For you Contract Wizards - Hopkins & Conner

[dreamcastrocks]

Yea, kind of. That should be the cap charge for your entire RB room for two years, not one guy.

It's hilarious to reframe this very bad and dumb three-year, $21 million dollar deal into a fairly bad and dumb two-year, $16 million contract. Even that average puts him among the top 10 highest-paid RBs in the league and he's nowhere close to that.

Why? We talk about cap hits, dead cap, and cutting players to save cap space all the time. Why should this contract be any different?

 

[Chopper0080]

Yea, kind of. That should be the cap charge for your entire RB room for two years, not one guy.

It's hilarious to reframe this very bad and dumb three-year, $21 million dollar deal into a fairly bad and dumb two-year, $16 million contract. Even that average puts him among the top 10 highest-paid RBs in the league and he's nowhere close to that.

I would argue that his is exacerbated by a poor roster at some very key spots. The 49ers have a roster and a situation where they can overpay for McCaffrey. We don't which means every dollar matters more.

Also, the 49ers will be paying McCaffrey 12 mil next year. The Cardinals will be paying James Conner 10 mil. There isn't 2 mil difference between those two players.

 

[Chopper0080]

Why? We talk about cap hits, dead cap, and cutting players to save cap space all the time. Why should this contract be any different?

Because those are not hallmarks of good deals. Those are hallmarks of bad deals which is why the Conner deal is bad.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I would argue that his is exacerbated by a poor roster at some very key spots. The 49ers have a roster and a situation where they can overpay for McCaffrey. We don't which means every dollar matters more.

Exactly.

Also, the 49ers will be paying McCaffrey 12 mil next year. The Cardinals will be paying James Conner 10 mil. There isn't 2 mil difference between those two players.

That isn't exactly a fair argument. The contract was written to have more cap this year than last but not by much. Plus we all know cap and money values can fluctuate wildly from year to year. Plus he is only getting 5M in year 3.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Because those are not hallmarks of good deals. Those are hallmarks of bad deals which is why the Conner deal is bad.

And/or bad cap management, leading you to cut players, re-work deals etc...

 

[Cheesebeef]

I would argue that his is exacerbated by a poor roster at some very key spots. The 49ers have a roster and a situation where they can overpay for McCaffrey. We don't which means every dollar matters more.

Also, the 49ers will be paying McCaffrey 12 mil next year. The Cardinals will be paying James Conner 10 mil. There isn't 2 mil difference between those two players.

Come on Chopper… that’s giving way too much credit to McCaffrey who was obviously the key figure in a bad trade for that in no way buttressed the entire Niners offense on their 3rd QB, without their best weapon in Deebo and having won 9 games in a row.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Come on Chopper… that’s giving way too much credit to McCaffrey who was obviously the key figure in a bad trade for that in no way buttressed the entire Niners offense on their 3rd QB, without their best weapon in Deebo and having won 9 games in a row.

 

[Cheesebeef]

It is on topic. We’re looking at paying a mediocre RB 10 million bucks next year, pretty much taking up all the cap money any rational team should spend at RB and using McAffrey as basis for comparison why the allocation of that much money to a mediocre and consistently dinged up Conner makes no sense.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

It is on topic. We’re looking at paying a mediocre RB 10 million bucks next year, pretty much taking up all the cap money any rational team should spend at RB

While only paying him 1.75 last year that he grossly outperformed by any standard.

and using McAffrey as basis for comparison why the allocation of that much money to a mediocre and consistently dinged up Conner makes no sense.

So why did you bring him up then?

 

[kerouac9]

While only paying him 1.75 last year that he grossly outperformed by any standard.

So why did you bring him up then?

Who cares? You want all 52 players on your roster outperforming their pay grade.

 

[Cheesebeef]

While only paying him 1.75 last year that he grossly outperformed by any standard.

So why did you bring him up then?

Who cares what he did the year before? Only morons in the NFL pay for PAST performance.

My lord… are you actually Adrian Wilson? I’d ask if you’re Keim, but Brit’s got that spot pretty locked down.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Who cares? You want all 52 players on your roster outperforming their pay grade.

Lol… Borg.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Who cares? You want all 52 players on your roster outperforming their pay grade.

Of course you do. It isn't feasible or realistic.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Who cares what he did the year before? Only morons in the NFL pay for PAST performance.

You do realize who WAS our GM don't you? I'm not telling you what I would do, only what I believe happened.

My lord… are you actually Adrian Wilson? I’d ask if you’re Keim, but Brit’s got that spot pretty locked down.

If I were, I clearly wouldn't be wasting my work day and free time talking to you.

 

[oaken1]

He was a huge reason we were doing well last year in the first place (with an incredibly, ridiculously low salary). His contract didn't matter this year since it had nothing to do with us losing and a cheaper RB option wouldn't have changed our record (or the extra cap it provided)

My whataboutism? Haha. Tell us how some mystery rb would have totally worked in our favor and changed our fortunes.

Please give us a suck of this foresight nipple. Us plebs must see the light as we are so lost in the dark.

