Here's your Suns first round pick in 2005 draft...

[Cheesebeef]

And LaFrenz would be good in our system, too.

good at WHAT? Helping us out defensively - you know - our biggest area of concern?

I don't think so.

 

[overseascardfan]

size? Position?

David Lee
PF 6'9 240
PPG: 13.6
RPG: 9.0
APG: 2.2
SPG: 1.1

One of the top big men in the SEC. Great leaping ability. I believe he won the McDonald's All American Slam Dunk Contest as a HS senior. P.S. He's "caucasion".

 

[cepstrum]

that's great an all - but isn't this team deficient in DEFENSIVE REBOUNDING? Again - another guy who loves playing O, but apparently not D - sounds like a big white stiff, who shot will get packed repeatedly by Duncan on the Offensive end.

It boggles my mind that you can ***** about him without seeing him play (as stated in your earlier post). Go watch some game film and form your own opinion based on his play and not on the fact that he is white.

 

[Joe Mama]

label me a racist or whatever you want - but if this team take a Big White Stiff I will throw up. Nothing like a Big White to help cement your already porous defense!

I haven't seen Lee play enough to speak of his defense, but I can tell you that he is far from a stiff. He's probably one of the more athletic 4/5's in the draft. That said, there are several power forward/center prospects I would probably be happier with at #21. I'm not sure who will be available though.

Joe Mama

 

[Cheesebeef]

It boggles my mind that you can ***** about him without seeing him play (as stated in your earlier post). Go watch some game film and form your own opinion based on his play and not on the fact that he is white.

I;'m basing it on what YOU GUYS ARE TELLING ME! Good lord - someone lists off his skills - defensive rebounding/defense NOT being one of them and then he's comapred to Madsen and Raef. It just lends even more credence to my opinion of him.

I don't need to see game film of a 6'9 white guy with offensive skills - you want him - fine - I'll puke if we take him - that's my perogotive and based on the comparisons I've seen and based on the fact that guys who come in with his type of skills, performance in college and physical make-up have all been soft ******* in the NBA, I'd say the evidence leans in my favor that he'll be exactly what I think he is - even without seeing him play - a soft white stiff.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

It boggles my mind that you can ***** about him without seeing him play (as stated in your earlier post). Go watch some game film and form your own opinion based on his play and not on the fact that he is white.

Have you seen him play? He was a career underachiver who was constantly overshadowed during his entire tenure in Gainseville by Matt Walsh, Anthony Roberson, and Matt Bonner on decent Florida squads.

 

[Cheesebeef]

personally - I think some people also tend to completely overrated white guys - evidenced by ideas like "Vroman will be a contributor to this team!" "I can't believe they won't give Big Jake time!" "How the hell can they get rid of Lampe!" Do you know how RIDICULOUS those statements were and still are?

People want to believe in the big white stiff - maybe a kind of reverse racism - the belief in the Great White Hope - personally, I don't buy it - I have to see it on the NBA level to believe it.

 

[Mulli]

I miss Robert Archibald.

 

[Cheesebeef]

ah! There nothing like a debate started with "a big white stiff" comment!

Your welcome folks for the next couple hours of entertainment!

 

[Kolo]

a soft white stiff.

I'm not sure that's possible.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm not sure that's possible.

 

[corrado]

Amen Cepstrum

It never ceases to amaze me that people can continue to sterotype players based on black or white without taking the time to view some tape of the player in question.

I'm the first one to admit that at Florida he didn't live up to his advanced billing but time and time again that has happened with players who had more success in the NBA style of play then the style of play they were forced to play in college.

Just for someone to remark that if he was that good how is he going to be there at 21 is an indication that the person hasn't really followed the dynamics of this particular draft.

The Suns want someone who can run the court well, play physical get some rebounds and play sound fundamental defense and at 21 I think this guy can to do. He spent 4 years at Florida and therefore has some good experience.

I don't know for sure if the Suns are serious about this guy. All I know is that he fits what I think they are looking for in a PF and he had a very good workout in Phoenix.

 

[overseascardfan]

Think Nick Collison only much worse.

