2012 Free Agency news

[Cheesebeef]

I just cannot embrace the philosophy of losing.

their current "philosophy" has kept the Suns out of the playoffs for 3 of the last 4 seasons and we're looking at 5. You may not agree with me, but that philosophy IS losing.

 

[Mainstreet]

their current "philosophy" has kept the Suns out of the playoffs for 3 of the last 4 seasons and we're looking at 5. You may not agree with me, but that philosophy IS losing.

The Suns problem has been recent ownership and a poorly run FO. You know the history.

Babby claims he has been running the Suns FO since last season. We shall see how well he does it. This off season would tend to indicate the Suns are willing to roll the dice on some young players and remain flexible under the CAP to make future moves. They even acquired some draft picks for a change. At least thus far this season the Suns seem to be acting responsible looking towards the future instead of the past. I liked they used the Amnesty on Childress to acquire a player like Scola. This is not a move the Suns would have made a few years back.

 

[Cheesebeef]

The Suns problem has been recent ownership and a poorly run FO. You know the history.

Babby claims he has been running the Suns FO since last season. We shall see how well he does it. This off season would tend to indicate the Suns are willing to roll the dice on some young players and remain flexible under the CAP to make future moves. They even acquired some draft picks for a change. At least thus far this season the Suns seem to be acting responsible looking towards the future instead of the past. I liked they used the Amnesty on Childress to acquire a player like Scola. This is not a move the Suns would have made a few years back.

we'll see.

 

[Phrazbit]

The Suns problem has been recent ownership and a poorly run FO. You know the history.

Babby claims he has been running the Suns FO since last season. We shall see how well he does it. This off season would tend to indicate the Suns are willing to roll the dice on some young players and remain flexible under the CAP to make future moves. They even acquired some draft picks for a change. At least thus far this season the Suns seem to be acting responsible looking towards the future instead of the past. I liked they used the Amnesty on Childress to acquire a player like Scola. This is not a move the Suns would have made a few years back.

I just cant buy it. If New Orleans hadnt saved us from ourselves we would have blown our cap for the next 3-4 years without signing one guy who has proven himself to be a difference maker in this league.

 

[SweetD]

I just cant buy it. If New Orleans hadnt saved us from ourselves we would have blown our cap for the next 3-4 years without signing one guy who has proven himself to be a difference maker in this league.

You make is seam like if the Suns don't sign a Lebron, Wade, Durrant, Kobe, Howard, future HOF then they are over paying? Please put a team together that is realistic and fits under your contracts please and submit to the league "aka our wonderful board"

 

[Phrazbit]

You make is seam like if the Suns don't sign a Lebron, Wade, Durrant, Kobe, Howard, future HOF then they are over paying? Please put a team together that is realistic and fits under your contracts please and submit to the league "aka our wonderful board"

No, I am not expecting a superstar, Ive made that rather clear. What I would prefer is the Suns to not set themselves back further with more bad contracts.

How about instead someone shows me a team... ever that had success while building through free agent signings of marginal players. The method we are following is one that has had a 100% failure rate. I dont think it makes me crazy for wanting the Suns to avoid that path.

 

[elindholm]

A lot of people seem to subscribe to the theory that all you have to do is throw some young players together, and they will automatically "gel" in a couple of years and become a good team. If you believe this, then it makes sense to invest in the likes of Dragic or Beasley or Gordon, because even though those players may look marginal now, they are on the right path to becoming leaders of a good team.

Unfortunately, it doesn't work that way. Only a few players are going to grow up to take their place among the league's elite. If you can land such a talent, through the draft or after the player is in the league, then you pay any price to make it happen. But to invest heavily in players who are doomed never to reach the first tier is to build a roster that, by its very construction, has almost no chance of contending.

Does anyone really think that Dragic is going to be a top-five PG in this league, ever? If so, which player of his generation is he going to surpass: Paul, Williams, Rose, Irving, or Rondo? And can he hold off the next wave of upstarts in the meantime?

Now, Dragic isn't paid like a top-five PG, so it's not the end of the world if he winds up as only an average starter. But he provides a good example anyway, because he's the level of player that you can't afford to invest too heavily in if you are trying to form one of the league's top teams.

Beasley is young enough that it's unclear yet who his peer group is. I certainly wouldn't say that it's likely that he becomes a top-five SF in five years, but I can't immediately identify five players at his position who are virtually guaranteed to be better in 2017, when Beasley will be 28.

