Encouraging Kyler Murray Trends

[daves]

You must be registered for see images attach

14 Rushing TDs as a rookie.... Dear God!

RG III had the most impressive stats in that group.

...dave

 

[Cheesebeef]

I just don't get why people have to live in such extremes.

the dude had a good rookie season. nothing more, nothing less. and a good rookie season for a first year QB is usually a very promising sign.

it's the "historical" "amazing" hyperbolic statements of Kyler's conquests that just make me chuckle. same with the few holdouts that can't see the good this year definitely outweighed the bad for him.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

We are a decent amount away from great but even farther away from bad so I will take it.

 

[TheCardFan]

I just don't get why people have to live in such extremes.

the dude had a good rookie season. nothing more, nothing less. and a good rookie season for a first year QB is usually a very promising sign.

it's the "historical" "amazing" hyperbolic statements of Kyler's conquests that just make me chuckle. same with the few holdouts that can't see the good this year definitely outweighed the bad for him.

Good compared to what?

 

[dreamcastrocks]

RG III had the most impressive stats in that group.

...dave

I'll take Cam's season, but to each his/her own.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Good compared to what?

Rookie QBs that don't have a good season. Obviously.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Rookie QBs that don't have a good season. Obviously.

this should have been obvious.

 

[TheCardFan]

Rookie QBs that don't have a good season. Obviously.

this should have been obvious.

Based on what? How do you define good vs great?

 

[Solar7]

I just don't get why people have to live in such extremes.

the dude had a good rookie season. nothing more, nothing less. and a good rookie season for a first year QB is usually a very promising sign.

it's the "historical" "amazing" hyperbolic statements of Kyler's conquests that just make me chuckle. same with the few holdouts that can't see the good this year definitely outweighed the bad for him.

I hope to clarify, he had a good, maybe really good season. I just want to bang my head against the wall when it's said he's already amazing. I'm not a holdout. But I'm not sure if you're accusing me of it or not.

Where we stand today, he's a player we seemingly have a lot to look forward to, but who hasn't proven anything fully. I think he'll prove to be a damn good QB, but let's remember that I think Rivers and Stafford are good QBs.

 

[PACardsFan]

Kyler murray rookie season was better then luck rookie season
Both played with a non stellar cast but i remember Luck had something like 18 Interceptions and 10 fumble
Maybe one of the best overall was Robert griffin rookie season
Cam Newton used his body to make several rushing tds in the goal line, Murray can't do that

Nor do I or would I want Murray to use his body in the manner that Cam did. Even with the body that Cam was blessed with, that approach stole years from his career. It also diminished his ability to throw the ball when his body eventually fell apart.

 

[DVontel]

I just want to bang my head against the wall when it's said he's already amazing.

He’s already amazing.

 

[Solar7]

He’s already amazing.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I hope to clarify, he had a good, maybe really good season. I just want to bang my head against the wall when it's said he's already amazing. I'm not a holdout. But I'm not sure if you're accusing me of it or not.

Where we stand today, he's a player we seemingly have a lot to look forward to, but who hasn't proven anything fully. I think he'll prove to be a damn good QB, but let's remember that I think Rivers and Stafford are good QBs.

I actually agree with you 100%.

 

[daves]

I'll take Cam's season, but to each his/her own.

Fair enough. They both had great rookie seasons, but Cam's interceptions really turn me off. Here's a direct comparison of the two:

                           Pass Pass Pass Pass Pass Pass  Pass Pass Pass Pass Pass Pass Pass  Pass Rush Rush Rush Rush
Player           From  G  QBrec  Cmp  Att Cmp%  Yds   TD  Rate  Int   Sk  Yds  Y/A AY/A NY/A ANY/A  Att  Yds   TD  Y/A
Robert Griffin   2012 15  9-6-0  258  393 65.6 3200   20 102.4    5   30  217  8.1 8.59 7.05  7.47  120  815    7  6.8
Cam Newton       2011 16 6-10-0  310  517 60.0 4051   21  84.5   17   35  260  7.8 7.17 6.87  6.24  126  706   14  5.6

Provided by Pro-Football-Reference.com: View Original Table

Cam has an extra 30 yards per game and 8 more TDs, but 12 more turnovers (they each had 2 lost fumbles). Griffin had the better completion percentage, rating, y/a, and rushing average, and a MUCH lower turnover rate. I seem to recall a lot of Cam's TDs being of the 1-yard QB sneak variety, which is valuable, but in many cases just replaced an RB score.

They were each offensive rookies of the year, so it's really just quibbling. It's really too bad RG3 suffered his knee injury, though it could be said that he was bound to be injured sooner because he wasn't bulit like Cam, and the league may have "figured him out" anyway.

...dave

 

[kerouac9]

Based on what? How do you define good vs great?

