Suns, Eric Bledsoe Far Apart In Talks

[AzStevenCal]

The deulsion that Bledsoe is at Irving's level is not shared by anyone outside of Bledsoe, his agent, and this board.

Cleveland had the 5th worst defensive rating when he was on the court and the 4th best when he was not on the court. Opposing players have in the neighborhood of an 18.5 PER against him. His numbers across the board are pretty much the same as when he entered the league and his team, despite his presence, continued to perform below expectations (they have won a total of 78 games during Kyrie's 3 year career).

Irving carries the label of a player who puts up impressive offensive stats but doesn't make his team better. Advanced stats say the opposite about Bledsoe. Offensively there isn't all that much difference between Kyrie and Eric. They are both better at getting their own shot than they are at creating offense for teammates. Irving is a little better at it than Bledsoe but not by much. Defensively, there is no comparison. Irving is Hardenesque on defense.

Here's an anonymous quote from a Western Conference Scout, taken from RealGM:

I think Kyrie is Stephon Marbury. Marbury was a great talent, too, but he never won. Steph was a pain in the butt, and Kyrie's not like that. He's not malicious. He's smart, he's more polished than Marbury. He's got the commercials and he's an engaging personality, but engaging only takes you so far. I really think he's just a scorer, and that's what Steph was. Kyrie can do whatever he wants to. He's got the ball on a string, he can get in the lane whenever he wants, but so far, he's chosen just to be a scorer rather than getting other guys involved. Guys say he doesn't trust his teammates, but you're talking about Luol Deng and Tristan Thompson. Those are good players. I'm just not buying into Kyrie.

Steve

 

[JCSunsfan]

I think the REAL issue here is that there has been no communication from the Bledsoe camp to the Suns FO in over SIX MONTHS.

How can this be true? The season ended 3 months ago.

 

[JCSunsfan]

The deulsion that Bledsoe is at Irving's level is not shared by anyone outside of Bledsoe, his agent, and this board.

Would I trade a signed Bledsoe straight up for Kyrie? No. Bledsoe is not at his level offensively, but I think he is a better fit with Goran. He is also a better defender. So, is he at Irving's level? From a pure, league-wide perspective--no. But for our purposes I would prefer him.

 

[Phoenix219]

How can this be true? The season ended 3 months ago.

Just repeating what I have read from multiple sources.

He must have made his ultimatum late in the season, and perhaps the Suns are getting the same rhetoric from the media that we see, with no further direct communication.

http://247sports.com/Bolt/Report-Suns-and-Eric-Bledsoe-havent-spoken-in-six-months-30889775

http://www.si.com/nba/2014/09/05/eric-bledsoe-suns-negotiations

http://www.fantasysp.com/player/nba...mmunication-between-the-suns-front-office-and

Perhaps it means communication with the intent to negotiate or alter positions.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Just repeating what I have read from multiple sources.

He must have made his ultimatum late in the season, and perhaps the Suns are getting the same rhetoric from the media that we see, with no further direct communication.

http://247sports.com/Bolt/Report-Suns-and-Eric-Bledsoe-havent-spoken-in-six-months-30889775

http://www.si.com/nba/2014/09/05/eric-bledsoe-suns-negotiations

http://www.fantasysp.com/player/nba...mmunication-between-the-suns-front-office-and

Perhaps it means communication with the intent to negotiate or alter positions.

Two words. Chris Haynes. One source for all this crap. He's a mouthpiece for Paul. All of the junk that makes it sound like the two sides are at war has come from him. It started when he was still a "reporter" in Denver a few months ago and it's escalated now that he's been promoted to a more lucrative position in Cleveland. Paul's approach for negotiating through the media and ultimately by shaping public opinion has been very transparent but apparently Paul thinks he's fooling the world.

Steve

 

[95pro]

http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2014/09/09/bledsoes-gamble-bigger-than-monroes/

Good to hear about Dragic.

 

[Phoenix219]

Two words. Chris Haynes. One source for all this crap. He's a mouthpiece for Paul. All of the junk that makes it sound like the two sides are at war has come from him. It started when he was still a "reporter" in Denver a few months ago and it's escalated now that he's been promoted to a more lucrative position in Cleveland. Paul's approach for negotiating through the media and ultimately by shaping public opinion has been very transparent but apparently Paul thinks he's fooling the world.

