Does Anyone Expect A Season?

Griffin

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The sides are much closer after three straight days of meetings in consecutive weeks. Besides the BRI split, the list of remaining items is down to just a handful, such as the ability of teams over the luxury tax threshold to use the midlevel exception or participate in sign-and-trade deals.

Those are important to players. The top-spending teams are mostly the ones in the biggest markets, and players want to know teams in the most desired cities won’t be prevented from bidding on them.

“What we did not want to do and what we don’t want to do is take taxpaying teams completely out of the market for other teams’ free agents,” union president Derek Fisher(notes) of the Lakers said. “We want our midlevel players to be able to sign contracts or at least have the opportunity to sign a contract wherever they would like to play.”
It seems to me that the players union couldn't care less about parity or competitive balance in the league. They were against a hard cap, which has been shown to work very effectively in NFL, and it looks like they will mostly get their way on that issue. The luxury tax may be stiffer in the new CBA, but it still won't discourage teams like Lakers or Mavericks from paying it if it produces championships.

I like the idea of LT teams not being able to use certain exceptions. After all, those teams not only already exceeded the cap, but also exceeded the much higher LT limit, so it would make sense to limit their ability to compete for the same free agents as lower-payroll teams. And any player wishing to play for such a team could still do so by signing for the minimum. But that's not enough for the players union. They want to maintain the status quo where every player has the choice to sign with any team, including the largest markets and championship contenders, and still get a $5M/year salary. Fisher is not just talking about midlevel players, as he would have you believe. He is also talking about higher-priced players willing to take a paycut for a chance at a ring or to play in a large market, but not willing to play for the minimum.
 

elindholm

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It seems to me that the players union couldn't care less about parity or competitive balance in the league.

Stern isn't either. The league has done best during the mini-dynasties of the 80s Lakers and the 90s Bulls. Competitive balance might increase overall interest in the league, but there's no particular reason to believe that it would.
 

Mainstreet

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Stern isn't either. The league has done best during the mini-dynasties of the 80s Lakers and the 90s Bulls. Competitive balance might increase overall interest in the league, but there's no particular reason to believe that it would.

I guess we will never find out how well a competitive league might excel. It seemingly has always been run by dynasties. However, I think someone should give it a try. It has worked for the NFL. As I see it, there has always been a dark cloud surrounding the NBA... in regard to it's legitimacy. A new commissioner would be a start plus a CBA that does not cater to every wish of the stars.

Did anyone notice Lebron trolling for Crawford and Nash on twitter? I guess Lebron needs more help.

http://www.wgal.com/r/29606953/detail.html
 
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Griffin

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Here is a in-depth article from Aldridge about the current state of negotiations and what the league and the players union already agreed upon.

http://www.nba.com/2011/news/featur...lockout-next-steps/index.html?ls=iref:nbahpt1

One thing that none of these writers seem to point out is that all the new restrictions that are to be implemented would only apply to teams over the LT threshold, not the salary cap threshold. To me, that is already a significant concession from the hard cap that was originally sought by the owners. The much higher tax combined with greater revenue sharing will make it financially difficult for most, if not all, teams to significantly exceed LT, but all teams will be able to easily go up to the LT, exceeding the salary cap with the same exceptions that are already in place.

According to Aldridge, the NBA gave the players union two options: 50/50 split with severe limitations on LT teams being able to sign players, or 47/53 split (in favor of owners) with no such restrictions, albeit a stiffer tax penalties in both cases (already agreed upon). In both cases, teams would always be able to exceed the salary cap up to the LT threshold as they currently can.

Here's an even better summary of the progress of negotiations:

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/20...r-proposals/index.html?sct=hp_t2_a6&eref=sihp
 
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Superbone

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It's finally here! Opening night of the NBA!

Oh, wait.
 

AzStevenCal

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It's finally here! Opening night of the NBA!

Oh, wait.

Big deal, everyone knows that the regular season doesn't matter. For myself, I'll just wait for the first round of cancelled playoff games before I get all excited. :)

Steve
 

Mainstreet

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I was counting on the Arizona Cardinals to help ease the pain during the NBA lockout. Wrong. It's just plain wrong... the Cardinals and the Suns.

Now I find myself hearing the Depeche Mode song "Wrong" playing in my head. At least the song is great.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2GaCnAiuvo
 

AzStevenCal

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I was counting on the Arizona Cardinals to help ease the pain during the NBA lockout. Wrong. It's just plain wrong... the Cardinals and the Suns.

