devilalum
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If you believed he was a perennial All Star you would.
Suns, Eric Bledsoe Far Apart In Talks
- Thread starter PDXChris
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If you believed he was a perennial All Star you would.
jbeecham
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Hopefully Bledsoe comes to his senses and takes the 4yr/48 million or possibly works out a shorter deal 2yr/24 mil or 3yr/36 mil.
PGs just aren't in high demand in free agency right now (especially not at max money)... most teams either already have an all-star caliber PG (maybe 10-12 teams) or have a young up-an-coming player in the mix (probably another 10-12 teams).... so why would any of those teams be willing to pay out max money to a former backup PG who has never played a full season as a starter and only played 43 games last year because of a 2nd meniscus surgery? Most of the teams that actually need a PG aren't in the playoff picture and Bledsoe wouldn't be enough to get them into the playoffs if he can even stay healthy. On top of that, he's a tweener scoring PG who doesn't get a lot of assists & the Suns played better when Bledsoe was out VS. when Goran was injured (obviously they played best when both were healthy).
This is one of those times that I wish a level-headed person would just talk some sense into Bledsoe. Right now, he's coming off as a greedy selfish player with an over-inflated sense of self-worth with an idoitic agent that has never negotiated an NBA contract. If he's pissed that guys like Gordon Hayward & Chandler Parsons got max offers & he didn't then his agent is to blame & not the Suns... besides both of those guys play a more highly sought after position in the NBA right now.
The whole situation is ridiculous and I'm glad the Suns are approaching it the way that they are. They've offered an unproved player an extremely fair guaranteed contract based off his potential... he hasn't accomplished anything yet... no all-star games, no all-nba teams, only 43 games played at starters minutes, etc. I'd be disappointed in the Suns front office if they eventually cave & give him a max deal.
PGs just aren't in high demand in free agency right now (especially not at max money)... most teams either already have an all-star caliber PG (maybe 10-12 teams) or have a young up-an-coming player in the mix (probably another 10-12 teams).... so why would any of those teams be willing to pay out max money to a former backup PG who has never played a full season as a starter and only played 43 games last year because of a 2nd meniscus surgery? Most of the teams that actually need a PG aren't in the playoff picture and Bledsoe wouldn't be enough to get them into the playoffs if he can even stay healthy. On top of that, he's a tweener scoring PG who doesn't get a lot of assists & the Suns played better when Bledsoe was out VS. when Goran was injured (obviously they played best when both were healthy).
This is one of those times that I wish a level-headed person would just talk some sense into Bledsoe. Right now, he's coming off as a greedy selfish player with an over-inflated sense of self-worth with an idoitic agent that has never negotiated an NBA contract. If he's pissed that guys like Gordon Hayward & Chandler Parsons got max offers & he didn't then his agent is to blame & not the Suns... besides both of those guys play a more highly sought after position in the NBA right now.
The whole situation is ridiculous and I'm glad the Suns are approaching it the way that they are. They've offered an unproved player an extremely fair guaranteed contract based off his potential... he hasn't accomplished anything yet... no all-star games, no all-nba teams, only 43 games played at starters minutes, etc. I'd be disappointed in the Suns front office if they eventually cave & give him a max deal.
Being a huge supporter, are you happy with the Suns' stance on the issue? 4/48 seems fair to me. Or would you bump it up in spite of no other offers?
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No, I wouldn't. Barring injury, I think Bledsoe will be an all star for many years to come and I just wouldn't do it. I was a Harden fan before he went to Houston and I was against the same kind of action then. If he were a transcendent player, of course, but he's not that level. I think you can justify overpaying him but not giving away multiple picks and players too. I'd do the Cleveland deal for Love but they're not going to be overpaying Kevin and he doesn't have the injury history.
Steve
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Absolutely. I see no reason to raise the offer. Now, if Paul comes in and negotiates a slightly higher deal from us, I'd be fine with that too. But I wouldn't just give into his demands especially given the way he's decided to play this.
