Antrel Rolle - Decision time in T-Minus 12 days

[dreamcastrocks]

The point isn't that the FO should pay him 12 million. The point, if he is cut, is that the FO was too inept to extend him to a new contract. I hope we can get it done.

Are they inept or unwilling? Two different things.

 

[john h]

I will be really upset if they just let Rolle walk in an uncapped year over money. My issues are:

1) No one to replace him on current roster
2) Limited in FA to replace him
3) Have to spend a draft pick on safety again in 1st half of draft
4) Get nothing in return if we cut him (Keep him next year and he signs elsewhere at least you have a change to get a comp pick)

Who cares how much his contract cost when you can't replace him, aren't we saving enough not having to pay KWs contract??? I know what you are saying about the business end of it, but if we lose KW, Dansby, Rolle this offseason based on money (I know KW isn't based on money), then we are right back where we left off when we let Plummer walk, and didn't sign key FA after our last playoff run.

We have a number of players, who are mostly core players, we need and who want more money than many think they are worth. Clearly you cannot let them all walk and clearly you will end up paying some players more than the team would like. The goal of the team is both to earn money and to win a championship. The Cards are likely to take the middle ground on this. Some teams have such a following they can do both (Washington and the Cowboys). They can pay big money and still make a big profit. Some owners are in this as much to win as to make money. The Cards for many years were in this to make money and apparently winning was not that high on their list. They may have at last come to realize that to maximize profits you may have to increase payroll for a few years to buildup a following and fill up the stadium. I do not know just what the net worth of the Cards owners are but probably not as much as most of the NFL owners and Mr. B has always been tight with his money. Did he change when his son took over? Probably some but he still has a lot of the old Mr. B in his blood.

Since the Bidwills paid only $50,000 for the team and it is now worth around $800,000,000 they have already made their fortune even with capital gains. I suspect Obama will up the Capital Gains tax significantly before he is finished.

 

[Cbus cardsfan]

Let's say Rolle is released and Boldin traded. That's Dansby, Warner, Boldin,Gandy, Berry, Okeafor, and Rolle gone. That's about 33% of your starters. McFadden could be gone also. That's 37% and not one PROVEN guy to replace any of them. Then there's the money factor. Does anyone think the Cards will spend that money. And before Joe jumps in, i know they have to re-up the RFA'S but that's a small dent in the 35+ mill in actual salaries possibly coming off the books. I see nobody but DD that's in line for a big pay raise and that's not even a priority. We all know the Cards are more likely to sign Stevie Baggs than a Vince Wilfork. There is no reason we shouldn't be able to keep what Graves calls the so-called core of the team.

 

[Duckjake]

That's obviously the case now, but I think that Dansby has been more consistent than DRC the last season, and so if he were on the roster I'd still consider him a core player. I'd also like to see Calais do it again for another season before I'm ready to add him to the core.

But you're right that the core of the team evolves. For me, as medicore as Adrian Wilson was the last half of the season, I would suggest that Rolle is probably more of an important member of the unit (recognizing that Rolle overruns plays and fails to make easy tackles and all his other weaknesses) unless Wilson bounces back big-time.

In another year, I think that the core of the D will be exactly what you say it is.

And I think you're exactly right about Rashad Johnson. Him being terrible his rookie season and not getting with the program really, really hurt the team. We'll likely see Matt Ware: Starting Free safety next season. And I don't like that one bit.

What makes all this even worse is that Clark Haggans played as well as anybody last year, you can make the case that McFadden was an improvement over Hood, Alan Branch played much better and our defense was still horribly inconsistent.

Play great, get a big lead and go in the tank. Let guys like Maurice Morris and Justin Forsett run all over you but stuff the Texans in a great goal line stand. Play great against the Giants and pick Manning 3 times and then the next week give up 270 yards rushing to Carolina.

Let Vince Young throw for 300+ and allow a 99 yard game losing drive then shut down Farve and the Vikings and then let Gore rush for 165 the next week and follow that up by forcing 7 turnovers in the next two games.