 

[sunsfan88]

No, I am not expecting a superstar, Ive made that rather clear. What I would prefer is the Suns to not set themselves back further with more bad contracts.

How about instead someone shows me a team... ever that had success while building through free agent signings of marginal players. The method we are following is one that has had a 100% failure rate. I dont think it makes me crazy for wanting the Suns to avoid that path.

The new Suns FO is NOT signing bad contracts!

Mayo wanted a bad contract from the Suns so we told him to go kick rocks! Lee wanted a long term deal and we said **** off!

The new Suns brass is actually careful with their money and are only spending it if its worth it.

(bring on with the Beaslry and Dragic hate)

 

[Phrazbit]

The new Suns FO is NOT signing bad contracts!

Mayo wanted a bad contract from the Suns so we told him to go kick rocks! Lee wanted a long term deal and we said **** off!

The new Suns brass is actually careful with their money and are only spending it if its worth it.

(bring on with the Beaslry and Dragic hate)

58 million to a guy who played 9 games last year and has never been to the playoffs or an all-star game (who we luckily didnt get). 18 million to a guy who couldnt be given away while on a contract the fraction of that size. I actually like Dragic but the contract is not something we could move.

A butt load of money to build a roster that (even with Gordon) had no hope of competing at a high level.

Hard to claim they're spending carefully.

 

[sunsfan88]

58 million to a guy who played 9 games last year and has never been to the playoffs or an all-star game (who we luckily didnt get). 18 million to a guy who couldnt be given away while on a contract the fraction of that size. I actually like Dragic but the contract is not something we could move.

A butt load of money to build a roster that (even with Gordon) had no hope of competing at a high level.

Hard to claim they're spending carefully.

Your the ONLY person out there who claims that Beasley has such a bad contract. Every where else people claim it to be a great deal because of the potential he has and because of what the he could have possibly got from other teams (more $$)

Dragic's contract is not bad. He's always been a good defender and he showed last year that he made strides in his defensive play.

And do you realize that the Suns HAVE to spend $$? There is a thing called minimum salary cap and the Suns HAVE to meet it.

Dragic is a solid player and Beasley is a player who if Gentry can straighten out, can be a superstar in this league (many pegged him to get drafted before Derrick Rose)

Even if Beasley doesn't work out, its not like he's much of a burden. There are plenty of teams who will take him on because of his youth and potential and even if there is absolutely no takers for him, he's only on contract for 3 years at $6M each and then he's gone. Its not like he's handicapping us from signing some great player or something.

 

[Phrazbit]

Your the ONLY person out there who claims that Beasley has such a bad contract. Every where else people claim it to be a great deal because of the potential he has and because of what the he could have possibly got from other teams (more $$)

lol, who is "everyone else claiming it to be a great deal", some Suns blogger? MR ORNG? You? Other teams could have given more more "$$"... like who? Those zero teams who visited him? Those zero teams who traded for him last season while the Wolves tried to give him away?

We signed a crappy player, there is no scenario where signing a garbage player amounts to a "great deal".

Even if Beasley doesn't work out, its not like he's much of a burden. There are plenty of teams who will take him on because of his youth and potential and even if there is absolutely no takers for him, he's only on contract for 3 years at $6M each and then he's gone. Its not like he's handicapping us from signing some great player or something.

No one will take him unless he dramatically improves. The Wolves already proved that. And you hand out 6, 7, 8 million dollar deals to multiple players and it adds up. If you looked at the Suns salary projections for next 2 years you'd be surprised. Between cap holds and future picks we own, offering another max contract is going to be nearly impossible with our currently constructed roster.

Not that it matters though, because when we're 15 games under .500 at the trade deadline, what few trade-able pieces the Suns have will probably be on the trade block.

 

[sunsfan88]

lol, who is "everyone else claiming it to be a great deal", some Suns blogger? MR ORNG? You? Other teams could have given more more "$$"... like who? Those zero teams who visited him? Those zero teams who traded for him last season while the Wolves tried to give him away?

We signed a crappy player, there is no scenario where signing a garbage player amounts to a "great deal".


No one will take him unless he dramatically improves. The Wolves already proved that. And you hand out 6, 7, 8 million dollar deals to multiple players and it adds up. If you looked at the Suns salary projections for next 2 years you'd be surprised. Between cap holds and future picks we own, offering another max contract is going to be nearly impossible with our currently constructed roster.

