Kyler Murray entering Draft

[Zeno]

Tell Fran Tarkenton that!

You mean 6’ tall Fran Tarkenton? That one?

 

[az jam]

Cards are not going to use their first pick on Murray. If they even draft a qb it will be in the late rounds.

 

[Zeno]

If Rosen has pinpoint accuracy what does that say for KM who was almost 10% better than him last year?

Entirely different offensive systems. Minshew completed 70% of his passes, a higher rate than Murray, does that make him a better QB? How about Brent Stockstill? He had a higher completion % too.

Haskins had more yards passing and a higher % and more passing TDs than Murray...he’s also prototypical NFL size. Murray isn’t even going to be the first QB off the board let alone the top pick overall.

 

[Mainstreet]

Entirely different offensive systems. Minshew completed 70% of his passes, a higher rate than Murray, does that make him a better QB? How about Brent Stockstill? He had a higher completion % too.

Haskins had more yards passing and a higher % and more passing TDs than Murray...he’s also prototypical NFL size. Murray isn’t even going to be the first QB off the board let alone the top pick overall.

So you are liking Haskins.

 

[Brak]

Fran Tarkenton is 6`0 tall.Not 5`9 or 5`10 at best.

Sure he may be listed at that height.. but he's a millimeter over 5'10 I'll eat my airedale.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Entirely different offensive systems. Minshew completed 70% of his passes, a higher rate than Murray, does that make him a better QB? How about Brent Stockstill? He had a higher completion % too.

Haskins had more yards passing and a higher % and more passing TDs than Murray...he’s also prototypical NFL size. Murray isn’t even going to be the first QB off the board let alone the top pick overall.

His air yards were higher also.... 11yds to 8yds. Lincoln Riley doesn't dink and dunk.



Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

 

[Crimson Warrior]

2018 College QB Ratings:

Murray = 199.2

Haskins = 174.1

 

[PACardsFan]

I think there are easy arguments against Murray.

1) The Cardinals already have a QBOF on the roster that they draft last year
2) Murray IS unprecedently small for a successful NFL QB. 5'9 is quite a bit smaller than 6'0 which is considered really short for an NFL QB. Murray is a micro NFL QB
3) He is going to have to rely on athleticism in the NFL, and QBs who do that tend to not have the same success once they stop running all of the time
4) He was only good for ONE season in college football. He wasn't good earlier in his career.
5) He has baseball to fall back on. Until recently, he specifically stated he wanted to play baseball.
6) If you draft Murray, there will be a learning curve. The team already started the learning curve with Rosen. That means the team has to start over even before Rosen has a chance.
7) Rosen would be the 1st QB off the board this year. He was a significantly better prospect last year than any of the QBs this year.


I could go on, and on, and on. There are MANY reasons that drafting Murray would be a bad idea.

I'll stop you at 1. Is Rosen truly our QBOF? There's a greater chance that he isn't. Of course, that's my opinion. I hope and pray that I'm wrong to even think that may be the case.

 

[PACardsFan]

We don't need to draft another QB regardless of height or how special the next guy is. We need to ride with the guy we drafted last year.

''Adds a personnel executive for an AFC team who has scouted Rosen extensively: "He's really a special passer. He makes all the throws from the pocket. He makes you go 'wow' at least two to three times a game. He has pinpoint accuracy and can adapt to any system you want. And he'll stand in there and throw it and take a shot right under the chin if he has to -- that's hard to find. Of all these quarterbacks coming out, he's the most ready. You don't really have to do anything except teach him the system."

http://www.nfl.com/labs/cfb247/josh-rosen/josh-rosen.html

None of us saw pinpoint accuracy out of Rosen. And I certainly didn't say "wow" 3x game. Maybe 3 times ALL season. The only wows I uttered were out of pure disgust.

 

[GatorAZ]

If Murray was 2” taller with no threat of baseball he’d be the unanimous #1 pick. He was Baker Mayfield on rocket fuel. Wherever he goes I’m going to be fascinated to watch it play out.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Why will he have rely on his athleticism Krang?

Because that's part of his game and at 5'9, he literally has to move out of the pocket at times just to see downfield.

 

[Krangodnzr]

2018 College QB Ratings:

Murray = 199.2

Haskins = 174.1

Orange = color

Cesna = aircraft

 

[Krangodnzr]

I'll stop you at 1. Is Rosen truly our QBOF? There's a greater chance that he isn't. Of course, that's my opinion. I hope and pray that I'm wrong to even think that may be the case.

And the same could be said about the scrambling midget.

The team invested a high pick in Rosen less than a year ago. Give him at least on fricking year to prove himself.

 

[cwamjn]

Give him at least on fricking year to prove himself.

AMEN!!

Sincerely,
Steve Wilks

 

[PACardsFan]

And the same could be said about the scrambling midget.

The team invested a high pick in Rosen less than a year ago. Give him at least on fricking year to prove himself.

That's obviously an option. And I hope it's the right one. But, if Murray ends up being some hybrid of Mayfield/Mahomes, we'll all have to live with the consequences.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Kyler Murray is basically Tavon Austin that can throw. Austin has had minimal impact and was a wasted top 10 pick. Guys that are 5'9 190 pounds very RARELY have any impact in the NFL.