Definitely a group that will have you using the smiley.

 

[Buckybird]

The point isn't that the FO should pay him 12 million. The point, if he is cut, is that the FO was too inept to extend him to a new contract. I hope we can get it done.

Exactly!!!

All I ever heard from Graves in interviews the last 3-4 years is how he wanted to extend "core players". I guess his eneptitude with not being able to extend Rolle will be strike 3. Boldin, Dansby & now Rolle. I guess Leinart, DD & Levi will be next.

Rod Graves is either an idiot or ownership has his hands tied. To think the players don't see it & think it won't hinder negotiations with players in the future is naive.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Exactly!!!

All I ever heard from Graves in interviews the last 3-4 years is how he wanted to extend "core players". I guess his eneptitude with not being able to extend Rolle will be strike 3. Boldin, Dansby & now Rolle. I guess Leinart, DD & Levi will be next.

Rod Graves is either an idiot or ownership has his hands tied. To think the players don't see it & think it won't hinder negotiations with players in the future is naive.

Both Leinart and Levi I agree with. He should wait for them. I have plenty of confidence that Leinart will be just fine, but we don't know for sure. Levi can go as far as I'm concerned. As for Dockett, he has already re-upped once, so the argument doesn't work with him.

 

[joeshmo]

And before Joe jumps in, i know they have to re-up the RFA'S but that's a small dent in the 35+ mill in actual salaries possibly coming off the books.

First it isnt a small dent. Even if they just do the lowest tender on 5 guys we are talking about 10 mill minimum. Most likely we will hit the 15 mill mark easily. There is also the other 30 players under contract from last year 53 man roster who for the most part have raises in their base salary and/or bonuses. Then there is the need to sign more players to fill out the 53 man roster. We have the second highest amount of UFA's/retires in the league.

 

[joeshmo]

Exactly!!!

All I ever heard from Graves in interviews the last 3-4 years is how he wanted to extend "core players". I guess his eneptitude with not being able to extend Rolle will be strike 3. Boldin, Dansby & now Rolle. I guess Leinart, DD & Levi will be next.

How is Rolle a core player, dont you have to at least be in the top 5 or so players on D or O to be considered a core player? Rolle isnt even in the top 5 best players we have on D. Boldin was extended once before and has been kept through his prime. He does not belong on your list either.

 

[joeshmo]

That's obviously the case now, but I think that Dansby has been more consistent than DRC the last season, and so if he were on the roster I'd still consider him a core player.

I just can say Dansby was more consistent, might be the most inconsistent on our D besides Wilson. Recent articles recently panning some of the bigger name UFA about to be from the NFL.com website. The smashed Dansby and Peppers. Dansby dissapears more then a magician. Thats not core.

 

[Buckybird]

How is Rolle a core player, dont you have to at least be in the top 5 or so players on D or O to be considered a core player? Rolle isnt even in the top 5 best players we have on D. Boldin was extended once before and has been kept through his prime. He does not belong on your list either.

Let me just say this, teams can't just let these types of players all walk & remain threats for a championship. In all likelyhood next season Rolle, Q, & Dansby will be playing for other teams. I'm very frustrated at the non-creativity of Graves or whomever is responsible for keeping our stud players.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

Definitely a group that will have you using the smiley.

+1

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Let me just say this, teams can't just let these types of players all walk & remain threats for a championship. In all likelyhood next season Rolle, Q, & Dansby will be playing for other teams. I'm very frustrated at the non-creativity of Graves or whomever is responsible for keeping our stud players.

OK... tell me how they "creatively" pay Rolle the 12M he wants in first year on a longer term contract?

(Whether it's one year or a five year deal, he, from what I gather, wants the 12M presently owed in the first year.)

http://blog.azcardinals.com/2010/02/21/two-weeks-of-decisions-set-offseasons-course/

 

[Duckjake]

How is Rolle a core player, dont you have to at least be in the top 5 or so players on D or O to be considered a core player? Rolle isnt even in the top 5 best players we have on D. Boldin was extended once before and has been kept through his prime. He does not belong on your list either.