Not that it matters though, because when we're 15 games under .500 at the trade deadline, what few trade-able pieces the Suns have will probably be on the trade block.

Wolves tried to give him away? The Wolves were the team who stopped the trade that would have sent him to the Lakers.

And you keep saying nobody is interested in him...

http://www.celticsblog.com/2012/2/28/2830855/new-york-post-celtics-interested-in-michael-beasley

http://www.rantsports.com/courtcrus...ew-jersey-nets-interested-in-michael-beasley/

Beasley, 23, is also getting interest from Detroit but wants to come to Phoenix. A source said his agent, Jeff Schwartz, feels like Suns coach Alvin Gentry would be as good of a fit for Beasley as he was for Lamar Odom, when he was an immature, inconsistent young player for Gentry's Clippers.

http://www.azcentral.com/sports/sun...s-hosting-michael-beasley-raymond-felton.html

Unrestricted free agent Michael Beasley has been receiving interest from a number of teams including the Charlotte Bobcats, Memphis Grizzlies, Los Angeles Lakers, Dallas Mavericks, Phoenix Suns and Detroit Pistons, according to sources close to the situation. All of these teams have been in contact with Beasley’s camp and expressed interest in acquiring the forward either through free agency or a sign-and-trade with the Minnesota Timberwolves.

http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-pm-paul-seems-commited-to-clippers

So please, just stop making the same "nobody wants Beasley except the Suns" crap. Plenty of teams were interested in him.

 

[Phrazbit]

Wolves tried to give him away? The Wolves were the team who stopped the trade that would have sent him to the Lakers.

And you keep saying nobody is interested in him...

http://www.celticsblog.com/2012/2/28/2830855/new-york-post-celtics-interested-in-michael-beasley

http://www.rantsports.com/courtcrus...ew-jersey-nets-interested-in-michael-beasley/


http://www.azcentral.com/sports/sun...s-hosting-michael-beasley-raymond-felton.html



http://www.hoopsworld.com/nba-pm-paul-seems-commited-to-clippers


So please, just stop making the same "nobody wants Beasley except the Suns" crap. Plenty of teams were interested in him.

The Hoopsworld article doesnt mention Beasley once.

Rant sports... a blog post from MARCH?!

Azcentral article with no mention of other suitors for Beasley, besides his agent as the "source". Oh, by the way, Detroit is well over the cap, so even IF they wanted Beasley, the Suns paid more than Detroit could even have offered... but it didnt matter... because the Pistons never offered.

lol, keeps getting funnier... a celtic BLOG dated in FEBRUARY?!?!


So... if those were the best sources you could find of teams being "interested" in Beasley then you did an excellent job in proving that no one wanted him, especially for the joke of a price the Suns shelled out.

And that Laker trade that got nixed... the Wolves were getting Derick Fisher's corpse and Crawford's expiring contract in return... and failed to actually make the trade. So basically they agreed to trade him for nothing... and then didnt get it done.

 

[Evil Ash]

The Hoopsworld article doesnt mention Beasley once.

Rant sports... a blog post from MARCH?!

Azcentral article with no mention of other suitors for Beasley, besides his agent as the "source". Oh, by the way, Detroit is well over the cap, so even IF they wanted Beasley, the Suns paid more than Detroit could even have offered... but it didnt matter... because the Pistons never offered.

lol, keeps getting funnier... a celtic BLOG dated in FEBRUARY?!?!


So... if those were the best sources you could find of teams being "interested" in Beasley then you did an excellent job in proving that no one wanted him, especially for the joke of a price the Suns shelled out.

And that Laker trade that got nixed... the Wolves were getting Derick Fisher's corpse and Crawford's expiring contract in return... and failed to actually make the trade. So basically they agreed to trade him for nothing... and then didnt get it done.

Remember when we talked about you obsessing about certain players and ignoring facts to dispute your viewpoint (ala Kolb and how "nobody wanted him")? You're doing it AGAIN

 

[Phrazbit]

Remember when we talked about you obsessing about certain players and ignoring facts to dispute your viewpoint (ala Kolb and how "nobody wanted him")? You're doing it AGAIN

... no one wanted Kolb.

Beasley had some teams "in touch with him"... fine. I dont doubt Beasley would have ended up somewhere if the Suns had not signed him. But for the price we signed him? Doubtful.