His last tactic where he basically tried to anonymously smear the Suns organization does not sit well with me. I wouldn't cut off our nose to spite our face but I'd be tempted to play hardball with him. Let him know privately that he's crossed a line and that gloves will be coming off on our end in a day or two if he doesn't work out a deal with us.
Steve
JCSunsfan
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It's an agent that teams are not going to want to deal with in the future. The 5/80 demand is just so out of the picture. Btw word is that the suns offered a declining contract which means that year one was in the 14 mil range. Getting your money early is a good thing if you know how to manage it.
Phrazbit
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I can actually see why he didnt want to sign a contract with descending salaries given that some of the NBA contract extension rules are based on how much the player made in the previous season.
But the 48 million is more than fair.
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I do not believe Bledsoe will be a perennial all star. Dragic should hopefully make it a couple of times. I think Goran will make the all star team more times than Eric. Maybe if Eric signs in the east and stays healthy...
Thanks for laying that out. I feel the same way. As far as playing hardball with him, that's a delicate situation. You don't want to alienate him and make him dig in his heels even more yet you need to let him know we're doing what's best for the team overall as well and we think it's a very fair offer.
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I think the 4 year, 48 million dollar offer is being made with Dragic in mind. I think Dragic will command a higher yearly salary when the time comes. Also the Bledsoe offer is fair amount as most agree. So as I view it, the Suns are trying to put themselves in position to keep both, at least until a quality trade comes along. IMO, given a preference, the Suns would like to keep Dragic long term. We already know Sarver likes him and Dragic likes the Suns. I'm not sure about Bledsoe.
KloD
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I keep seeing this from folks, but you do understand that Dragic is 29 years old. He's hit his peak. How many more years does he have at his current level? He's got one more high dollar contract @ 4 years. Unless the Suns plan on being able to contend in the next year or two, I don't see any logic in building around Dragic. I want him here, but he should not be the long term plan IMO.
SirStefan32
Krycek, Alex Krycek
I don't think anyone is suggesting Dragic is THE solution or THE player we need to build around. I think we are looking at him as one of the key pieces. Every executive knows the value of a manager, a supervisor, a project manager, etc. Nobody is looking for Goran to be THE Superstar of some sort, but he makes an outstanding second or third best player.
Having said that, I would disagree that he's as good as he's gonna get. He has improved every single year, and he is a 29 year old with pretty low mileage. We'll see what happens next year, but even if you are right, he made the All-NBA third team, and just about made the All Star team.
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I would like for the Suns to go forward with Dragic long term. He should be able to play at least another five years or more at a high level. Cuban thought Nash was done at 30. Age is not always a predictor of the future. Because Bledsoe is 24 does not mean he is more durable than Dragic at 30.
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Not much knew except it may be a note from Sarver.
BC867
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Nowhere in this quote do I see a reason to overpay Eric (high turnover to assist ratio, damaged goods) Bledsoe and risk losing Dragic when his turn comes.
Bledsoe misses half-seasons, is a tweener and was not selected 3rd team All-NBA. And you are looking for reasons to give up on Dragic. Who, by the way, wants to be here.
What do they call it in politics . . . the Party of 'No'.
Remember when the Suns added more money to the Amare offer should he stay healthy and play in a certain number of games? I am not saying significantly up the offer. What about throwing in a "kicker" of some sort if he stays healthy and puts up certain numbers? It would slightly sweetens the deal without paying him way over market value and maybe this gets done. Just my two cents.
BC867
Long time Phoenician!
If we are going to re-sign Bledsoe, it sounds like a plan. Unless he accepts it begrudgingly and carries a negative attitude until he is traded.
Maybe not the only yardstick, but it is a factor in evaluating a franchise over 46 years. "Boom!"
KloD
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I didn't say he couldn't improve, I just believe he's about as good as he's going to get. That's good, but he shouldn't be built around as others have suggested. Yes, they have right here on this board. Not everyone, but some.