There are a variety of ways you can define it. Assuming you're asking this question in good faith, here are a couple:

Winz – Statistically, Ben R. and Russel Wilson's rookie seasons are no great shakes, but their teams went to the playoffs and won a game there. That's pretty special.

Top 5% vs. Top 25% (adjusted for era) – One thing that bothers me about SoonerLou's original list is that there were 5 QBs on there, and all of their rookie seasons were relatively recent. There isn't enough sample size to say what the comparison between RG3, Cam, and Kyler's rookie seasons mean. If you put together a list of 3500/500 guys, and it's 5 guys whose rookie seasons were within the last 8 years (or whatever), what does that mean? The sample size is too small and too recent to say anything.

Place Kyler's rookie season as a passer in context with other guys who started 14+ games as a rookie in the last 15 years or so, and you get a little more context to look at. It looks to me in that context that Kyler was in the top quarter of these guys, but not elite among them. Does that mean anything? I don't know.

 

[JeffGollin]

L Jackson is bigger and more physical than Kyler and may find it easier to develop.

Teams continually adjust to their opponents's strengths (& weaknesses).

Some young QB's are better than others at facing and overcoming those challenges.

Will K Murray? Maybe (at least I hope so). Maybe not*.

* Examples of why K Murray's growth isn't an automatic "lock" = (1) the number of interceptions ihe threw vs. the Rams and (2) David Johnson's inability to come all the way back after being injury. (Sometimes young players get stuck in a rut or simply regress).

 

[cardncubfan]

Baldy's breakdown.


https://www.azcardinals.com/video/baldy-s-breakdowns-kyler-murray-s-impressive-first-year-in-the-nfl

 

[PACardsFan]

Baldy's breakdown.


https://www.azcardinals.com/video/baldy-s-breakdowns-kyler-murray-s-impressive-first-year-in-the-nfl

Amazing stuff by Baldi!! I’m one of the oldies on this board & I’ve never been more excited about an upcoming season or about a particular player. No doubt, Murray is the greatest #1 pick in Cardinal history. If you’re not ecstatic about this kid, then you’re clueless.

 

[Solar7]

Amazing stuff by Baldi!! I’m one of the oldies on this board & I’ve never been more excited about an upcoming season or about a particular player. No doubt, Murray is the greatest #1 pick in Cardinal history. If you’re not ecstatic about this kid, then you’re clueless.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I dont see what's wrong with that statement.

Kyler Murray is literally the best rookie QB this team has ever had. Granted the Cardinals history sucks overall, but that's nothing to sneeze at.

I think @kerouac9 point is sound. Not a top 5% season, but a top 25% season. Most QBs in that statistical area HAVE worked out, and quite a few become HOF caliber players.

Since I've been watching the Cardinal circa 94, hes easily a top 5 most exciting young players, and I would venture to say the most exciting because he plays the most important position.

 

[Ronin]

 

[Solar7]

I dont see what's wrong with that statement.

Kyler Murray is literally the best rookie QB this team has ever had. Granted the Cardinals history sucks overall, but that's nothing to sneeze at.

I think @kerouac9 point is sound. Not a top 5% season, but a top 25% season. Most QBs in that statistical area HAVE worked out, and quite a few become HOF caliber players.

Since I've been watching the Cardinal circa 94, hes easily a top 5 most exciting young players, and I would venture to say the most exciting because he plays the most important position.

I’m just rolling my eyes because of how long we’ve been having this argument, and the kid has so much more to prove to ascend from a season that is akin to a Jameis Winston rookie season.

I’ve got a lot of hope in the kid, but he hasn’t won anything yet.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I’m just rolling my eyes because of how long we’ve been having this argument, and the kid has so much more to prove to ascend from a season that is akin to a Jameis Winston rookie season.

I’ve got a lot of hope in the kid, but he hasn’t won anything yet.

Football is a team game. Give Murray a middling to 20th ranked defense and likely would've bad a winning season.

This is reason for optimism. The obvious reason for pessimism is that Keim doesnt seem to understand how to build sustainable success. I think next year the Cardinals WILL have a good season, but the problem is that Keim will probably make an addition or two that arent long term players.

His winning stretch was all built around getting proven vets for a last hoorah. What Keim hasn't been able to do is identify young, cheap talent.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I’m just rolling my eyes because of how long we’ve been having this argument, and the kid has so much more to prove to ascend from a season that is akin to a Jameis Winston rookie season.

I’ve got a lot of hope in the kid, but he hasn’t won anything yet.

If KM plays like Winston, we better run him out of town. All them damn turnovers...

 

[Ronin]

Not my fight but did Jamesis Winston throw for 3,000 yards and rush for 500 yards in his rookie year?

I don’t think so.