Is there any doubt that the Wolves tried desperately to trade him while on a much smaller contract than he is now? None. Were they successful in their efforts despite most reports claiming they would have accepted as little as a late 1st pick? No.

Does the fact that an idiot franchise like Detroit MIGHT have had interest in Beasley justify the Suns being the ones who had the privilege in giving him his stupid contract? Absolutely not.


And once more for the road... NO TEAM has ever had success by building their roster around middling (to put it kindly) free agent signings. The Suns are following a path with a 100% failure rate.

 

[sunsfan88]

The Hoopsworld article doesnt mention Beasley once.

Rant sports... a blog post from MARCH?!

Azcentral article with no mention of other suitors for Beasley, besides his agent as the "source".

lol, keeps getting funnier... a celtic BLOG dated in FEBRUARY?!?!


So... if those were the best sources you could find of teams being "interested" in Beasley then you did an excellent job in proving that no one wanted him, especially for the joke of a price the Suns shelled out.

And that Laker trade that got nixed... the Wolves were getting Derick Fisher's corpse and Crawford's expiring contract in return... and failed to actually make the trade. So basically they agreed to trade him for nothing... and then didnt get it done.

No you are wrong again.

Your making it seem as if Minnesota tried so hard to trade him yet nobody would trade for him. That wasn't the case. There were teams interested in him but Minnesota's FO wasn't ready to part with him. They wanted more for him, they weren't looking to just "dump" him like YOU think.

Then the plug was pulled by Minnesota owner Glen Taylor on an agreed-upon trade, canceling a three-team transaction that would have sent Derek Fisher to Minnesota, not Houston, according to an NBA official who is not authorized to speak publicly.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/laker...ere-close-on-beasley-20120315,0,5069202.story

And let's see if you can find the article on hoopshype.

Tuesday, July 3 2012

Unrestricted free agent Michael Beasley has been receiving interest from a number of teams including the Charlotte Bobcats, Memphis Grizzlies, Los Angeles Lakers, Dallas Mavericks, Phoenix Suns and Detroit Pistons, according to sources close to the situation. All of these teams have been in contact with Beasley’s camp and expressed interest in acquiring the forward either through free agency or a sign-and-trade with the Minnesota Timberwolves. HoopsWorld

http://hoopshype.com/rumors/tag/michael_beasley

Keep hating on him man but you do realize that if he plays well, you won't be able to just flip flop your way around right? I already bookmarked this thread and I'll definitely bring it back up.

Agree to disagree...for now

 

[Covert Rain]

OMG. I can't believe people are actually having a debate about Beasley and Goran. Give me a break. There is no world in which either of these guys start on a title contending team. Both IMO are patches in a sinking ship.

 

[Phrazbit]

No you are wrong again.

Your making it seem as if Minnesota tried so hard to trade him yet nobody would trade for him. That wasn't the case. There were teams interested in him but Minnesota's FO wasn't ready to part with him. They wanted more for him, they weren't looking to just "dump" him like YOU think.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/laker...ere-close-on-beasley-20120315,0,5069202.story

And let's see if you can find the article on hoopshype.



http://hoopshype.com/rumors/tag/michael_beasley

Keep hating on him man but you do realize that if he plays well, you won't be able to just flip flop your way around right? I already bookmarked this thread and I'll definitely bring it back up.

Agree to disagree...for now

Good, bookmark it.

It will be humorous next summer when people are looking at Beasley and asking "was the amnesty a one time thing?"

So, the Timberwolves agreed to swap him straight up for Fisher but backed out at the last second? Thats your evidence of his worth? Thats the best offer Minnesota got? Once again, you are proving very clearly that Beasley was worth jack-squat as a trade piece last year... while on a contract worth a fraction of his current one.

So... thanks for proving me right... again.

 

[Evil Ash]

... no one wanted Kolb.

Proven false but you will ignore in anyways

Beasley had some teams "in touch with him"... fine. I dont doubt Beasley would have ended up somewhere if the Suns had not signed him. But for the price we signed him? Doubtful.

Considering Jeremy Lin is getting paid $15 million in 2 years I doubt NOTHING at this point

Is there any doubt that the Wolves tried desperately to trade him while on a much smaller contract than he is now? None. Were they successful in their efforts despite most reports claiming they would have accepted as little as a late 1st pick? No.