How can anyone say Wilson or DRC or Dockett were core players when they were just as inconsistent as anyone? On the Cards D it seemed like practicing disappearing was a team building event held every Friday.

I've already posted how many times the Cards tried to blow big leads last year. It started when they let David Garrard blow them up in the 2nd half of the Jacksonville game and didn't stop until Dansby ran into the endzone with the game winner against Green Bay.

There is no core on a defense that allows 8 different players to have their highest or second highest single game offensive total of the season while on the other side of the ball.

 

[kerouac9]

I just can say Dansby was more consistent, might be the most inconsistent on our D besides Wilson. Recent articles recently panning some of the bigger name UFA about to be from the NFL.com website. The smashed Dansby and Peppers. Dansby dissapears more then a magician. Thats not core.

Link? I see the article on Peppers, but not on Dansby.

I'm a little surprised to see you make this turnaround on 'Los, Joe. He had 2 games this season where he had fewer than 6 tackles. I guess you can accuse him of not making as many big plays this season as he did last year, but is that a function of him suddenly being bad or that he was forced into coverage more often so that the Cards could cover up Adrian Wilson having a tough season? You know as well as I do that 'Los wasn't given the blitz opportunities this year. It wasn't 'Los who was giving up 40 yard TDs to tight ends and getting picked on in coverage this year. It was #24.

 

[kerouac9]

OK... tell me how they "creatively" pay Rolle the 12M he wants in first year on a longer term contract?

(Whether it's one year or a five year deal, he, from what I gather, wants the 12M presently owed in the first year.)

http://blog.azcardinals.com/2010/02/21/two-weeks-of-decisions-set-offseasons-course/

Because there's no salary cap, it doesn't matter. Give him a $11.5 m bonus and have him play for the veteran minimum this year, $2.5 y2, $3.5 y3, $3.7 y4, $4 y5.

That ends up 5 years, $25.7 million, say you guarantee the first 2 years of the deal, which is $15 million guaranteed. Everyone walks away happy.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

Because there's no salary cap, it doesn't matter. Give him a $11.5 m bonus and have him play for the veteran minimum this year, $2.5 y2, $3.5 y3, $3.7 y4, $4 y5.

That ends up 5 years, $25.7 million, say you guarantee the first 2 years of the deal, which is $15 million guaranteed. Everyone walks away happy.

Oh, I'm certain that you can find a creative response to the issue, but the question was for Bucky.

 

[40yearfan]

I guarantee you nearly every person on this board could run this organization as good as Rod Graves. He probably won't be able to sign himself to an extension (by the way he is due). The human turtle has struck again. Leinart next, then Levi!!!

So you'd be cool if the FO cut Rolle? You'd be cool with the fact that, on an already shaky defense, we'd then have two starters lost with no replacements instead of just one?

Bucky are you serious? Do you really believe the average fan can run this organzation better than Graves? Amazing how some people only look at what they consider to be negatives and completely disregard the positives.

Stout, I am fine with whatever happens. I've seen this current FO team do something no one else has ever been able to accomplish with this team. Why should I now start thinking that they have become inept overnight, have no plan in place and could care less whether we have a winning season this year?

It's obvious you guys don't trust our FO even after the success they've had in the past 3 years. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and at least wait until something bad happens before I pass judgement. Speculation is not something I care to base my opinion on.

 

[Zona_T6]

Where has it said that the Cards are going to release Rolle, or is that just speculation?

Antrel Rolle's impending release should interest Dolphins
Comment


February 22 Palm Beach Post

"There's been a definite connection between the Dolphins and the star-laden Arizona Cardinals this offseason.

The talk of Pahokee native Anquan Boldin possibly going to Miami has been going on for weeks.