Steve

How would leaking that their own camp has not bothered to communicate with us in 6 months remotely help their case?

If they did leak this, then it still backs my last assertation - that he has no desire nor intention to play here, and the relationship is damaged beyond repair. It is damaged because he wants it to be.

 

[AzStevenCal]

How would leaking that their own camp has not bothered to communicate with us in 6 months remotely help their case?

If they did leak this, then it still backs my last assertation - that he has no desire nor intention to play here, and the relationship is damaged beyond repair. It is damaged because he wants it to be.

Well, that's not what was leaked. What was reported was that the two sides haven't spoken in 6 months. He's been trying to craft the story that the two sides are at odds when in fact the drama is all on Paul's side. A couple of months ago, Haynes reported that inside sources (implying sources on both sides) stated that the relationship had soured and was nearing the point of being unrepairable. It was the first the Suns camp had heard of it. It existed only in Paul's mind but now it exists in the public's view too.

I'm not positive what Paul's endgame is here but it's obvious he believes he has a plan. AFAIC, it says nothing about what Bledsoe wants. He's not part of this process as far as anything I've seen. Eric has been told he's worth the max and I'm sure he accepts that as truth. He's just letting his agent do what he's paying him to do.

Steve

 

[Phoenix219]

Yeah, I've seen all the other exaggerated or fabricated stuff, I thought you were referring directly to the "6 months" comment that I had been posting about. Yeah, Sarver has been quiet, except for that one bit of damage control he did, and was actually completely proper during. All the hype and drama has been engineered from Bledsoe's side. I just don't believe that Bledsoe is not making decisions here, or completely in the loop with his agent. I don't buy that Bledsoe is that dumb and is just the pawn of a greedy / bad agent. I lay this all at Bledsoe's feet, as his decisions, and his intent.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Yeah, I've seen all the other exaggerated or fabricated stuff, I thought you were referring directly to the "6 months" comment that I had been posting about. Yeah, Sarver has been quiet, except for that one bit of damage control he did, and was actually completely proper during. All the hype and drama has been engineered from Bledsoe's side. I just don't believe that Bledsoe is not making decisions here, or completely in the loop with his agent. I don't buy that Bledsoe is that dumb and is just the pawn of a greedy / bad agent. I lay this all at Bledsoe's feet, as his decisions, and his intent.

I agree but I don't think Eric has had anything to do with it. Honestly, I don't think he's all that bright. To me, he's Antonio McDyess all over again. I've not seen or heard anything that suggests he's looking for the bright lights or anything like that. IMO, Paul has convinced him it's an adversarial process and that this is all the normal BS that goes into getting an athlete his money.

Steve

 

[Hoop Head]

I am not a fan of Bledsoe and I don't want him back (even if we trade him for nothing) but I have seen no sources reporting that. Would you be so kind as to show us where that's been reported?

I can't find a link, maybe I worded it incorrectly though. I had seen it mentioned by supposed insiders and analysts, even some fans here. Nothing concrete but that could be a reason why he's holding out. I can't find an article now but I'll keep my eyes open because I do know I've seen it mentioned before that he would prefer to play in a more traditional offense.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I can't find a link, maybe I worded it incorrectly though. I had seen it mentioned by supposed insiders and analysts, even some fans here. Nothing concrete but that could be a reason why he's holding out. I can't find an article now but I'll keep my eyes open because I do know I've seen it mentioned before that he would prefer to play in a more traditional offense.

I've seen it speculated a few times by fans (here and elsewhere) but I haven't seen an actual insider report that suggested it.

Steve

 

[Phoenix219]

I agree but I don't think Eric has had anything to do with it. Honestly, I don't think he's all that bright. To me, he's Antonio McDyess all over again. I've not seen or heard anything that suggests he's looking for the bright lights or anything like that. IMO, Paul has convinced him it's an adversarial process and that this is all the normal BS that goes into getting an athlete his money.

