Phoenix, Seattle Closing in on Deal?

[F-Dog]

I'd be shocked if anyone gives Lewis MAX money like Marion's contract. Especially since the KNicks won't have any cap room.

Doesn't matter. Once he opts out, the Suns will have to pay significantly more than any other team to keep him. Remember the Joe Johnson negotiations?


If the Sonics include Fortson for salary-matching purposes, I doubt he'll even make it into the building--the Suns will tell him to stay home, like Chicago did with TT.

If the Suns need to add a salary, and it's not LB (which it shouldn't be), it'll probably be James Jones.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Lewis is not as good as Marion period. Not to mention he does not rebound or defend very well. So the two things the Suns need more of your subtracting from the team.

You're making this out to seem like Lewis is gonna come in and play with Bell, Nash, Diaw and TT - when HE WON'T BE. You want rebounding and defense, well, we're adding to the lineup a guy named Kurt Thomas - you know, the guy who anchored our D last year and Amare - who's a freaking monster. There's your reboundign and defense.

As far as losing defense with Marion? Yeah, I'll lose the kind of Defense that lets Dirk, Lamar Odom, Elton Brand and even Josh Howard (you know - a small forward) go nuts on them repeatedly. Especially when you consider the offense we'll be getting from Lewis who won't be abel to be shut down by the likes of Jason Terry.

If Amare's healthy and we make this deal, no one can stop us next year - not even the Spurs who we still haven't shown we can beat. If Marion's there and Amare's healthy, do we really want to have to pray to the heaven's the for some odd reason he doens't go into a complete shell and score 7 points a game against them again? I don't think so.

 

[Covert Rain]

The Suns would have two first round picks this year and two next year. I would want to keep Lewis but he could be a transition player in a worse case scenario. It might also mean the Suns get to draft the player they really want in this year's draft (at #10).

I think the Suns might have to move Marion next year because of cap implications anyway.

Don't get me wrong, I definitely a Marion fan, but this trade proposal might be as close to fair value the Suns will get for Marion and prepare for the future.

OK, but your assuming any of those players pan out. What if they don't? Your still trading him away for draft picks. Not to mention that if none of them pan out, you save cap space but might not end up with any players that help you down the line if they are busts.

Best case scenario you get a rent a player. The Suns are not going to sind him to a contract that is anywhere near as big as another team will pay.

Also, if Amare and Marion were not enough last year, what makes you think Amare and Kurth will be enough? I think we go with Amare, Marion and Kurt. That to me is unstoppable.

 

[F-Dog]

No thanks. JC would never have made this deal to save money.

You really believe that, after the Tom Gugliotta-to-Utah debacle?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Doesn't matter. Once he opts out, the Suns will have to pay significantly more than any other team to keep him. Remember the Joe Johnson negotiations?


If the Sonics include Fortson for salary-matching purposes, I doubt he'll even make it into the building--the Suns will tell him to stay home, like Chicago did with TT.

If the Suns need to add a salary, and it's not LB (which it shouldn't be), it'll probably be James Jones.

that's probably true in regards to the first thing, but hopefully Lewis won't be the little bitch JJ was and hopefully Sraver will have learned his lesson on low-balling players.

As far as the rest of your post - I totally agree. LB shouldn't be part of this deal. Like you said, shed Jr. on them. LB is worth MUCH more in this type of deal.

 

[scoutmasterdave]

I suppose I'll chime in here. I'm cool with Marion + 27 for Lewis + 10, for a lot of reasons. Lewis would be unbelievable in this offense. We give up a little rebounding and D, but we get a great offensive player who can take over a game. If Barbs in included, we better get Ridnour back, which of course isn't going to happen. Fortson can kiss my a**.

 

[Covert Rain]

You really believe that, after the Tom Gugliotta-to-Utah debacle?

Yes because those trades are not even comparible. Marion is an All Star and TG had nothing left. Trading dead weight to save cap space is much different then trading away the best small forward to save space.

 

[Gaddabout]

I suppose I'll chime in here. I'm cool with Marion + 27 for Lewis + 10, for a lot of reasons. Lewis would be unbelievable in this offense. We give up a little rebounding and D, but we get a great offensive player who can take over a game. If Barbs in included, we better get Ridnour back, which of course isn't going to happen. Fortson can kiss my a**.

