Kyler Murray Debate Thread

[daves]

The guy that computed these stats is the same guy that said MHJ dropped one ball all year.

I think most of MHJ's drops are technically marked as pass breakups for the stat counters. But anyone who watched Larry Fitzgerald play knows those breakups were on Marv.

Has Odegard ever stated the source of his "one drop" stat for Harrison?

As far as I can tell, it's not a stat that's officially tracked by the NFL.

I've only found three sources that include drops among receiver stats, and none mentions where they get their stats:

Pro Football Reference shows 5 drops for Harrison.
FantasyPros also shows 5 drops.
PlayerProfiler.com (never heard of them before) shows 3 drops for Harrison.
Pro Football Focus also seems to track drops, but that column seems to be behind a paywall.

Certainly drops are a subjective stat, but I haven't found any sites that claim Harrison only had one drop, and my eyes tell me there were about 5 obvious and egregious ones.

He did seem to improve greatly in that department in the second half of the season, and ended up fairly far down the list in terms of drop % for the season.

 

[602 Native]

Apparently we are trading K1 to the Jets.

Proabably the same reporters that said he would sit out the 2023 season.

K1 is so terrible he is always talked about as being traded.

Don't these reporters know he is too short to play QB at a high level in the NFL.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

Apparently we are trading K1 to the Jets.

Proabably the same reporters that said he would sit out the 2023 season.

K1 is so terrible he is always talked about as being traded.

Don't these reporters know he is too short to play QB at a high level in the NFL.

If we can get a good trade package from the Jets I'd be very happy. You just can't expect a player to change significantly in year 7.

 

[Solar7]

Apparently we are trading K1 to the Jets.

Proabably the same reporters that said he would sit out the 2023 season.

K1 is so terrible he is always talked about as being traded.

Don't these reporters know he is too short to play QB at a high level in the NFL.

It's not unrealistic to have another team out there with the hubris to think they can "fix" Kyler, or put more around him depending on where their franchise currently is, or their coaching staff. Kyler has tantalizing physical traits... but many of us (myself included) believe he is what is he is, at least on this team.

Like ASUCHRIS said, I'd take a nice haul for him in a heartbeat, since we basically know we've got a guy whose best work is going to be getting us to around .500.

 

[BirdGangThing]

for quinnen williams and the 7th pick in this draft i'd giftwrap murray myself

 

[SoonerLou]

Apparently we are trading K1 to the Jets.

Proabably the same reporters that said he would sit out the 2023 season.

K1 is so terrible he is always talked about as being traded.

Don't these reporters know he is too short to play QB at a high level in the NFL.

I think him and the Cards need a fresh start. Not sure its happening here.

 

[BritCard]

Apparently we are trading K1 to the Jets.

Proabably the same reporters that said he would sit out the 2023 season.

K1 is so terrible he is always talked about as being traded.

Don't these reporters know he is too short to play QB at a high level in the NFL.

Jeez man you got my hopes up with line 1 then.

 

[602 Native]

If we can get a good trade package from the Jets I'd be very happy. You just can't expect a player to change significantly in year 7.

And yet people were willing to trade for Sam Darnold.

The team needs to get better and K1 should get better as well.

 

[602 Native]

I think him and the Cards need a fresh start. Not sure its happening here.

K1 would get a fresh start if he were traded.

History has shown we will still be a loser organization over the long term.

 

[Cheesebeef]

K1 would get a fresh start if he were traded.

History has shown we will still be a loser organization over the long term.

History has shown they’ve been losers with Kyler as well so what’s the difference?

 

[Brian in Mesa]

for quinnen williams and the 7th pick in this draft i'd giftwrap murray myself

Wouldn't even take a whole roll of wrapping paper.

 

[BirdGangThing]

Wouldn't even take a whole roll of wrapping paper.

i'd drive him to jersey too

 

[602 Native]

History has shown they’ve been losers with Kyler as well so what’s the difference?

K1 has shown he can get us to the playoffs which the Az Cards have only done 6 times ever.
He has also won consistently at every level except here.

I will always blame the Cards for a poor organization over a player.

The players change but the organization continues to be a bottom feeder.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

K1 has shown he can get us to the playoffs which the Az Cards have only done 6 times ever.
He has also won consistently at every level except here.

I will always blame the Cards for a poor organization over a player.

The players change but the organization continues to be a bottom feeder.