Now I find myself hearing the Depeche Mode song "Wrong" playing in my head. At least the song is great.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2GaCnAiuvo

It is a great song. And I'm pretty sure Depeche Mode wasn't talking about the Suns or the Cards when they sang "Never Let Me Down".

Steve
 

Mainstreet

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It is a great song. And I'm pretty sure Depeche Mode wasn't talking about the Suns or the Cards when they sang "Never Let Me Down".

Steve

If Sarver had only made the right moves the Suns could have had it all.

Now I hear the song "Rolling in the Deep" by Adele playing in my head. Needless to say another great song. Sooner or later I'm sure I will get to Amy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JYe3Q9mKsc
 
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Ronin

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Today I forgot who the 2011 #1 nba draft pick was...had to to google it.
Kyle Irving
.
I've totally lost interest...
 

Griffin

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I was counting on the Arizona Cardinals to help ease the pain during the NBA lockout. Wrong. It's just plain wrong... the Cardinals and the Suns.
Well at least you guys have a win this season. I'm a Dolphins fan...
 

AzStevenCal

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If Sarver had only made the right moves the Suns could have had it all.

Now I hear the song "Rolling in the Deep" by Adele playing in my head. Needless to say another great song. Sooner or later I'm sure I will get to Amy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JYe3Q9mKsc

Well, this team could definitely use a "Spark". Or "We Could Wish For Something More".

Steve
 

Ronin

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I just heard Stephen A Smith (on espn first take) say that there is a rift between Derek Fisher and Billy hunter now? what a mess...
 

boisesuns

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Sportscenter was showing highlights of last years NBA opening night. kind of funny.

Even if the NBA does reach a deal, I think they've lost a lot of fans over this. I'm not totally in the "Lost" category, but i'm not going out of my way to watch a game anymore, or devote a ton of time an energy to the NBA. Especially with other sports in full swing, i'm sure the NBA will not fare so well if it can come back.
 

boisesuns

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I just heard Stephen A Smith (on espn first take) say that there is a rift between Derek Fisher and Billy hunter now? what a mess...

Fisher better take charge and not flop on this one!
 

crisper57

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I gotta think they have to be getting close to calling it quits. If they miss Christmas Day, there will be no season.

(Although I wouldn't put it past Stern to try and save the post season)
 

Mainstreet

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Even if the NBA does reach a deal, I think they've lost a lot of fans over this. I'm not totally in the "Lost" category, but i'm not going out of my way to watch a game anymore, or devote a ton of time an energy to the NBA. Especially with other sports in full swing, i'm sure the NBA will not fare so well if it can come back.

Excellent point. A lot of NBA fans are fair weather fans at most. They want entertainment... out of sight, out of mind types. None of the sports fans I've talked to outside this board have even mentioned the NBA or the lockout.
 

Griffin

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but the players stand to lose around $2B in salaries if the entire 2011/2012 season is lost. And if they agree to a 50/50 split right now, they will lose far less than that over the course of the new CBA. So from the players standpoint, losing the whole season makes no financial sense at all, and they are much better off taking the 50/50 split right now than to wait and hope the offer improves. Because if the whole season is lost, even if the NBA were to up its offer to 52% before the 2012/2013 season (which it almost certainly wouldn't, since the league is losing money too if the season is lost) the players would still lose more money than if they take the 50/50 now and salvage the season. So the question is, how long can the players hold out before it no longer makes any sense financially for them to do so?
 

carey

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It never made any sense to hold out once 50-50 was offered. It's clear there aren't enough owners willing to go beyond that. It's nice that the players are putting up a good fight. I'm sure they're betting on public perception shifting their way as more games are lost. They probably also feel that the owners won't want to risk damaging the NBA "brand" if a season is cancelled, but it's pretty apparent that the owners don't care about that.
 

Cheesebeef

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Well at least you guys have a win this season. I'm a Dolphins fan...

dude, I'd MUCH rather be you. At least for your horrific season you might come out of it with Andrew Luck! We'll come out of it with another OT that will probably be a bust!
 

Mainstreet

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It never made any sense to hold out once 50-50 was offered. It's clear there aren't enough owners willing to go beyond that. It's nice that the players are putting up a good fight. I'm sure they're betting on public perception shifting their way as more games are lost. They probably also feel that the owners won't want to risk damaging the NBA "brand" if a season is cancelled, but it's pretty apparent that the owners don't care about that.

Going from memory the union contends it is not really a 50/50 split as it does not include other income the NBA receives. I can't remember the details but a 50/50 split is not really an even split of the income the league receives. However, I don't know how long the players can hold out before they break.
 

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