It has to be more than Marion/pick - Lewis/pick, otherwise it doesn't work under the salary cap.

 

[JCSunsfan]

Ok, so if this deal goes down our starting front line is,

KT
Amare
Boris

Boris is a great defender--potentially better than Shawn, although he might struggle with smaller, quicker Sf's.

KT is a quality defender against most pf's or centers. He might have some problems with more mobile ones.

Rebounding. Boris and Amare would have to step up.

Lewis can come off the bench, or he can start at the 2 (he's done that before) if Raja has a problem with injury (or suspension).

Seems to me that the thing we would lose most is speed. Shawn flies. And he never gets tired. I don't know what Lewis' stamina is like. I do know that we were a much slower team with KT in the lineup.

 

[Covert Rain]

Ok, so if this deal goes down our starting front line is,

KT
Amare
Boris

Boris is a great defender--potentially better than Shawn, although he might struggle with smaller, quicker Sf's.

KT is a quality defender against most pf's or centers. He might have some problems with more mobile ones.

Rebounding. Boris and Amare would have to step up.

Lewis can come off the bench, or he can start at the 2 (he's done that before) if Raja has a problem with injury (or suspension).

Seems to me that the thing we would lose most is speed. Shawn flies. And he never gets tired. I don't know what Lewis' stamina is like. I do know that we were a much slower team with KT in the lineup.

Borris is a better defender?!?!?!?!?!?! We we watching the same guys on the court? I am not going to touch that.

 

[slinslin]

Lewis will not come off the bench! He is an allstar.

 

[overseascardfan]

What about Lewis, Collison, and the #10 for just Marion and Barbosa. We have 3 picks to get I hope in this order Armstrong unless Williams is available, Jordan Farmar or Sergio Rodriguez, and either Hassan Adams or Daniel Gibson.

06-07
C- KT/Armstrong
PF- Amare/Collison
SF- Lewis/Diaw/JJ
SG- Bell/Adams or Gibson
PG- Nash/Farmar or Rodriguez

We would still have 4 roster spots: sign TT, add another vet w/ MLE or LLE, Burke since used his player option, and Skita.

 

[F-Dog]

Trading two first-round picks to save cap space is much different then trading away the best small forward to save space.

Fixed that for you.


Oh, and Kurt Thomas is coming off the bench next year, whether this trade happens or not (as long as he's still in Phoenix). His body couldn't handle the minutes he played this year, and Rashard Lewis will definitely be starting if the Suns trade Marion for him.

 

[SunsTzu]

You really believe that, after the Tom Gugliotta-to-Utah debacle?

Most pathetic money grab in Arizona sports history.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think Boris moves to the Bench and the starting line-up is:

KT
Amare
Lewis

That way you have your playmaker coming on the floor with the second unit and for most of the game, more than likely, you'd have Amare, Boris and Lewis all out there together. That team wouldn't be any worse rebounding than the Amare, Matrix, Q lineup, but it wouldn't struggle the same way on offense against SA with Marion going AWOL.

I hpe you guys don't think SA is done - they're still the standard bearer for the West IMO. The Mavs are still below both us and the Spurs if Amare's healthy. We'v eproven we can beat them, but we haven't proven squat against SA. We have to be able to beat both of them, something I don't think is possible with Shawn on the roster.

 

[sunsfn]

If the suns trade for Lewis, he will start over Boris.
And, Boris is going to be a heck of a player, but he is not a better defender than Marion..........no way!

 

[scoutmasterdave]

It has to be more than Marion/pick - Lewis/pick, otherwise it doesn't work under the salary cap.

Sure. There's obviously more to it - I just don't want Barbosa involved unless we get something decent in return.

Marion + Barbosa + 27 for Lewis + Earl Watson + 10 works under the cap - I'd do that.

 

[Covert Rain]

Fixed that for you.


Oh, and Kurt Thomas is coming off the bench next year, whether this trade happens or not (as long as he's still in Phoenix). His body couldn't handle the minutes he played this year, and Rashard Lewis will definitely be starting if the Suns trade Marion for him.

No actually you didn't because its a BIG if that those draft picks will amount to anything let alone contribute anytime soon.