They backed out of a deal. Don't know why but things happen. Factors change and some teams may not have wanted to give away a draft pick in what was considered one of the deepest drafts in years. I don't know. You don't know but you often act like you do.

You're not the smartest guy in the room, you're just the loudest

Does the fact that an idiot franchise like Detroit MIGHT have had interest in Beasley justify the Suns being the ones who had the privilege in giving him his stupid contract? Absolutely not.

Does the fact that moronic franchises like the Wizards, Kings, among others feel like tanking consistently is the best way to rebuild with zero luck? Yet people on here view it as the ONLY way to rebuild.

And once more for the road... NO TEAM has ever had success by building their roster around middling (to put it kindly) free agent signings. The Suns are following a path with a 100% failure rate.

1) The 2004 Detroit Pistons were built almost entirely on castoffs and the won the whole damn thing

2) There is a salary cap floor that all teams have to meet. The "we shouldn't spend any money" strategy doesn't work.

 

[Phrazbit]

Proven false but you will ignore in anyways

No, it wasnt. Unless you want to pretend teams spent 1st round picks on QBs and teams like Seattle signed Tavaris as a practical joke, then it was shown pretty soundly that the Cardinals were alone in the bidding.


Considering Jeremy Lin is getting paid $15 million in 2 years I doubt NOTHING at this point

Lin, if nothing else, is hugely marketable. If not for him the Knicks dont even make the playoffs last year. Lin in one month had a larger impact on this league than Beasley has in 4 years.

They backed out of a deal. Don't know why but things happen. Factors change and some teams may not have wanted to give away a draft pick in what was considered one of the deepest drafts in years. I don't know. You don't know but you often act like you do.

Well, we know they originally accepted a deal with Derick Fisher for Beasley as a swap... which you would assume was the best they could do. Thats basically giving the guy away for nothing.


Does the fact that moronic franchises like the Wizards, Kings, among others feel like tanking consistenly is the best way to rebuild with zero luck? Yet people on here view it as the ONLY way to rebuild.

The Wizards and the Kings have had cap issues because of bad contracts given out to marginal players... they're not trying to tank, they are just stupid. The same direction the Suns appear to be traveling.


1) The 2004 Detroit Pistons were built almost entirely on castoffs and the won the whole damn thing

That Piston team had a 2 time defending defensive player of the year on its roster, and was put over the top by adding an all-star to its already ECF contending group. The Suns... arnt exactly building a defensive juggernaut here. And of all those guys, only Billups was a free agent addition.

2) There is a salary cap floor that all teams have to meet. The "we shouldn't spend any money" strategy doesn't work.

This is the weakest argument of all... you can spend money, just dont commit yourself to marginal players.

 

[sunsfan88]

Good, bookmark it.

It will be humorous next summer when people are looking at Beasley and asking "was the amnesty a one time thing?"

So, the Timberwolves agreed to swap him straight up for Fisher but backed out at the last second? Thats your evidence of his worth? Thats the best offer Minnesota got? Once again, you are proving very clearly that Beasley was worth jack-squat as a trade piece last year... while on a contract worth a fraction of his current one.

So... thanks for proving me right... again.

I love how you are dodging so much of my last post. Especially your whole argument of "Nobody wanted Beasley" which I just flushed down the toilet.

And I think it would be even more humorous next summer when you turn the corner on Beasley and seen this as your avatar/sig

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[Phrazbit]

I love how you are dodging so much of my last post. Especially your whole argument of "Nobody wanted Beasley" which I just flushed down the toilet.

And I think it would be even more humorous next summer when you turn the corner on Beasley and seen this as your avatar/sig

Dodge?! You showed me that the best offer the Wolves got was for Fisher in a straight up swap! You did an excellent job of proving me right.

 

[NashDishesDimes]

Jordan Hill resigned with the Lakers. I just looked at his profile/game log. When he gets minutes it looks like he can play. He can definitely rebound. Suns should have made a run at him. Was he restricted or unrestricted? Hes an AZ product too...

Check it: http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4613;_ylt=AukBFH8xh7D_yb0CZc.NC8OkvLYF

 

[95pro]

restricted

 

[sunsfan88]

Darren Wolfson ‏@DarrenWolfson

I wouldn't rule out Robin Lopez for the #Twolves. Suns have bigs, plus MN had talks w/ them in Batum 3-way scenarios.

Hmm...