Mainstreet said:
As would I, but I've tired of the Nash comparisons. Steve Nash is an anomaly. Could Dragic play at a high level as long as Steve, sure. But, the chances are slim. I never said either was more durable, but I do believe you go with the guy who has shown he will likely pass Dragic's level and is 5/6 years younger. All I'm saying is, remove emotion from the decision and I'd pick Bledsoe over Dragic if I had too. I don't think the Suns have to though. I just believe they have to (if he stays) build around the younger of the two.
BC867 said:
It's not there because I never said there was. If Dragic insisted on a max next summer, should he get it? I don't believe so. If he was playing like this at 23 or 24 I might consider it. I also might feel Bledsoe is worthy of a max in 3 or 4 years of proven performance and durability. Right now though, I think they both top out at $12m per year. I think that's even generous, but I'd pay them both that to keep them here and together.
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Nash was Dragic's mentor, so who knows.
Bledsoe has only proved his worth for a half season and has had some injury problems. Sure, I like what I see in Bledsoe but I want a player that can stay on the court.
I am leaving emotion aside when I pick Dragic long term if push comes to shove. However, I would like to keep both players.
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Nash was Dragic's mentor, so who knows.
Bledsoe has only proved his worth for a half season and has had some injury problems. Sure, I like what I see in Bledsoe but I want a player that can stay on the court.
I am leaving emotion aside when I pick Dragic long term if push comes to shove. However, I would like to keep both players.
How come everyone is making such a big deal out of Bledsoe's injury history and completely ignoring the fact that Dragic is a great player for 67% of the season and fairly average for the remainder? I don't know if he can actually improve but having him perform at a star level for the entire season would be a huge improvement. Almost as big of an improvement as getting Bledsoe to play in more than 51% of the season.
Steve
Agreed. Just trying to think of a way to add some incentive to get the deal done without paying the ridiculous amount his idiot agent is asking for.
+1
SirStefan32
Krycek, Alex Krycek
I agree. He should NOT get the max contract. Max contract for him due to his tenure would be much higher than Bledsoe's, and there is no way the Suns should pay him that much, short of an MVP-level season from Dragic next year, which is so unlikely that it's not worth even mentioning.
Good news is that Dragic actually wants to be here. He enjoys playing for the Suns, he loves the city. Hell, he came back after the old regime threw him out.
I would be extremely surprised if Dragic asks for more money than he is worth. Now, I realize that's kind of subjective, and everyone thinks they are worth more than they are, and there are GMs who will overpay, etc, but the buttom line is that Dragic is not going to say, "I demand $18M per season."
I think Dragic will give the Suns a very nice hometown discount, somewhere between $12M and $15M per year, and I think it's reasonable for someone who makes the All-NBA third team. 60M over 5 years with some incentives ($1.5M for being an All-Star, 1M for All-NBA third team, 1.5M for All-NBA second team, 2M for All-NBA first team, 3M for MVP, 1M for the team making playoffs, etc) will be enough to retain Dragic. I think what Server did for Dragic a couple of years ago will pay off big-time.
SirStefan32
Krycek, Alex Krycek
I don't think the two situations are comparable. Dragic played for the national team, and then he had to carry the Suns on his back because Bledsoe was hurt for half a season. He burned out and got bruised up. Don't forget he played hurt for a few games at the end of the season. I would argue that Bledsoe's injuries are the reason Dragic wasn't playing at a star level the entire season.
I will say that Dragic' next contract needs to include the clause giving the Suns an option to say he cannot play for the national team during the off season or something similar. Dragic plays at 100% every minute of every game, and summer ball simply affects his durability during an 82-game season.
Agreed on Dragic.
I suggested earlier in the offseason that any new deal for Dragic contains a stipulation that bans him from any non-Olympic national team participation due to him breaking down so bad down the stretch this past season.
