Kyler Murray Debate Thread

[BritCard]

I'm still in. Just on the down low. There's no point to getting in front of the freight train of anti-Murray sentiment on the board. Just ducking my head in for a moment to declare my allegiance.

That K1 choked on Sunday doesn't mean for certain he won't be successful here in ARZ. He still has next year. There's a non-zero chance he comes back better in 2025, despite any assertions to the contrary.

But, by all means, don't let me stop the funeral procession for Murray's tenure as the Cardinals' QB1.

Please continue with your eulogies and obituaries.

Come on man, not a "There's always next year post". We've had "Kyler will be better next year" posts every year since 2019.

He is what he is. He's a mid level QB with the talent to be great in spells that is missing something that enables him to be able to apply it consistently.

He regularly gets outplayed by QB's that he is supposed to be more talented than. See Geno Smith.

 

[HoodieBets]

I said it before and I will say it again Jake Plummer had a better career with the cards than Kyler. He won a playoff game which is what matters. They are both sub .500 QBs with the team so what else is there to care about.

 

[Phrazbit]

What are the options if we move on? This does not look like an enticing QB class. If we cut him the dead cap hit chews up the majority of our open cap.

The only free agent QB who might be an upgrade is Sam Darnold and I don't want to be the team that overpays him.

He's maddeningly inconsistent, he can't play effectively with any physical limitation, his pouty sideline face is back in full force... but I think we're locked into another year.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

All during his recovery from his injury there were reports on how he was putting in the physical work and being complemented for it

I praised him for putting in the hard work

I also stated many times that he needed to be working on reading a defense with film and practice and that's the hard work that would make a difference for him

I got questioned about how did I know he wasn't, but stayed strong on my convictions that the mental part would be his key and this was a good time to hone his game

When you have limitations (height) you need to find ways to over come that

Look how much work Warner did and how it showed during the games

He knew where every receiver was supposed to be on every play so when he his first option was covered he knew where and how to throw the progressions

So the question is would this help him in tight games and under pressure?

My answer is yes

Can KM still put it together with him going back to his bad habits?

If he could learn to read the defense better I believe it would help him to be more consistent which is what we all want for him to do

 

[Stout]

1) What does “can’t get it done” mean? I think Kyler can make the NFC Championship game with proper talent around him, and our current cap and draft situation makes that possible. Disappointing he yakked in ANOTHER playoff qualifier, but this team also lags in talent.

All evidence to the contrary. What in the world gives you that belief other than blind hope?

 

[GeorgiaCard88]

I'm still in. Just on the down low. There's no point to getting in front of the freight train of anti-Murray sentiment on the board. Just ducking my head in for a moment to declare my allegiance.

That K1 choked on Sunday doesn't mean for certain he won't be successful here in ARZ. He still has next year. There's a non-zero chance he comes back better in 2025, despite any assertions to the contrary.

But, by all means, don't let me stop the funeral procession for Murray's tenure as the Cardinals' QB1.

Please continue with your eulogies and obituaries.

C'mon crimson, you shouldn't wear white to a funeral.

I hope we move on, but if we don't, here is to hoping you are right

 

[Brian in Mesa]

If Cards draft a QB for the future with a high draft pick how do you think Kyler will react? I don't see it being a positive one.

He'll start by scrubbing his social media...

 

[Chopper0080]

You’re right. I was one of those. I can admit when I’m wrong.

It’s less that and more about the quality of this rookie QB class. The idea of spending a 1st on the 3rd best QB in this draft class is awful to me. Also, I have no idea about the ability of Petzing to develop a QB unlike KOC and SP.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Come on man, not a "There's always next year post". We've had "Kyler will be better next year" posts every year since 2019.

He is what he is. He's a mid level QB with the talent to be great in spells that is missing something that enables him to be able to apply it consistently.

He regularly gets outplayed by QB's that he is supposed to be more talented than. See Geno Smith.

I hear what you're saying.

 

[kerouac9]

If Cards draft a QB for the future with a high draft pick how do you think Kyler will react? I don't see it being a positive one.

If we draft a QBotF high, who really cares how Kyler feels about it?

All evidence to the contrary. What in the world gives you that belief other than blind hope?

Because Brock Purdy and Jimmy Garappolo both started conference championship games

 

[82CardsGrad]

Because Brock Purdy and Jimmy Garappolo both started conference championship games

While clearly much less gifted, physically, I believe a strong case can be made that both Purdy and Jimmy G (particularly Purdy) are, or were in Jimmy G’s case, better “NFL QB’s” than Kyler Murray.
Both put in the time in the film room and as a result, are far more advanced in their ability to make the appropriate pre and post-snap reads than Kyler.
Additionally, both are significantly more capable of operating and executing from the pocket than Kyler.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

While clearly much less gifted, physically, I believe a strong case can be made that both Purdy and Jimmy G (particularly Purdy) are, or were in Jimmy G’s case, better “NFL QB’s” than Kyler Murray.
Both put in the time in the film room and as a result, are far more advanced in their ability to make the appropriate pre and post-snap reads than Kyler.
Additionally, both are significantly more capable of operating and executing from the pocket than Kyler.

