Who is the Star the Suns could get or event want?

[Suns_fan69]

You must be really young or have a short memory. There was a day when every free agent considered Phoenix first.

Problem is that was many moons ago. The good news is that the climate is still a big pull, and I do think the ownership is repairing it's reputation. Whether that's enough for Lebron is doubtful at best, but not completely out of the question.

 

[Cheesebeef]

You must be really young or have a short memory. There was a day when every free agent considered Phoenix first.

this is true, but that day has very little to do with today. The reason we were considered one of the crown jewels for FA was above all else, because of Colangelo. Sarver's gotten less problematic in recent years, but even as he's begun to rehab his image, he doesn't bring anywhere CLOSE to the same cache that JC did. That's not even necessarily a knock on Sarver. Not many people in basketball have Colangelo's cache (as evidenced by Team USA putting itself in Jerry's hands to right what had been a sinking ship there after the 2004/2006 debacles in international play).

 

[BC867]

Bledsoe is not going anywhere.

If you began that sentence with "I believe that ..." or "I hope that ...", it would be a statement of fact. What you believe or hope.

"Bledsoe is not going anywhere." is hardly a statement of fact!

Dragic is in the running for an All-Star spot (only because he has been carrying the whole Point Guard role).

If he and Bledsoe had been healthy for the first half of the season, neither of their stats would have been All-Star calibre. They would have neutralized each other, with the benefit of a starting calibre Point Guard on the floor at all times.

Now if one were to come off the bench in the 1st half of the All Star game and the other in the 2nd half, perhaps both would be happy with sharing the role . . .

 

[devilalum]

this is true, but that day has very little to do with today. The reason we were considered one of the crown jewels for FA was above all else, because of Colangelo. Sarver's gotten less problematic in recent years, but even as he's begun to rehab his image, he doesn't bring anywhere CLOSE to the same cache that JC did. That's not even necessarily a knock on Sarver. Not many people in basketball have Colangelo's cache (as evidenced by Team USA putting itself in Jerry's hands to right what had been a sinking ship there after the 2004/2006 debacles in international play).

JC also had a knack for manipulating the cap and bending rules. This is next to impossible today. Everything is so well defined. Many of the rule changes that have taken place in the last 15 years were in direct response to JCs manipulations.

 

[Sci Fi]

Dragic is in the running for an All-Star spot (only because he has been carrying the whole Point Guard role).

If he and Bledsoe had been healthy for the first half of the season, neither of their stats would have been All-Star calibre. They would have neutralized each other, with the benefit of a starting calibre Point Guard on the floor at all times.

Of course an alternative analysis is that had Dragic not had to share the PG duty with Bledsoe, his full season stats would be much better and he's probably be a lock. Most PG's don't share ball handling responsibilities.

 

[Catlover]

Of course an alternative analysis is that had Dragic not had to share the PG duty with Bledsoe, his full season stats would be much better and he's probably be a lock. Most PG's don't share ball handling responsibilities.

That's hardly an analysis. Since losing Bledsoe we are .500 against the very weakest part of our schedule. If he can't lead a team to wins against the bottom teams of the league he has no business playing in the All Star game. We've only faced one good team in our last 14 games (only two of them were at or above .500) and yet we've only managed 7 wins during that stretch. Compare that to our performance with Eric on the court and it's clear who the real star of this team has been and it's not Goran. Dragic is a pretty good player, nothing more. They are both flawed on offense but Bledsoe's defense is often at the game changing level.

 

[Sci Fi]

I just have to post this as it made me laugh.

"Pek is out indefinitely for the TWolves.

Now's the time to offer up Okafor, MIN pick, IND pick, Kravtsov for Love...Maybe even Len if we take a pick out "

From RealGM. Forum mod.

 

[Sci Fi]

That's hardly an analysis. Since losing Bledsoe we are .500 against the very weakest part of our schedule. If he can't lead a team to wins against the bottom teams of the league he has no business playing in the All Star game. We've only faced one good team in our last 14 games (only two of them were at or above .500) and yet we've only managed 7 wins during that stretch. Compare that to our performance with Eric on the court and it's clear who the real star of this team has been and it's not Goran. Dragic is a pretty good player, nothing more. They are both flawed on offense but Bledsoe's defense is often at the game changing level.

lol.

 

[Catlover]

lol.

Nice try. The reason you have to settle for trying to belittle the point is that the facts speak loudly. You've been jocking Dragic all season but you disappear every time one of those little point guards runs circles around him. He has his strengths and we're lucky to have him but Bledsoe is easily our best player.

 

[Covert Rain]

You must be really young or have a short memory. There was a day when every free agent considered Phoenix first.