So again, trading away a player who has nothing left in TG is not comparible to a Marion trade.

Also, don't be 2 sure that Kurt won't be starting. We needed more defense and rebounding in the starting lineup not less. Kurt does both better then Diaw.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Borris is a better defender?!?!?!?!?!?! We we watching the same guys on the court? I am not going to touch that.

Let me ask you this - did Shawn defend Odom well who went off for 20+ and near triple doubles every game? Or Brand who went off for 31 and 60% shooting? Or Dirk who went off against him? Or when switched on to Josh Howard, Howard had 1/5 of ALL his 20 points game for the season and playoffs?

Shawn Marion is the most overrated defender on this board. Just cause he guards guys bigegr than him, doesn't mean he does a good job of it. Anyone remember Manu abusing him last year? The beat goes on and on and on....

 

[Mainstreet]

OK, but your assuming any of those players pan out. What if they don't? Your still trading him away for draft picks. Not to mention that if none of them pan out, you save cap space but might not end up with any players that help you down the line if they are busts.

Best case scenario you get a rent a player. The Suns are not going to sind him to a contract that is anywhere near as big as another team will pay.

Also, if Amare and Marion were not enough last year, what makes you think Amare and Kurth will be enough? I think we go with Amare, Marion and Kurt. That to me is unstoppable.

Everything in life is a gamble. I think the Suns will do this deal if they think they can keep Lewis and the #10 is very attractive to Phoenix. Perhaps Lewis will agree to waive his opt out or Phoenix is receptive to giving him a near max contract next summer.

I think the worse case scenario is that the Joe Johnson situation is played out again. If the Suns like Lewis couldn't they match any offers? And if they like him I think they will want to keep him.

Maybe someone knows how Lewis' opt out works? Can it be matched by the Suns?

 

[slinslin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ce1-ax5TRdA&search=Rashard Lewis

Rashard Lewis MIx

 

[SunsTzu]

I'd prefer the line-up cheese posted and while he wouln't start I think Diaw would be at or near the top in mpg. Howerever I'm fairly certain D'Antoni will start:

5 Amare
4 Diaw
3 Lewis

I'm not sure if he still feels that way but I recall during the season that he feels Diaw is a natural 4.

 

[F-Dog]

No actually you didn't because its a BIG if that those draft picks will amount to anything let alone contribute anytime soon.

This is a joke, right? If Sarver had the Suns sell the #21 and #27 picks for cash this year, you'd be fine with that?

 

[Covert Rain]

Let me ask you this - did Shawn defend Odom well who went off for 20+ and near triple doubles every game? Or Brand who went off for 31 and 60% shooting? Or Dirk who went off against him? Or when switched on to Josh Howard, Howard had 1/5 of ALL his 20 points game for the season and playoffs?

Shawn Marion is the most overrated defender on this board. Just cause he guards guys bigegr than him, doesn't mean he does a good job of it. Anyone remember Manu abusing him last year? The beat goes on and on and on....

First off Shawn Marion was defending out of position most of the season. Considering he wasn't even covering the person he was suppose to for most of the season says alot.

This teams lack of defense came from the fact they had to double team every other player. Meaning leaving your guy. So if he defends nothing but small forwards, you have Kurt clogging up the middle and Amare helping from the weak, this is a different team.

As far as the draft picks go, ofcourse I would prefer they keep them. But factoring Marion into this trade changes everything.

 

[joshstmarie]

Everything in life is a gamble. I think the Suns will do this deal if they think they can keep Lewis and the #10 is very attractive to Phoenix. Perhaps Lewis will agree to waive his opt out or Phoenix is receptive to giving him a near max contract next summer.

I think the worse case scenario is that the Joe Johnson situation is played out again. If the Suns like Lewis couldn't they match any offers? And if they like him I think they will want to keep him.

Maybe someone knows how Lewis' opt out works? Can it be matched by the Suns?

Lewis is going to be looking for max money, dont any of you remember the BS he put seattle through last year about his contract....i think i remember something about him saying he thinks hes better than ray allen and deserves that kind of money..

besides the plan isnt to resign lewis, i can almost gaurantee that..its to get boris and TT locked up...there would be no $$ for him anyways...