Steve

We'll just have to agree to disagree. I don't believe that he's that stupid or that uninvolved. I just can't imagine that he doesn't have any input into what his agent is doing and is just mindlessly accepting the advice. I think the two of them have arranged it this way, with a goal and an agenda in mind. I didn't suggest he wants the bright lights; maybe its just something like working his way to Cleveland, or playing in LA - for whatever reason, he has his sights set on something, that he will only give up for the money. If he doesn't get the money, his consolation prize WILL be playing where he WANTS to, not getting stuck in this place (for whatever various speculative reasons.)

 

[AzStevenCal]

We'll just have to agree to disagree. I don't believe that he's that stupid or that uninvolved. I just can't imagine that he doesn't have any input into what his agent is doing and is just mindlessly accepting the advice. I think the two of them have arranged it this way, with a goal and an agenda in mind. I didn't suggest he wants the bright lights; maybe its just something like working his way to Cleveland, or playing in LA - for whatever reason, he has his sights set on something, that he will only give up for the money. If he doesn't get the money, his consolation prize WILL be playing where he WANTS to, not getting stuck in this place (for whatever various speculative reasons.)

I just haven't seen or heard anything that made me think he was smart in any way. But you're right, it's nothing more than an opinion on either side of this discussion. I really don't know what's going on.

Steve

 

[JCSunsfan]

I've seen it speculated a few times by fans (here and elsewhere) but I haven't seen an actual insider report that suggested it.

Steve

Right now, fans are speculating, the discussion is escalating, and people are remembering fan speculation as if it is insider information. We have virtually no information from the Bledsoe camp except:

1. 5/80
2. They are using free agency against me
3. Silence
4. Phoenix break bread
5. Eric Bledsoe would love to play with LeBron (hardly news and applies to half the league)

Anything else is pure speculation.

 

[Covert Rain]

This is beyond ridiculous. There is no saving face at this point. The organization is going to get a black eye for this no matter what. Especially, when you get guys like LeBron opening his mouth about it. Regardless of the detail, it's not going to be enduring to this franchise or make us look anymore attractive to future FA.

I truly hate this contract stuff. I wish we were all talking about how the team is shaping up, what the younger talent is doing and that sort of stuff.

 

[Azlen]

This is beyond ridiculous. There is no saving face at this point. The organization is going to get a black eye for this no matter what. Especially, when you get guys like LeBron opening his mouth about it. Regardless of the detail, it's not going to be enduring to this franchise or make us look anymore attractive to future FA.

I don't see the organization getting a black eye from this. I think most people see this as Bledsoe's agent overreaching rather than the Suns doing anything deserving of a black eye. Rich Paul is getting more of a negative rep than the Suns are.

 

[Mainstreet]

I don't see the organization getting a black eye from this. I think most people see this as Bledsoe's agent overreaching rather than the Suns doing anything deserving of a black eye. Rich Paul is getting more of a negative rep than the Suns are.

This is what I read as well. Most fans and writers don't understand saying "no" to 48 million when no one is stepping up to the plate with an offer sheet.

 

[High Stakes]

Just thought I would mention, I have an nab agent who reps several max players around the league, who works in my office…last friday I asked what in the world is going on with Bledsoe and he says he has talked to the suns front office and there has been open dialogue with him this entire time. There is zero truth to the media saying they have not spoke in months. But at this point he has no idea if he will sign a Q offer or extend. Also said it was absurd that Lebron told phoenix to break some bread. He doesn't think cho is a bad agent but he has bledsoe drinking the cool-aid that he is a max guy and several teams have told him if he simply signs the q offer this year, the will offer him the max next year...

 

[Finito]

This is beyond ridiculous. There is no saving face at this point. The organization is going to get a black eye for this no matter what. Especially, when you get guys like LeBron opening his mouth about it. Regardless of the detail, it's not going to be enduring to this franchise or make us look anymore attractive to future FA.

I truly hate this contract stuff. I wish we were all talking about how the team is shaping up, what the younger talent is doing and that sort of stuff.

Wrong. Nobody is looking at the suns here. Other teams can make him an offer and he hasn't gotten any. This is his agent not knowing what he's doing

 

[JCSunsfan]

Just thought I would mention, I have an nab agent who reps several max players around the league, who works in my office…last friday I asked what in the world is going on with Bledsoe and he says he has talked to the suns front office and there has been open dialogue with him this entire time. There is zero truth to the media saying they have not spoke in months. But at this point he has no idea if he will sign a Q offer or extend. Also said it was absurd that Lebron told phoenix to break some bread. He doesn't think cho is a bad agent but he has bledsoe drinking the cool-aid that he is a max guy and several teams have told him if he simply signs the q offer this year, the will offer him the max next year...

