Suns pursuing Iman Shumpert

[PhxGametime]

It's at azcentral - interest in Jefferson or Hayward. I really like Jefferson's offense but Jefferson, Scola, Beasley, and Zeller as your bigs defensively is asking for trouble...

 

[Phrazbit]

Jefferson is an impending free agent, there is no reason the Suns should consider trading for him or anyone else of that nature. I cant imagine there is a shred of truth to that rumor. As dumb as I think our front office is, they are not THAT dumb.

 

[PhxGametime]

I'd rather go for Paul Millsap if the Suns could keep Dragic, Gortat, and Suns own Pick. Though I'd want extension in place...

 

[sunsfan88]

Find me a better defensive player than Tucker.

Steve

LeBron James, Luol Deng, Avery Bradley and Tony Allen. There probably are more by those 4 are definitely better defensively than Tucker.

 

[AzStevenCal]

LeBron James, Luol Deng, Avery Bradley and Tony Allen. There probably are more by those 4 are definitely better defensively than Tucker.

All good choices but other than Lebron I'm not sure they're actually better defenders than PJ. Keep in mind Tucker is being a defensive force on a team where often times no one else is even making an effort. Also, other than Lebron, how many of those guys can and have guarded all 5 positions? And then you look at respective salaries and PJ becomes an even greater value.

Steve

 

[Mainstreet]

It's at azcentral - interest in Jefferson or Hayward. I really like Jefferson's offense but Jefferson, Scola, Beasley, and Zeller as your bigs defensively is asking for trouble...

Do you have a link. I haven't seen it.

 

[Mainstreet]

Now Paul Coro at azcentral has an article up dated 2-11-13 confirming talks with Utah as well concerning Al Jefferson or Gordon Hayward. See link below.

The Suns also have shown interest in a bigger splash for Utah’s Al Jefferson or Gordon Hayward. Dudley could be a part of either of those deals with center Marcin Gortat likely needed to make one work for Jefferson, a 28-year-old power forward who makes $14 million and is averaging 17.4 points and 9.5 rebounds. Hayward, a 22-year-old swingman, is averaging 13.5 points in a reserve role.

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/sun...-swirl-about-phoenix-suns.html?nclick_check=1

 

[JS22]

I think I'd rather have Millsap.

But why would Utah want Gortat in return? They've already got Favors and Kanter.

 

[AzStevenCal]

1. Salaries have to match, Tucker's does, not sure other permutations would.

I think we all know salaries have to match, it doesn't mean we have to cover every last detail of a trade when we talk about the principals involved. Just out of curiosity, has anyone ever heard of an NBA trade failing because they couldn't find the throw-ins necessary to get the deal done? Between draft picks, expiring contracts and multi-team deals, getting the numbers to work is pretty easy once the big tickets concerns are resolved. At least it seems that way to me.

Steve

 

[sunsfan88]

This is dumb, Jefferson is a career loser. Whichever team he goes to, they immediately start losing despite him putting up big numbers. Plus he's worse than Amare defensively. And he's making big $$ for next 2 years.

I wouldn't mind Hayward but there's not much of a difference between him and Dudley.

If we're going for players from Utah, I would try to pry away Alec Burks and Millsap or Favors.

 

[Errntknght]

Not Jefferson, please. He often kills us but generally he's a softie - and too old. Dudley for Gordon Hayward is interesting. They are very similar players - high IQ, versatile, not athletic, hard workers, decent shots all over the floor and playmakers. I'd rate Dudley as the better defender but Hayward the better scorer - he gets to the FT line more. (Very limited observation of Hayward) Gordon is five years younger but appears to be more injury prone. Another risk is whether Hayward would stand up to the spotlight of being a starter as well as Duds has. Both are the kind of players that do well flying under the radar. I'd probably take the risks and a small hit on D because of the age difference.

 

[SirStefan32]

I must be overvaluing Dudley. I would not give up Dudley for either of the players mentioned above (Hayward or Shumpert) even if we got a pick in that deal.
He is a good shooter and a good defender, and probably the best value for the money in the league.

As far as Jefferson goes or Milsap go, either one of them is better than what we have- Gortat, O'Neal, or Morris. Wouldn't give up any picks for any of them. Utah needs one of them gone far more than we need them.

 

[elindholm]

Millsap isn't a cornerstone for a rebuilding team. He's one of those guys who has been underrated for so long that he's now overrated. 15 and 7 are solid numbers, but nothing to get excited about for a guy who just turned 28 and is undersized for his position.

Jefferson is one of the dominant low-post players in the league, but getting him in a trade wouldn't make much sense unless the Suns were intending to make him the franchise player for several years to come.

 

[JCSunsfan]

These deals seem to have no rhyme or reason.

 

[AzStevenCal]

These deals seem to have no rhyme or reason.

Yeah, they all pretty much sound like trades for the sake of trades. It's hard to believe any of these would be part of a well thought out plan. Especially the deals that include outgoing draft picks. I have no problem with moving Gortat, Dudley, ONeal (probably unmovable) or Telfair but each deal should be with the purpose of getting younger, getting more athletic and getting more draft picks.