I liked Murray at Oklahoma and thought he was great but I'm not using a high #1 pick on him and betting that he's the extreme exception to the rule. Even Mayfield, Brees, and Wilson are bigger than Murray and they(well Mayfield still has a lot to prove) are rare exceptions.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Because that's part of his game and at 5'9, he literally has to move out of the pocket at times just to see downfield.

Weak.

Running is part of Murray's game, sure, but his historically good QBR of 199.2 tells us he doesn't have to "rely" on his freakish mobility to be a successful QB. He's arguably the best pure passer ever to play college football.

Krang, how many games did you watch Murray play this year sir? You're generally a good poster, very good in fact, and you've been here forever. Much respect man. But I'm not sure you've studied Murray enough to confidently tell us that the Cardinal's shouldn't draft him at #1.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

And the same could be said about the scrambling midget.

The team invested a high pick in Rosen less than a year ago. Give him at least on fricking year to prove himself.

"The scrambling midget"? Wow.

That's somebody's son man. But Murray's mom and dad are proud of him no matter how you denigrate him.

I'm proud that he wore crimson and cream too. He's a good human being on top of being a great football player.

 

[TheCardFan]

None of us saw pinpoint accuracy out of Rosen. And I certainly didn't say "wow" 3x game. Maybe 3 times ALL season. The only wows I uttered were out of pure disgust.

I will say that the first/second start by Rosen...I remember seeing throws that I haven't seen before (in a positive way). I also remember him missing high which continued and unfortunately, his wow throws didn't.

If you watch his college tape you will see the same thing. He is a gamer but he is not Kurt Warner (and never will be) from a consistent accuracy standpoint. He is more like a younger Carson Palmer or Eli Manning. He will make some good throws and then some completed boneheaded ones in the same game.

I do like his poise, pocket presence, leadership, and his toughness. His floor is a solid NFL starter (top 15?).

 

[TheCardFan]

Kyler Murray is basically Tavon Austin that can throw. Austin has had minimal impact and was a wasted top 10 pick. Guys that are 5'9 190 pounds very RARELY have any impact in the NFL.

What happens to a 5'9/190 pound guy when a 300+# lineman pounds him into the ground? I can't imagine he will be able to stay healthy.

 

[Southpaw]

My point regarding McVay was that he has demonstrated that he can develop his franchise QB (considering where Goff came from) there is no reason to doubt that if CK2 is who we think he is, that he will do the same.

Jared Goff came out of Sonny Dykes system at U Cal.

Switched from Baseball coaching to Football under Hal Mumme, who was the father of Air Raid. Mike leach was there. Coached for Mike Leach at TT. There is a connection between KK and Sonny thus Goff and Rosen. I am doing a stretch exercise here.

 

[Krangodnzr]

"The scrambling midget"? Wow.

That's somebody's son man. But Murray's mom and dad are proud of him no matter how you denigrate him.

I'm proud that he wore crimson and cream too. He's a good human being on top of being a great football player.

Cool story bro, but his height will limit him.

 

[Zeno]

Kyler Murray is basically Tavon Austin that can throw. Austin has had minimal impact and was a wasted top 10 pick. Guys that are 5'9 190 pounds very RARELY have any impact in the NFL.

I liked Murray at Oklahoma and thought he was great but I'm not using a high #1 pick on him and betting that he's the extreme exception to the rule. Even Mayfield, Brees, and Wilson are bigger than Murray and they(well Mayfield still has a lot to prove) are rare exceptions.

Tavon Austin, I remember his draft hype, a certain poster here thought he would be a 2000 all purpose yard guy as a rookie.

 

[Ronin]

What happens to a 5'9/190 pound guy when a 300+# lineman pounds him into the ground? I can't imagine he will be able to stay healthy.

Noted.
D Linemen can't use all their weight to fall on the QB anymore.

 

[JeffGollin]

None of us saw pinpoint accuracy out of Rosen. And I certainly didn't say "wow" 3x game. Maybe 3 times ALL season. The only wows I uttered were out of pure disgust.

Rosen's forte was that he got rid of the ball quickly and was capable of throwing lasers.

His weaknesses were in his decision-making, execution under pressure and inconsistent accuracy.

If the weaknesses can be eliminated or coached out of him, he can become our QBOF. If not, it's back to the drawing board and the loss of 2 or more years.

Which boils everything down to:

- Do we stay with Rosen and risk 2 or more wasted years?

- Or do we go with a relatively unknown entity with a 50-50 chance at stardom by using a high pick on Murray?

The reason why the Draft is more art than science is that either decision could be wrong (Or - both decisions could be right & both QB's could turn out to be superstars).

This is where all the hours of experience and due diligence by coaches and scouts come into play & where by-the-book principles collide with gut instincts and sage wisdom.

Anything can happen - I'll just say that the odds would favor sticking with Rosen and using the #1 pick on a blue-chip prospect to help bouy up another position. If I were totally up in the air about what I would do, I'd let the numbers work in my favor & go with this strategy.