One time in six years, and his "performance" in the playoff game was about as embarrassing as any of us have ever seen in the playoffs, period.

Did you hear what a great high school player he was though?

 

[Stout]

K1 has shown he can get us to the playoffs which the Az Cards have only done 6 times ever.
He has also won consistently at every level except here.

I will always blame the Cards for a poor organization over a player.

The players change but the organization continues to be a bottom feeder.

No, he hasn't. He has shown his team can back into the playoffs while he chokes like a baby eating steak. Once.

 

[PDXChris]

If we can get a good trade package from the Jets I'd be very happy. You just can't expect a player to change significantly in year 7.

Not saying he will, but it's not unheard up. Improve the OL and let's see what happens. If we give him a better OL and see no improvement, we move on!


The below list omitted Warner, I'm assuming because he was in the AFL and working in isle 7.

A handful of these guys played in a SB too!

Kurt Warner - Broke out in year 7

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[kerouac9]

K1 has shown he can get us to the playoffs which the Az Cards have only done 6 times ever.
He has also won consistently at every level except here.

Bruh remember when he won the Orange Bowl 34-45?

 

[kerouac9]

Not saying he will, but it's not unheard up. Improve the OL and let's see what happens. If we give him a better OL and see no improvement, we move on!


The below list omitted Warner, I'm assuming because he was in the AFL and working in isle 7.

A handful of these guys played in a SB too!

Kurt Warner - Broke out in year 7

You must be registered for see images attach

I mean I get the narrative, but honestly I think starts is a better metric. Filter that by when the player reached 16 starts and I bet you screen out a lot of names.

Also this list is pretty lame. David Garrard went 9-3 his seventh season and was 20-26 the rest of the way.

 

[Cheesebeef]

lol... why did I jump back into this stupid, not to mention, pretty settled discussion?

 

[PDXChris]

I mean I get the narrative, but honestly I think starts is a better metric. Filter that by when the player reached 16 starts and I bet you screen out a lot of names.

Also this list is pretty lame. David Garrard went 9-3 his seventh season and was 20-26 the rest of the way.

That is a good point. Most of those guys didn't start much in the NFL prior. And Kyler in his worst season, is still probably better than a lot of those guys.

On a side note, Kyler in the AFL would be fun!

 

[Stout]

lol... why did I jump back into this stupid, not to mention, pretty settled discussion?

You must be registered for see images attach

 

[BirdGangThing]

have we compared him to doug flutie yet?

 

[oaken1]

Not saying he will, but it's not unheard up. Improve the OL and let's see what happens. If we give him a better OL and see no improvement, we move on!


The below list omitted Warner, I'm assuming because he was in the AFL and working in isle 7.

A handful of these guys played in a SB too!

Kurt Warner - Broke out in year 7

You must be registered for see images attach

Yeah, it even took super bowl winning QB Trent Dilfer a strong team around him before he could win a championship

 

[DVontel]

This rivalry is with a break in between is hilarious

602 vs K9, Stout, Cheese, & Chris.

I’m entertained.

Let’s do it again next month.

 

[BritCard]

I wanted to expand on the discussion I had elsewhere with @Stout and others about Kyler being the dominant cause of our defeats and him not being let down by the roster.

In our defeats last year (in order) these were Kylers passer ratings,

Bills 91.1
Lions 76.5
Commies 104.7 (but only 22 attempts for 142 yards)
GB 97.7
Sea 77
Minny 72.5
Sea 80.9
Car 77.9
Rams 76.8

You can see a clear difference there between pre bye week and post bye week, although in the early season he never attempted more than 34 passes in any defeat. Post season he had games with 48, 45, 38 and 37, the more he passed the worse his rating was.

Compare that to Joe Burrow in his defeats

NWE 86
Kan 103.7
Commies 127.5
Bal 137
Eagles 84.7
Bal 108.3
LAC 98.4
PIT 112.7

Burrow had a higher passer rating in losses than Kyler had in wins. That's a guy that was let down by his team. Burrow made 121 more attempts than Kyler too.

If we have Love, Tua, Herbert, Darnold etc at QB we win the division. I'm sure of it. We win in Minny, we beat the Seahawks in Seattle and we beat the Rams in LA. We surely win the Panthers game too but it's not needed, with those 3 we finish with 10 wins and box out the Chicks and Rams with the 2 wins.