I was just thinking he reminds me of Collison. I don't know how good defensively he is but I thought he had a good career at Florida. Bonner and Haslem came out of Florida, maybe he could come off the bench for us when either SAR or Marshall needs a break.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It never ceases to amaze me that people can continue to sterotype players based on black or white without taking the time to view some tape of the player in question.

I'm the first one to admit that at Florida he didn't live up to his advanced billing but time and time again that has happened with players who had more success in the NBA style of play then the style of play they were forced to play in college.

Just for someone to remark that if he was that good how is he going to be there at 21 is an indication that the person hasn't really followed the dynamics of this particular draft.

The Suns want someone who can run the court well, play physical get some rebounds and play sound fundamental defense and at 21 I think this guy can to do. He spent 4 years at Florida and therefore has some good experience.

I don't know for sure if the Suns are serious about this guy. All I know is that he fits what I think they are looking for in a PF and he had a very good workout in Phoenix.

You give me evidence of a good White power player in the NBA on a title contender and I'll shut up. SA got any? No - they guy that they signed to replace David Robinson is where? Oh yeah - FIRMLY PLANTED ON THE BENCH. What about that big Euro who got taken with the 2nd pick in two years ago draft for the Pistons? Oh yeah - he's the human victory cigar. How about that KVH on Dallas Bench - a key contributor for that team - oh yeah - that makes my point for me.

It's not a stereotype if it's true. Sometimes the truth hurts - especially to us White Guys - but it's still the truth.

 

[myrondizzo]

-Will have a much better career in the NBA than in college. Has very good athletic ability, great footwork, can run the floor, can rebound and play defense. Needs to improve his perimeter game but this guy has played himself into the first round.

Also unlike most players who had real good workouts (including his workout with the Suns) was willing to put it all on the line going to the Chicago camp where most guys would have rested on their laurels.

so if you are going off what other people are saying and they say he can play D why do you leave that part out?

 

[Joe Mama]

personally - I think some people also tend to completely overrated white guys - evidenced by ideas like "Vroman will be a contributor to this team!" "I can't believe they won't give Big Jake time!" "How the hell can they get rid of Lampe!" Do you know how RIDICULOUS those statements were and still are?

People want to believe in the big white stiff - maybe a kind of reverse racism - the belief in the Great White Hope - personally, I don't buy it - I have to see it on the NBA level to believe it.

okay cheese, you've completely lost touch with reality here. Nobody, and I mean nobody around here thought Jackson Vroman was going to be a contributor because he was white. You know as well as I do that being white works against most basketball players when they are being evaluated. That is, at least, true for the players that are actually supposed to contribute. I do think there might be some truth to the argument that some teams like to put a bunch of white guys at the end of the bench. That certainly has looked like the case with the Phoenix Suns over the last 10-15 years. but that's another argument altogether.

You might not like guys like Mark Madsen were Najera, but they would have helped this year's team, especially in the playoffs. I sure hope the Phoenix Suns hit a home run with the #21 pick. That would be great. I'm not going to be disappointed if they find a player who turns into a decent role player though.

BTW... Raef LaFrentz? I definitely think Raef LaFrentz is definitely overpaid, but if the Phoenix Suns could find a player of his caliber at #21 that WOULD be a home run.

Joe Mama

 

[cepstrum]

Here are some descriptions of his games at the Chicago camp. The first is a general description of how he did and the others are individual performances. He faired pretty well there. I dont know if the suns have serious interest in him but I trust their judgement for the most part.


David Lee: An outstanding effort has launched serious first-round chatter for Lee, who starred in Chicago with fantastic defense and a solid outing every time.

David Lee: 20 points 8/10 shooting, 7 rebounds, 2 assists – The top performance of the day belonged to David Lee without a doubt. Lee showed off his entire arsenal of skills Friday for every minute that he was on the court, making unbelievable passes, taking the ball strong off the dribble right at the hoop with his quickness, running the floor like a mad man and rebounding in traffic like a pro. He showed great footwork in the paint to back his man down and score with a finesse move and finish, and came up with a number of emphatic dunks after moving off the ball intelligently. Lee then proceeded to tear the scouting report to shreds by nailing a jumper from mid-range and then taking a rebound coast to coast for a one-handed dunk. It's debatable whether there is anything more that he could have done to impress the scouts in the stands. This is the David Lee that everyone was expecting to see when he accepted his invite to Chicago. He came through in a big way for himself, and probably solidified himself a spot in the first round in the process.