You just said it...."there was a day" and no I am not that young. LOL. Why would I be referencing the distant past? I was referring to how FA view us now. Sorry if I wasn't more clear. How many years do you have to go back to demonstrate the Suns ended up with the top free agent in the league? You can't use Nash because nobody knew how good he was going to get in a Suns uniform. What other top FAs (franchise caliber), have flocked to the Suns in recent history (especially post JC)?

this is true, but that day has very little to do with today. The reason we were considered one of the crown jewels for FA was above all else, because of Colangelo. Sarver's gotten less problematic in recent years, but even as he's begun to rehab his image, he doesn't bring anywhere CLOSE to the same cache that JC did. That's not even necessarily a knock on Sarver. Not many people in basketball have Colangelo's cache (as evidenced by Team USA putting itself in Jerry's hands to right what had been a sinking ship there after the 2004/2006 debacles in international play).

EXACTLY my point. I was not referring to back in the day when we got Chambers for example. That was the past and this is now. I should have been more clear but cheesebeef you are absolutely correct. It has nothing to do with today and who owns the team and it's reputation has a ton to do with it. JC had much respect around the league. Seeing how players responded to him putting together TEAM USA is a prime example.

We have seen top tier FAs come and go and sign with other teams over the years without so much as a sniff in Arizona. Kobe? We all know he was never serious about signing here.

 

[Cheesebeef]

JC also had a knack for manipulating the cap and bending rules. This is next to impossible today. Everything is so well defined. Many of the rule changes that have taken place in the last 15 years were in direct response to JCs manipulations.

yup. him getting AC Green and Danny Manning to sign one year SUPER RIDICULOUSLY LOW deals in order to get their bird rights and then reward them the next season were brilliant moves that should have eventually led to titles if not for Joe Freaking Klein.

But, again, it said a lot about JC that in two years running his reputation alone got those guys to sign those deals because the players knew he would take care of them. I'm pretty sure that JC even paid Manning a ton the summer AFTER he tore his ACL, making good on a one year deal. It would have been very easy to turn his back then, but he made Danny whole, based on what I assumed was a pre-agreed upon deal when he signed the one year deal.

Basically, JC was what Pat Riley has become for the Heat. A guy running the organization that players and everyone around the league simply believed in.

 

[Mainstreet]

yup. him getting AC Green and Danny Manning to sign one year SUPER RIDICULOUSLY LOW deals in order to get their bird rights and then reward them the next season were brilliant moves that should have eventually led to titles if not for Joe Freaking Klein.

But, again, it said a lot about JC that in two years running his reputation alone got those guys to sign those deals because the players knew he would take care of them. I'm pretty sure that JC even paid Manning a ton the summer AFTER he tore his ACL, making good on a one year deal. It would have been very easy to turn his back then, but he made Danny whole, based on what I assumed was a pre-agreed upon deal when he signed the one year deal.

Basically, JC was what Pat Riley has become for the Heat. A guy running the organization that players and everyone around the league simply believed in.

JC always kept his word like promising never to trade Kevin Johnson. You are right about Manning.

 

[BC867]

Dragic is in the running for an All-Star spot (only because he has been carrying the whole Point Guard role).

If he and Bledsoe had been healthy for the first half of the season, neither of their stats would have been All-Star calibre. They would have neutralized each other, with the benefit of a starting calibre Point Guard on the floor at all times.

Of course an alternative analysis is that had Dragic not had to share the PG duty with Bledsoe, his full season stats would be much better and he's probably be a lock. Most PG's don't share ball handling responsibilities.

You and I just said the same thing. Dragic is supposedly in the running now because Bledsoe is injured. When they did play together, neither set of scoring/assist stats put them in the running for All Star status.

 

[Phrazbit]

Being selected for the all-star team is not purely a statistical qualification. Tony Parker will almost certainly be on the roster ahead of several guys with better stats.

Lets say (hypothetically) that Bledsoe does not get hurt and the Suns run from December carried over into this month and we've got a record of 31-15 and are basically tied for the division lead, I think in that situation the Suns record would likely merit either Bledsoe or Dragic gaining a selection, and seeing as their stats were nearly identically at the time, but Bledsoe was getting a lot more national attention and is the better defender, I think he would have been a strong candidate. Instead, with Bledsoe out, I think Dragic has a very realistic chance at selection.

 

[Catlover]

Being selected for the all-star team is not purely a statistical qualification. Tony Parker will almost certainly be on the roster ahead of several guys with better stats.

Lets say (hypothetically) that Bledsoe does not get hurt and the Suns run from December carried over into this month and we've got a record of 31-15 and are basically tied for the division lead, I think in that situation the Suns record would likely merit either Bledsoe or Dragic gaining a selection, and seeing as their stats were nearly identically at the time, but Bledsoe was getting a lot more national attention and is the better defender, I think he would have been a strong candidate. Instead, with Bledsoe out, I think Dragic has a very realistic chance at selection.