I think it is telling that Purdy started 46 games in college and Jimmy G. started 45 games in college.

Kyler started only 17 games in college.

 

[BirdGangThing]

geno smith "managed" that game - did nuthin spectacular - lot of dink and dunk - screens behind los - finding the shallow cushion between secondary and linebackers - no rushing yards - he read the defense - took what it gave him AND PROTECTED THE FOOTBALL

this was the difference in the game - one qb who learned from his mistakes and another still making rookie mistakes in year 5

 

[602 Native]

While clearly much less gifted, physically, I believe a strong case can be made that both Purdy and Jimmy G (particularly Purdy) are, or were in Jimmy G’s case, better “NFL QB’s” than Kyler Murray.
Both put in the time in the film room and as a result, are far more advanced in their ability to make the appropriate pre and post-snap reads than Kyler.
Additionally, both are significantly more capable of operating and executing from the pocket than Kyler.

Laughable

Stacked teams with a great coach.

We saw Jimmy G outside that system and he is now a PEDs user on his way out of the league.

 

[DVontel]

While clearly much less gifted, physically, I believe a strong case can be made that both Purdy and Jimmy G (particularly Purdy) are, or were in Jimmy G’s case, better “NFL QB’s” than Kyler Murray.
Both put in the time in the film room and as a result, are far more advanced in their ability to make the appropriate pre and post-snap reads than Kyler.
Additionally, both are significantly more capable of operating and executing from the pocket than Kyler.

Jimmy G turned the ball over more times than he had TDs in both of his 3 game playoff-runs.

 

[DVontel]

Ya’ll are way too damn grown to continue to throw the QBWINZZZZZZ in peoples’ faces without context.

 

[DVontel]

I need Kyler in another organization so I can stop seeing nonsensical posting like that.

 

[WisconsinCard]

All during his recovery from his injury there were reports on how he was putting in the physical work and being complemented for it

I praised him for putting in the hard work

I also stated many times that he needed to be working on reading a defense with film and practice and that's the hard work that would make a difference for him

I got questioned about how did I know he wasn't, but stayed strong on my convictions that the mental part would be his key and this was a good time to hone his game

When you have limitations (height) you need to find ways to over come that

Look how much work Warner did and how it showed during the games

He knew where every receiver was supposed to be on every play so when he his first option was covered he knew where and how to throw the progressions

So the question is would this help him in tight games and under pressure?

My answer is yes

Can KM still put it together with him going back to his bad habits?

If he could learn to read the defense better I believe it would help him to be more consistent which is what we all want for him to do

My thoughts are he can read a defense somewhat, he just can't process the information quick enough. It's always been the the divider between talented QBs and great QBs.

 

[BirdGangThing]

My thoughts are he can read a defense somewhat, he just can't process the information quick enough. It's always been the the divider between talented QBs and great QBs.

on the first drive we saw what i believed to be an an audible resulting in the td - i think @Harry disagreed but i recall kyler seeing the seahawks defense and changing the play at the line - i could be wrong and it's probably online somewhere but my point is he's able to recognize and compute - especially against a team he faced just 13 days prior

but it's the live action - there's two kyler murrays imo - the unstoppable and the easily stoppable and it all has to do with his comfort level - when he plays scared that's mistakes are made - but that's supposed to somewhat go away after idk? 5 or 6 years id hope? and when did he become so afraid to run with the freakin pigskin

 

[ASUCHRIS]

He says he loves this scheme and has spoken enthusiastically about it many times. If he can't perform in a scheme he loves with coaches that strongly believe in him and have done everything they can for him to succeed, I just don't see how he might work elsewhere.

Drop him into a team with the best O line in the league and maybe, but what are the odds of that?

When the O-line was playing well, both in terms of protecting Kyler and opening up holes in the running game, Kyler was a much better performer. A shaky line with Kyler is a bad combination - his #'s under pressure of late have been a disaster.

 

[Cheesebeef]

When the O-line was playing well, both in terms of protecting Kyler and opening up holes in the running game, Kyler was a much better performer. A shaky line with Kyler is a bad combination - his #'s under pressure of late have been a disaster.

And therein lies the rub… Kyler needs pretty much perfect conditions to be successful and even when he is… it’s only against bad teams.

Every good QB has to deal with adversity against good teams and overcome them. Mid QBs can’t. And that’s what separates the “men from the boys” at the position in the league.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

And therein lies the rub… Kyler needs pretty much perfect conditions to be successful and even when he is… it’s only against bad teams.

Every good QB has to deal with adversity against good teams and overcome them. Mid QBs can’t. And that’s what separates the “men from the boys” at the position in the league.

Yeah, only being good when everything is perfect, and never stepping up in one big game in 6 years is not a great formula for success.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Jimmy G turned the ball over more times than he had TDs in both of his 3 game playoff-runs.

Kyler has 0 TD's and 2 INT's, along with a full-on quit, in post-season play...

 

[82CardsGrad]

I need Kyler in another organization so I can stop seeing nonsensical posting like that.

All Cards fans need Kyler in another organization!

 

[DVontel]

Kyler has 0 TD's and 2 INT's, along with a full-on quit, in post-season play...

My bad. I overrate reading comprehension from some others around here too much. That’s on me.