Suns updates and discussion for the 2023-24 season

[Hoop Head]

Was thinking of potential teams to move KD to and Sacramento has been in talks for guys like Siakam so I was curious if a package could be made for KD. If we got back Harrison Barnes, Davion Mitchell, Keegan Murray, and Malik Monk then the money works. Ideally we'd get a pair of picks also. Anymore than that is expecting too much.

Barnes is a fine role playing forward. Mitchell and Murray are nice young pieces that fill holes at PG and PF, respectively, and Monk is there to make salaries work as an expiring contract. Maybe it's too much. I'm fairly certain Sacramento will move Barnes and Mitchell, as both have been floated in various deals for the last year or more. Murray is a wildcard because he's young and has a lot of potential. I think it'd be an ideal return for us. It doesn't put us in contention but it puts us in a better place going forward with 2 younger pieces to help retool around in Mitchell and Murray.

The only way out of this is trading KD. If we don't do it soon then we're likely screwed for the next 4 years, maybe more.

NBA Trade Machine - ESPN

NBA trade machine, make player trades

www.espn.com

 

[taz02]

I thought I read the suns can only trade one for one with matching salaries and cannot trade 1 player for multiple players due to their cap situation.

Next years salary for big 3, if we can still call them the big 3?

49,700,000 bk
50,203,000 Beal
51,179,000 kd

Projected cap 24-25, 142 mil.

Hard to see where the team goes from here.

 

[Sparky16]

I thought I read the suns can only trade one for one with matching salaries and cannot trade 1 player for multiple players due to their cap situation.

Next years salary for big 3, if we can still call them the big 3?

49,700,000 bk
50,203,000 Beal
51,179,000 kd

Projected cap 24-25, 142 mil.

Hard to see where the team goes from here.

say what you want about Kyree, maybe Dallas would consider instead of having 2 PG and the Suns have ZERO - kick the tires for Beal/Irving swap

 

[taz02]

Why would Dallas trade a guy who is owed 80 million after this season, without a no trade clause , averaging 23ppg and 5 assists for Beal who has a no trade clause, is owed 160 million and averaging 16 and 4?

 

[Covert Rain]

Was thinking of potential teams to move KD to and Sacramento has been in talks for guys like Siakam so I was curious if a package could be made for KD. If we got back Harrison Barnes, Davion Mitchell, Keegan Murray, and Malik Monk then the money works. Ideally we'd get a pair of picks also. Anymore than that is expecting too much.

Barnes is a fine role playing forward. Mitchell and Murray are nice young pieces that fill holes at PG and PF, respectively, and Monk is there to make salaries work as an expiring contract. Maybe it's too much. I'm fairly certain Sacramento will move Barnes and Mitchell, as both have been floated in various deals for the last year or more. Murray is a wildcard because he's young and has a lot of potential. I think it'd be an ideal return for us. It doesn't put us in contention but it puts us in a better place going forward with 2 younger pieces to help retool around in Mitchell and Murray.

The only way out of this is trading KD. If we don't do it soon then we're likely screwed for the next 4 years, maybe more.

NBA Trade Machine - ESPN

NBA trade machine, make player trades

www.espn.com

Book will not want to be here if this happens. Bank on it. The Suns need to decide if it's time to start over completely. No trade involving KD likely makes you a contender IMO which we all know is what Book is going to require to want to be here. Book is not going to want to be here after putting HOF players beside him, retooling yet again with players not on that level. There is no going back now. If you make moves without getting or retaining another star to play alongside Book....he isn't staying. Then we are in full blown rebuild mode.

Maybe that's what needs to happen, but no way Book is staying unless another major star is playing next to him. IMO, the Suns either keep tweaking or they go into full rebuild mode (including moving Book).

