he's done some great things. I don't think he's a poor character kid, either. He deserves major props for what he did, but the NFL has picked up and churned out plenty of talented athletes over time. It's a different world.

We didn't need to draft a new QB. The guy who we drafted in the top ten probably deserved another shot. So comparing it to drafting Daniel Jones? Of course that would be dumb.

How would you look right now with Bosa? Probably just fine. The season hasn't started yet. Bosa could be a Hall of Fame player. The Quinnen Williams supporters would look pretty prescient with Darius Philon on the street.

 

[Solar7]

Wow.. you're misquoting me horribly. lol.. My exact words were "starting to feel a little like the Cardinals won the lottery".

Look I don't want to belabor this point, because it's not worth the bandwidth, but for the record, that's first time I've mentioned the lottery.

To be fair to you, yes, I've always hyped Murray the prospect. A lot. And like I said, when we drafted him, I personally got super lucky.

But it's also true that when I've talked about what Murray means to the Cardinals, I've hedged my bets a little. Not much, but a little. Always admitted that there was a chance he could bust. At least I tired Solar7.

And so when I said "starting to feel a little like..." I was again trying to choose my words carefully.

Because we've only seen a tiny glimpse of Murray as a pro. But since April 25, he's lived up to the high expectations that have been set for him. Maybe even exceeded them in some areas.

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Dude. We're going way too far with this. You loved Kyler, you still love Kyler, even more now, we're good.

You deserve to be happy we got the guy you like, and happy he looks good. I made a single comment that was basically meant to say you loved him from the start. That's awesome, and all we have to say on the matter. We've wasted too many words.

 

[Solar7]

You are being ridiculous. We've gone over what happened at A&M a dozen times. Every meaningful QB on the depth chart TRANSFERRED because of how they were treated by Sumlin. Mayfield left TTU because he got beaten by what's his face. You must not follow college football at all if you think this is a concern.

Run to a program with better talent? You make the most ridiculous arguments sometimes that I can explain away in a few seconds. Texas A&M always has has LOTS of talent. When he was there they had two 5 star QBs. Miles Garrett. Christian Kirk. Ricky Seals Jones. TONS OF TALENT.

You honestly think what you saw from the offensive line is how it's going to be in the regular season?? Ridiculous.

Sumlin sucked, fine, bad program, fine. But the way people talk about Kyler is like he hit four years of NCAA eligibility, won the job as a true freshman, and sauntered out with only three losses on his belt.

The truth is, he didn't win the job against another true freshman, he got jerked around by a bad program, left, and then rode the pine. Do I blame him for not taking Baker Mayfield's job? Not at all. Was he this revolutionary truth all the way through the four years of school that he did? Not at all.

He is a kid with an incredible year of Heisman winning football. His seven throws in the preseason looked great. Man, I'd love for that to continue.

Do I think the offensive line is going to look that bad in the regular season? Absolutely. Pugh is hurt, Gilbert is hurt, Humphries is iffy, Shipley is obviously going to be the starter and is coming off a major injury, and that makes JR Sweezy our most reliable lineman that has actually been practicing comfortably at his position. Do you think it's going to be better? They got crushed out there and Joey Bosa wasn't even on the field.

 

[Jetstream Green]

We are building this really nice ship, with a brand new rudder and sails... except for those two big arse holes in the hull called the DL and OL