Steve

 

[SirStefan32]

These deals seem to have no rhyme or reason.

Yeah, they all pretty much sound like trades for the sake of trades. It's hard to believe any of these would be part of a well thought out plan. Especially the deals that include outgoing draft picks. I have no problem with moving Gortat, Dudley, ONeal (probably unmovable) or Telfair but each deal should be with the purpose of getting younger, getting more athletic and getting more draft picks.

Steve

Initially I was thinking the same thing, but I do think I may see what they are trying to do.
Jefferson and Milsap are gone after this season. Gortat has another season left. Theoretically, swapping Gortat for either one of these two gentlemen would give the Suns additional space to spend on free agents next summer. Their rumored love affair with Josh Smith and the fact that Howard may be pissed enough to walk away from LA might indicate this is exactly what's going on. Swap Gortat and someone else for Jefferson, then let Jefferson walk, and you have an extra $15M or so to work with.
If you swap Gortat and Milsap straight up- you get $7M or so to use next summer.

As far as Dudley goes, I think the Suns may feel that there isn't enough time for him and Besley at the small forward position. I think getting rid of Dudley is the wrong thing to do, but if they did get rid of him, Besley would have plenty of time at that 3 spot, and they would get someone who can (in theory, anyway) play shooting guard and can still defend while having some athleticism (unlike Dudley).

Pure speculation on my part, and I am NOT advocating for either one of these moves, but that's the only logical explanation I can find to even think about these deals.

 

[HooverDam]

Those Utah trades sound terrible for the Suns, Jefferson could be a good #2. On a better team that has a good wing player but by the time the Suns are contending again he'll be too old.

 

[slinslin]

Al Jefferson is not a #2 he is not a player that u can build a contender with. Al Jefferson is basically a black Luis Scola.

Plus he is too old and Gordon Hayward? Jesus Christ, nice role player but not much more upside.

 

[Mainstreet]

I'm just guessing like everyone else but in the case of Utah the Suns might be trying to do a package trade like getting a young player in return plus an expiring contract.

 

[slinslin]

But please don't get Gordan Hayward.. He is basically the same kind of player Jared Dudley is.

 

[SirStefan32]

Al Jefferson is basically a black Luis Scola.

I think that is not a fair comparison. Jefferson is much stronger, a bit taller and longer, and definitely more athletic than Scola. He is a better scorer and a better rebounder, and he is much younger. Without looking it up, I'd say he has two inches, 40 lb, and four years on Scola.

He is most definitely good enough to be a second option if your first option is really good.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying the Suns should trade for him and give him $15M per season for the next five years, but saying that he is a "black Louis Scola" is very inaccurate, to say the least.

 

[HooverDam]

Find me a better defensive player than Tucker.

You should heed John Woodens advice and not confuse activity for accomplishment. Here is a short list of primarily wing players who's defense is better than PJ Tucker's:

1. K Leonard
2. Paul George
3. Trevor Ariza
4. Manu
5. LeBron
6. Kobe
7. Eric Bledsoe
8. Tony Allen
9. Josh Smith
10. Mike Conley
11. Sam Young
12. CP3
13. Durant
14. Rondo
15. George Hill
16. Westbrook
17. Thabo Sefolosha
18. L Deng
19. Avery Bradley
20. Al Fariq Aminu

And....

21. Iman Shumpert

Check the advanced stats and you'll see Tucker is a plus defender but only slightly. You're letting your eyes decieve you because PJ hustles.

PJ Tucker's hustle isn't the reason you don't do any deal.

 

[Superbone]

These deals seem to have no rhyme or reason.

I'm worried they're going to get a player good enough to ruin our lottery pick. Bring us back up into mediocrity.

 

[AzStevenCal]

You should heed John Woodens advice and not confuse activity for accomplishment. Here is a short list of primarily wing players who's defense is better than PJ Tucker's:

1. K Leonard
2. Paul George
3. Trevor Ariza
4. Manu
5. LeBron
6. Kobe
7. Eric Bledsoe
8. Tony Allen
9. Josh Smith
10. Mike Conley
11. Sam Young
12. CP3
13. Durant
14. Rondo
15. George Hill
16. Westbrook
17. Thabo Sefolosha
18. L Deng
19. Avery Bradley
20. Al Fariq Aminu

And....

21. Iman Shumpert

Check the advanced stats and you'll see Tucker is a plus defender but only slightly. You're letting your eyes decieve you because PJ hustles.

PJ Tucker's hustle isn't the reason you don't do any deal.

You're letting those little numbers deceive you because PJ is surrounded by piss-poor defenders which renders those kind of stats meaningless. When this team is focused and competitive, Tucker is incredible. I can't honestly say he gives it his all every night but seriously, who would given the lack of defensive focus our team plays with?

Steve

 

[Phrazbit]

Hoover, none of what you're saying negates the point that Tucker is still an asset, and not just some guy to be thrown in for salary balance purposes, especially when the player on the other end is a useless POS like Chris Copeland