 

[Proximo]

Book will not want to be here if this happens. Bank on it. The Suns need to decide if it's time to start over completely. No trade involving KD likely makes you a contender IMO which we all know is what Book is going to require to want to be here. Book is not going to want to be here after putting HOF players beside him, retooling yet again with players not on that level. There is no going back now. If you make moves without getting or retaining another star to play alongside Book....he isn't staying. Then we are in full blown rebuild mode.

Maybe that's what needs to happen, but no way Book is staying unless another major star is playing next to him. IMO, the Suns either keep tweaking or they go into full rebuild mode (including moving Book).

Fine if you are right about that so be it.

I don't want this team coming back next year if it flames out like it seems it clearly will - because that is pure hopelessness.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Was thinking of potential teams to move KD to and Sacramento has been in talks for guys like Siakam so I was curious if a package could be made for KD. If we got back Harrison Barnes, Davion Mitchell, Keegan Murray, and Malik Monk then the money works. Ideally we'd get a pair of picks also. Anymore than that is expecting too much.

Barnes is a fine role playing forward. Mitchell and Murray are nice young pieces that fill holes at PG and PF, respectively, and Monk is there to make salaries work as an expiring contract. Maybe it's too much. I'm fairly certain Sacramento will move Barnes and Mitchell, as both have been floated in various deals for the last year or more. Murray is a wildcard because he's young and has a lot of potential. I think it'd be an ideal return for us. It doesn't put us in contention but it puts us in a better place going forward with 2 younger pieces to help retool around in Mitchell and Murray.

The only way out of this is trading KD. If we don't do it soon then we're likely screwed for the next 4 years, maybe more.

NBA Trade Machine - ESPN

NBA trade machine, make player trades

www.espn.com

I don’t think the Kings do that deal.

 

[Covert Rain]

Fine if you are right about that so be it.

I don't want this team coming back next year if it flames out like it seems it clearly will - because that is pure hopelessness.

I am not saying either action is correct. I have not really decided what I would like to see. The big 3 have only played together what 5 or 6 games total? I guess if I want to hold on to any ray of optimism it's that it usually takes much longer for a team's starters to gel together let alone the bench rotation that has to follow. It's not much but I am still hanging onto that. 5 or 6 games or whatever it is now isn't much of a sample size. The problem is we are almost halfway through and still have a small sample size and really crappy coaching IMO.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I am not saying either action is correct. I have not really decided what I would like to see. The big 3 have only played together what 5 or 6 games total? I guess if I want to hold on to any ray of optimism it's that it usually takes much longer for a team's starters to gel together let alone the bench rotation that has to follow. It's not much but I am still hanging onto that. 5 or 6 games or whatever it is now isn't much of a sample size. The problem is we are almost halfway through and still have a small sample size and really crappy coaching IMO.

Yeah. If I thought we could wipe the slate clean and start a rebuild, I'd be all for it. But I just don't see how that's possible with our nearly immovable pieces and very low value draft assets. The chances we win a title with this core appears to be almost zero but almost zero is still probably our best chance over the next decade. Minor tweaks is about all we can hope for.

 

[Proximo]

I am not saying either action is correct. I have not really decided what I would like to see. The big 3 have only played together what 5 or 6 games total? I guess if I want to hold on to any ray of optimism it's that it usually takes much longer for a team's starters to gel together let alone the bench rotation that has to follow. It's not much but I am still hanging onto that. 5 or 6 games or whatever it is now isn't much of a sample size. The problem is we are almost halfway through and still have a small sample size and really crappy coaching IMO.

80% of this team's problems are not the big 3.

We can't rebound, the role players can't seemingly do anything to help offensively other than Allen and Gordon who can't get consistent shot attempts, we lack a defensive stopper, and we seem to be missing heart.

Clearly the coaching sucks as well.

With all that said - keeping this big 3 will not allow us to improve our role players minus multiple miracles like finding street free agents that contribute at a high level.

I don't see this getting better.