David Lee: 8 points, 2/2 shooting, 2 rebounds – It was a bit of a disappointing day for David Lee, who might be regretting his decision to attend the camp considering the way it has panned out so far. He isn't getting his touches on the offensive end, despite shooting 100 percent from the field and the free-throw line, and ended up looking very out of it mentally. He still has time to put in a highlight performance, but he'll have to do a much better job of demanding the ball down low and especially going after every single rebound that is even remotely in his area. He was slowed Thursday by a minor knee injury that kept him out of the combines, so that might have had at least something to do with that.


David Lee: 12 points, 4/7 shooting, 5 rebounds – Lee had a quiet but effective showing in his first game at Chicago – especially in the second half. He displayed some unique finesse-type skills for a power forward. He shows dynamite quickness, smooth passing, and soft touch around the basket. While Lee probably didn’t dominate the way a player of his billing might be expected to at this camp, this probably had more to do with his lack of touches and the style of play than anything that would reflect poorly on Lee. We feel that more impressive statistical performances could be in store for David Lee. One play of note took place in the 2-on-2 drills, where he put down a spectacular reverse dunk from the baseline over Ellis Myles.

David Lee: Was played completely out of position at the small forward spot on the wing, but still managed to do a decent job regardless. Impressed with his hustle, rebounding, unselfishness and passing ability. Lee had a great putback to show off his athleticism and hit a nice 15-footer to boot. Preferred to make the extra pass on the fast break to get his teammates involved rather than try to do everything himself.

 

[corrado]

Cheesebeef

Yea, I guess your right. There will never ever be a good white power player in the NBA.

 

[Cheesebeef]

so if you are going off what other people are saying and they say he can play D why do you leave that part out?

because I don't believe it. Same people said the same crap about other white stiffs who turned out to be - what do you know - WHITE STIFFS.

Sorry - but you can say he plays like Madsen or Raef and then say he plays good defense.

 

[Kolo]

It's not a stereotype if it's true. Sometimes the truth hurts - especially to us White Guys - but it's still the truth.

I'm 6'1-1/2", and I almost dunked a tennis ball once when I was 18--so enough with the stereotyping.

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

I can't go that far and say a white power player will never play a key role on a title contender. The Kings were definitely a contender a few years ago with Vlade as their center. The Bulls had all those white centers in the 90s and won championships.

The fact remains that in college this guy was a poor man's Nick Collison. And since Nick Collison couldn't make the jump to the NBA I'm guessing this guy won't be able to either.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Yea, I guess your right. There will never ever be a good white power player in the NBA.

can you show me a couple playing in the NBA right now? It would go a long way in shutting me up and helping your argument.

 

[Mulli]

can you show me a couple playing in the NBA right now? It would go a long way in shutting me up and helping your argument.

Brad Miller and Chris Mihm? Can we adopt Yao Ming?

 

[Cheesebeef]

I can't go that far and say a white power player will never play a key role on a title contender. The Kings were definitely a contender a few years ago with Vlade as their center. The Bulls had all those white centers in the 90s and won championships.

Vlade was 7'1, 270 and the Kings were a title contender for ONE year - every other year - what was their biggest problem - DEFENSE and it's because they had soft as hell guys up and down the court - Vlade and CWebb being the biggest culprits. And the Bulls had a white center (2nd set title run) - again - a 7'1, 300 pounder who was surrounded by the best defensive team in the league.

What we're talking about here is a 6'9 PF - surrounded by a team that doesn't play ANY defense. That ain't a good combo.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Brad Miller and Chris Mihm? Can we adopt Yao Ming?

Uh - don't we all talk crap about each of those guys because of how soft they are?