I would say with Bledsoe out coupled with a lot of injuries that Dragic has a very realistic chance at selection. He wouldn't be a bad choice either. He's playing at a borderline end-of-the-bench All Star level. If it doesn't happen though it won't be worthy of an "oh my, Dragic was snubbed" outcry.

 

[Phrazbit]

I agree, him not making it would not surprise me.

Paul, Westbrook and Kobe are out, Parker, Lillard, Harden and Curry are all locks. So that leaves Dragic, Ellis, Klay Thompson, Ty Lawson, Conley and Isiah Thomas as candidates for the 5th guard spot.

I think given the Suns record and Dragic's recent explosion he is the most worthy of that group but he does not run away with it. Only way I'd be shocked if Dragic is not selected is if 6 guards are selected from the West and Goran is not among them.

 

[Catlover]

I agree, him not making it would not surprise me.

Paul, Westbrook and Kobe are out, Parker, Lillard, Harden and Curry are all locks. So that leaves Dragic, Ellis, Klay Thompson, Ty Lawson, Conley and Isiah Thomas as candidates for the 5th guard spot.

I think given the Suns record and Dragic's recent explosion he is the most worthy of that group but he does not run away with it. Only way I'd be shocked if Dragic is not selected is if 6 guards are selected from the West and Goran is not among them.

I think it comes down to him and the Memphis guard and Conley has the clear edge on defense. I'd put Dragic in over Lillard but Lillard has a much higher profile and as you said, he's probably a lock.

 

[Sci Fi]

lol. Dragic just put up 30.

 

[Sci Fi]

Dragic is so much better than Lillard. It's not really that close.

 

[devilalum]

Nice try. The reason you have to settle for trying to belittle the point is that the facts speak loudly. You've been jocking Dragic all season but you disappear every time one of those little point guards runs circles around him. He has his strengths and we're lucky to have him but Bledsoe is easily our best player.

IMO you're both wrong. The thing that made the Suns so hot was the two of them playing together. If Dragic had been out during this stretch instead I think you'd probably see about the same results. Bill Simmons talks about them together like they equal one top caliber All Star player.

 

[Catlover]

IMO you're both wrong. The thing that made the Suns so hot was the two of them playing together. If Dragic had been out during this stretch instead I think you'd probably see about the same results. Bill Simmons talks about them together like they equal one top caliber All Star player.

I don't mind being wrong but I don't see how this statement relates. I agree that it was the combination of the two that put us where we were. I think we'd struggle with just Bledsoe running the point although I don't think it would have been quite as bad as it has been. I say that because we already got a look at this team without Dragic and we played better then even though it was against far superior competition. Neither one of them is an ideal point guard but together, they are arguably the best pair of starting guards in the league. It's a match made in heaven and if Eric takes an offer elsewhere he may well live to regret it. Alongside Goran, he shines.

 

[Sci Fi]

IMO you're both wrong. The thing that made the Suns so hot was the two of them playing together. If Dragic had been out during this stretch instead I think you'd probably see about the same results. Bill Simmons talks about them together like they equal one top caliber All Star player.

lol. Sorry. Dragic makes the Suns go. Try again.

 

[Sci Fi]

I don't mind being wrong but I don't see how this statement relates. I agree that it was the combination of the two that put us where we were. I think we'd struggle with just Bledsoe running the point although I don't think it would have been quite as bad as it has been. I say that because we already got a look at this team without Dragic and we played better then even though it was against far superior competition. Neither one of them is an ideal point guard but together, they are arguably the best pair of starting guards in the league. It's a match made in heaven and if Eric takes an offer elsewhere he may well live to regret it. Alongside Goran, he shines.

It's good you don't mind being wrong. Think about this. Bledsoe has played half the games.

PS: I love cats. All animals actually. I've rescued thousands of dogs. Peace.

 

[Catlover]

It's good you don't mind being wrong. Think about this. Bledsoe has played half the games.

PS: I love cats. All animals actually. I've rescued thousands of dogs. Peace.

I think we're 16 - 8 when Bledsoe plays. What's our record when he doesn't play?

Thousands of dogs? Is it a career for you? We had dogs growing up but my husband and son both preferred cats and after a few years I found I loved them just as much as dogs. Quite a shock for someone that grew up thinking cats were nothing more than nuisances.

 

[Sci Fi]

I think we're 16 - 8 when Bledsoe plays. What's our record when he doesn't play?

Thousands of dogs? Is it a career for you? We had dogs growing up but my husband and son both preferred cats and after a few years I found I loved them just as much as dogs. Quite a shock for someone that grew up thinking cats were nothing more than nuisances.

Seriously, I love animals. Even more than the Suns.

Time for bed for me. East coaster here. We'll take this up tomorrow.

Be happy to be a Suns fan.