 

[BirdGangThing]

I'm not cashing out yet - we're only in the second quarter of the season - aint even halftime yet - but I am crazy concerned

 

[Covert Rain]

I'm not cashing out yet - we're only in the second quarter of the season - aint even halftime yet - but I am crazy concerned

This is where I am at.

 

[Hoop Head]

Book will not want to be here if this happens. Bank on it. The Suns need to decide if it's time to start over completely. No trade involving KD likely makes you a contender IMO which we all know is what Book is going to require to want to be here. Book is not going to want to be here after putting HOF players beside him, retooling yet again with players not on that level. There is no going back now. If you make moves without getting or retaining another star to play alongside Book....he isn't staying. Then we are in full blown rebuild mode.

Maybe that's what needs to happen, but no way Book is staying unless another major star is playing next to him. IMO, the Suns either keep tweaking or they go into full rebuild mode (including moving Book).

Let him demand a trade. This team is going nowhere. He can't be happy with how things are right now. Who is to say he's not on the verge of asking out already? This team isn't a team and hasn't been since the KD trade went down. It became the Booker and KD show and look where that's brought us.

 

[Covert Rain]

Let him demand a trade. This team is going nowhere. He can't be happy with how things are right now. Who is to say he's not on the verge of asking out already? This team isn't a team and hasn't been since the KD trade went down. It became the Booker and KD show and look where that's brought us.

I am not advocating one way or another. Just pointing out that JUST trading KD makes no sense because Booker isn't going to settle with playing with a bunch of journeyman type guys. I still think the coaching staff is the biggest issue.

 

[Hoop Head]

I am not advocating one way or another. Just pointing out that JUST trading KD makes no sense because Booker isn't going to settle with playing with a bunch of journeyman type guys. I still think the coaching staff is the biggest issue.

You think he won't be ok with it when we don't know what he wants. He's playing with journeymen now.

 

[Covert Rain]

You think he won't be ok with it when we don't know what he wants.

Yes we do. He expressed in the past he wants to be a perennial contender. You are not doing that pairing him with a bunch of journeyman type guys.

 

[Hoop Head]

Yes we do. He expressed in the past he wants to be a perennial contender. You are not doing that pairing him with a bunch of journeyman type guys.

No, we don't. He's said he wants to be a Sun for life. You're adding layers now and saying you aren't taking a side but clearly you have an agenda. As I said, if he wants out then so be it. We'll come to that when it happens. Until then we need to do something and trading KD is the most likely chance of putting us in position to be competitive going forward. We really don't have any other options beside continuing the failed experiment which leaves us worse off. We aren't a contender now so I guess Booker should be asking out any day, right?

This isn't about Booker, this is about restoring and rebuilding the Suns. He's here for it or he isn't.

 

[Covert Rain]

No, we don't. He's said he wants to be a Sun for life. You're adding layers now and saying you aren't taking a side but clearly you have an agenda. As I said, if he wants out then so be it. We'll come to that when it happens. Until then we need to do something and trading KD is the most likely chance of putting us in position to be competitive going forward. We really don't have any other options beside continuing the failed experiment which leaves us worse off. We aren't a contender now so I guess Booker should be asking out any day, right?

What are you going on about now? Agenda?!? Uh....OK. In his ESPN interview he said he didn't want to win just to make the playoffs, or get to the first or 2nd round. I will try and find it. That is pretty clear. I also heard him on local radio on multiple occasions say similar things about contending for a title is important to him. Besides, you know how many times I have heard in every sport a player saying they are a "lifer" only for said player to change when it becomes clear the team isn't going to win or as they get closer to the end of the career. There is always CONTEXT with those statements by players. I have zero doubt in a perfect world the Suns would compete the entire time he is here and he would like to stay. I am not questioning that.

I don't think Book is currently in a place where he thinks the Suns can't do something to win. I have seen the Suns make moves I didn't see coming. Maybe they can work out a 3 team trade to bring in a piece while moving KD out? Circumstances can change quickly with star players in this league. How many examples do you need? That might open up possibilities to move KD or do something else.