The news last week that the Cardinals wouldn't put a franchise tag on linebacker Karlos Dansby combined with a radio interview in which Dansby said he'd love to play for the Dolphins came last week.

And now it's safety Antrel Rolle's turn. A former University of Miami standout who still spends his offseasons in South Florida, Rolle apparently will be released in the coming week, creating sure-fire speculation that he could be the answer to the Dolphins' free safety problem."

 

[Duckjake]

Bucky are you serious? Do you really believe the average fan can run this organzation better than Graves? Amazing how some people only look at what they consider to be negatives and completely disregard the positives.

Stout, I am fine with whatever happens. I've seen this current FO team do something no one else has ever been able to accomplish with this team. Why should I now start thinking that they have become inept overnight, have no plan in place and could care less whether we have a winning season this year?

It's obvious you guys don't trust our FO even after the success they've had in the past 3 years. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and at least wait until something bad happens before I pass judgement. Speculation is not something I care to base my opinion on.

I agree with Bucky. Not an average fan though but just about any hard core fan who has been closely watching football for 25-50 years.

If George Boone could be a key player in personnel decisions anybody could.

 

[Buckybird]

Bucky are you serious? Do you really believe the average fan can run this organzation better than Graves? Amazing how some people only look at what they consider to be negatives and completely disregard the positives.

Stout, I am fine with whatever happens. I've seen this current FO team do something no one else has ever been able to accomplish with this team. Why should I now start thinking that they have become inept overnight, have no plan in place and could care less whether we have a winning season this year?

It's obvious you guys don't trust our FO even after the success they've had in the past 3 years. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and at least wait until something bad happens before I pass judgement. Speculation is not something I care to base my opinion on.

Yes I believe many on this board could do what Graves does as well or better. I can say that with all honesty.

 

[Stout]

Bucky are you serious? Do you really believe the average fan can run this organzation better than Graves? Amazing how some people only look at what they consider to be negatives and completely disregard the positives.

Stout, I am fine with whatever happens. I've seen this current FO team do something no one else has ever been able to accomplish with this team. Why should I now start thinking that they have become inept overnight, have no plan in place and could care less whether we have a winning season this year?

It's obvious you guys don't trust our FO even after the success they've had in the past 3 years. I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and at least wait until something bad happens before I pass judgement. Speculation is not something I care to base my opinion on.

40, I haven't started railing on them, yet. I've said IF they can't get business done. IF is a big word there. If we go into the draft with gaping holes at several key positions, we'll have to draft for need or simply suck. If that happens, I won't be a happy camper, and will rightly blame the front office.

If. That is the big word. I'll wait to see what happens. I don't like the signals coming from FO land, or the lack of signals, but I'll play a wait-and-see game. The FO has done a good job the last few years, but it seems like we've whiffed on the strategy of draft-and-replace this time around. We shall see.

 

[Crazy Canuck]

I guarantee you nearly every person on this board could run this organization as good as Rod Graves. He probably won't be able to sign himself to an extension (by the way he is due). The human turtle has struck again. Leinart next, then Levi!!!

Whoa! I don't share this delusion of adequacy.

 

[Buckybird]

Where has it said that the Cards are going to release Rolle, or is that just speculation?

It's out of necessity due to our failure to work out a deal much like we did with Fitz. Future players Leinart & Levi Brown are staring at the same scenario.

 

[Duckjake]

Whoa! I don't share this delusion of adequacy.

Me either. But I do believe that many hard core, long time fans could do just as good a job. Just look at the people we've had as President of the United States.

 

[40yearfan]

I agree with Bucky. Not an average fan though but just about any hard core fan who has been closely watching football for 25-50 years.

If George Boone could be a key player in personnel decisions anybody could.

C'mon Dj, were not talking George Boone here. Sorry, but I disagree with your statement about the hard core fan being better. It that was the case, they would be working for a football team someplace instead of spouting off on a message board. Anyone who thinks Rod Graves didn't have a hand in building this team isn't being honest with themselves.