This sounds credible. Those teams telling h to sign the QO will be really hard to get to return calls if he injures himself this year

 

[KloD]

This sounds credible. Those teams telling h to sign the QO will be really hard to get to return calls if he injures himself this year

I'm not saying there isn't truth to it, but it wasn't the media claiming there wasn't communication, it was Sarver who said they hadn't spoke in months. I'm pretty certain he didn't make that up. Also, if a team was willing to max him out next year, why wouldn't they have made the offer this summer? Either way, if Eric proved to them he was worth a max next year, than the Suns would have the ability to offer him more next year than anyone else. So it doesn't make a lot of sense not to bet they wouldn't match this year when they could still be outbid next. I'm sure this was just an error, but Rich Cho isn't his agent.

 

[AzStevenCal]

I'm not saying there isn't truth to it, but it wasn't the media claiming there wasn't communication, it was Sarver who said they hadn't spoke in months. I'm pretty certain he didn't make that up. Also, if a team was willing to max him out next year, why wouldn't they have made the offer this summer? Either way, if Eric proved to them he was worth a max next year, than the Suns would have the ability to offer him more next year than anyone else. So it doesn't make a lot of sense not to bet they wouldn't match this year when they could still be outbid next. I'm sure this was just an error, but Rich Cho isn't his agent.

I'm pretty sure Sarver just said that they hadn't spoken directly to Eric since the season ended. It was a (believed to be) leak from Bledsoe's camp that said there had been no communication for almost 6 months (when the season was barely 4 months old. Anyway, it's my understanding that there has been regular dialogue with Bledsoe's people but not with Bledsoe himself.

Steve

 

[JCSunsfan]

I'm pretty sure Sarver just said that they hadn't spoken directly to Eric since the season ended. It was a (believed to be) leak from Bledsoe's camp that said there had been no communication for almost 6 months (when the season was barely 4 months old. Anyway, it's my understanding that there has been regular dialogue with Bledsoe's people but not with Bledsoe himself.

Steve

This is correct. No one said that there was no conversation between the Suns and the agent. In fact, it is assumed there has been since offers were made and rejected.

Imagine you are Eric. Your agent says you are a max player. Then you have teams that say, "Listen, you are a max player, we just don't have the cap space to sign you right now. If you sign the QO, we definitely will have max money for you next summer." If you are a little naive, and a bit arrogant, you will bite on that. It would be a real dilemma. Do you take the Suns offer and make it look like, to the whole world, that you do not believe in yourself, or do you sign the QO and show the world what you believe you can do?

As far as other teams go, there is no risk. You have a couple of priorities, 1. try to find a way to get Bledsoe for nothing. He becomes available next summer after a whole year of tape to really evaluate and decide if he is worth it. 2. Make the Suns overpay, or at least sow discord in the Suns organization.

It seems obvious to me that, intelligence-wise, Bledsoe is more Antonio McDyess than Grant Hill. Less saavy players are easily manipulated.

 

[AzStevenCal]

This is correct. No one said that there was no conversation between the Suns and the agent. In fact, it is assumed there has been since offers were made and rejected.

Imagine you are Eric. Your agent says you are a max player. Then you have teams that say, "Listen, you are a max player, we just don't have the cap space to sign you right now. If you sign the QO, we definitely will have max money for you next summer." If you are a little naive, and a bit arrogant, you will bite on that. It would be a real dilemma. Do you take the Suns offer and make it look like, to the whole world, that you do not believe in yourself, or do you sign the QO and show the world what you believe you can do?

As far as other teams go, there is no risk. You have a couple of priorities, 1. try to find a way to get Bledsoe for nothing. He becomes available next summer after a whole year of tape to really evaluate and decide if he is worth it. 2. Make the Suns overpay, or at least sow discord in the Suns organization.

It seems obvious to me that, intelligence-wise, Bledsoe is more Antonio McDyess than Grant Hill. Less saavy players are easily manipulated.

Yeah that's pretty much how I look at it.

Steve