So much for that "agenda".

 

[Hoop Head]

What are you going on about now? Agenda?!? Uh....OK. In his ESPN interview he said he didn't want to win just to make the playoffs, or get to the first or 2nd round. I will try and find it. That is pretty clear. I also heard him on local radio on multiple occasions say similar things about contending for a title is important to him. Besides, you know how many times I have heard in every sport a player saying they are a "lifer" only for said player to change when it becomes clear the team isn't going to win or as they get closer to the end of the career. There is always CONTEXT with those statements by players. I have zero doubt in a perfect world the Suns would compete the entire time he is here and he would like to stay. I am not questioning that.

I don't think Book is currently in a place where he thinks the Suns can't do something to win. I have seen the Suns make moves I didn't see coming. Maybe they can work out a 3 team trade to bring in a piece while moving KD out? Circumstances can change quickly with star players in this league. How many examples do you need? That might open up possibilities to move KD or do something else.

So much for that "agenda".

So now we can trade KD for a star? Ok. Sure. That's what makes you come around on trading KD.

 

[Covert Rain]

So now we can trade KD for a star? Ok. Sure. That's what makes you come around on trading KD.

If that is what you got out of that, no wonder you think Book would be OK surrounded with scrubs again. The only Agenda I have is winning a title. I didn't care if it was with CP3 or without. Don't care if it's with KD or without. Don't care if it's with Beal or without. As long as we are contending. Oh...what a horrible agenda.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

No, we don't. He's said he wants to be a Sun for life. You're adding layers now and saying you aren't taking a side but clearly you have an agenda. As I said, if he wants out then so be it. We'll come to that when it happens. Until then we need to do something and trading KD is the most likely chance of putting us in position to be competitive going forward. We really don't have any other options beside continuing the failed experiment which leaves us worse off. We aren't a contender now so I guess Booker should be asking out any day, right?

This isn't about Booker, this is about restoring and rebuilding the Suns. He's here for it or he isn't.

Yeah I’m don’t buy this. He wanted to play for a contender. He got his wish of adding two stars. It isn’t working. But he’s not going to demand a trade after he got what he wanted. If you take away those stars and they aren’t a contender Booker will want out. He’s not here for another rebuild imo.

 

[95pro]

My biggest gripe is with our centers. Nurk sucks and he's one of the main issues with our team. Other teams are not afraid of this guy in any capacity: shot blocking, altering, deterring, on-ball, off-ball, chase-downs, rotations. None of that! All his flailing and throwing hands up crap is annoying, the fouls he draws doesn't offset he deficiencies no matter how you slice it and dice it. Teams are attacking him at will.

 

[Mainstreet]

How could the Clippers resist having five stars? They already have four.

Let's trade Kevin Durant for their other players.

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[Hoop Head]

My biggest gripe is with our centers. Nurk sucks and he's one of the main issues with our team. Other teams are not afraid of this guy in any capacity: shot blocking, altering, deterring, on-ball, off-ball, chase-downs, rotations. None of that! All his flailing and throwing hands up crap is annoying, the fouls he draws doesn't offset he deficiencies no matter how you slice it and dice it. Teams are attacking him at will.

Nurk is the least of our concerns. He's started more games than anyone. He isn't perfect but he does his role. We aren't losing because he's not doing something.

 

[Covert Rain]

My biggest gripe is with our centers. Nurk sucks and he's one of the main issues with our team. Other teams are not afraid of this guy in any capacity: shot blocking, altering, deterring, on-ball, off-ball, chase-downs, rotations. None of that! All his flailing and throwing hands up crap is annoying, the fouls he draws doesn't offset he deficiencies no matter how you slice it and dice it. Teams are attacking him at will.

Nurk does things better than Ayton but there is zero doubt our paint has become a turnstile with him. He has made us worse defensively. Nobody worries about the paint with Nurk in there. He is definitely part of why this team is worse defensively.