I dunno... maybe if we used 6mil of connors salary to sign a guard?

 

[Zalixar]

I dunno... maybe if we used 6mil of connors salary to sign a guard?

Of course he was overpaid, but that wasn't the point of anything I said previously. Just gunna have to take a pass on this season and maybe next.

 

[Stout]

James Connor? We aren't handcuffed by that contract by any means. He is coming close to earning his contract too.

Why don't we divide his contract by the actual number of games he plays to calculate that.

 

[Stout]

He has a hate fetish with Connor. No point in arguing.

Actually, I loved him coming out of college and actually wanted him to do well as a Stiller. He's a local college player and a good comeback story. I just never, ever wanted us to sign him because he's always hurt at a critical juncture. Which he has been both years with us.

 

[Stout]

Do we really think that a 2 year 16M contract for Connor is terrible? I don't. I don't think it is great either. That is what it boils down to. They can cut him after next year with a 2M cap hit.

I also think they overpaid him a bit considering the fact that he wildly outplayed his 1 year 1.75M contract from before.

Prime moronic Keim right there.

 

[General Chaos]

How do retirements impact the salary cap? Are we still on the hook for part of Watt’s deal next year? Same would go for Hudson who should be retiring too given the cards talked him out of it to then barely play this year.

 

[kerouac9]

How do retirements impact the salary cap? Are we still on the hook for part of Watt’s deal next year? Same would go for Hudson who should be retiring too given the cards talked him out of it to then barely play this year.

For retirements, only pro-rated bonuses remain applied to the cap. The player goes on the "reserve-retired" list; their scheduled base salaries aren't paid or accounted for.

Watt is a pending free agent with three (!!!!) voided years on his deal. He'll have a $7.2 million dead cap charge.

 

[ASUCHRIS]

While only paying him 1.75 last year that he grossly outperformed by any standard.

You pay them for what they're going to do, not what they've done!

Watt is a pending free agent with three (!!!!) voided years on his deal. He'll have a $7.2 million dead cap charge.

Over 10 million alone in dead money on the defensive line? Keim time!

 

[BritCard]

Do we really think that a 2 year 16M contract for Connor is terrible? I don't. I don't think it is great either. That is what it boils down to. They can cut him after next year with a 2M cap hit.

I also think they overpaid him a bit considering the fact that he wildly outplayed his 1 year 1.75M contract from before.

Yea, kind of. That should be the cap charge for your entire RB room for two years, not one guy.

It's hilarious to reframe this very bad and dumb three-year, $21 million dollar deal into a fairly bad and dumb two-year, $16 million contract. Even that average puts him among the top 10 highest-paid RBs in the league and he's nowhere close to that.

I'm with Dreamcast here. It's not a bad deal at all whether you look at it over 2 or 3 years.

The whole "Paid as a top 10 running back" thing is misleading because so few running backs make it to big money 2nd contracts with the team that drafted them. A lot get injured or burn out depending on their age coming into the league. They get ridden hard and dumped. Which is what happened with Conner and Fournette.

There are only 8 starting running backs in the league on 2nd contracts with the teams that drafted them and they are the 8 highest paid.

Ignoring Barkley that is on his 5th year option that next highest paid RB's are Aaron Jones and Joe Mixon on $12m per year. There is a $5m gap with Conner on $7m per year with Fournette. I think it's safe to say Conner has outperformed him.

Next is Nyheim Hines on $6.2m who barely played for the Colts and now barely plays for the Bills. He has 33 yards rushing on 24 attempts despite being healthy all year.

Then you have Ekeler who is the only outlier here on a deal he signed nearly 3 years ago at $6.125 per year.

Then Chase Edmunds on $6.05m. Enough said there.

Then Kareem hunt on $6m with 455 yards this year.

I don't think anyone can look at the running back salary table as it stands and not say Conner is exactly where he should be. And frankly its nuts to judge him on this years stats with what he has had to work with on the O line.

What do you think he was going to get paid? $3-4m? You're dreaming. His absolute floor was $6m per year so the arguing he's getting $7m is a waste of time.

 

[Stout]

I'm with Dreamcast here. It's not a bad deal at all whether you look at it over 2 or 3 years.

The whole "Paid as a top 10 running back" thing is misleading because so few running backs make it to big money 2nd contracts with the team that drafted them. A lot get injured or burn out depending on their age coming into the league. They get ridden hard and dumped. Which is what happened with Conner and Fournette.

There are only 8 starting running backs in the league on 2nd contracts with the teams that drafted them and they are the 8 highest paid.

Ignoring Barkley that is on his 5th year option that next highest paid RB's are Aaron Jones and Joe Mixon on $12m per year. There is a $5m gap with Conner on $7m per year with Fournette. I think it's safe to say Conner has outperformed him.

Next is Nyheim Hines on $6.2m who barely played for the Colts and now barely plays for the Bills. He has 33 yards rushing on 24 attempts despite being healthy all year.

Then you have Ekeler who is the only outlier here on a deal he signed nearly 3 years ago at $6.125 per year.

Then Chase Edmunds on $6.05m. Enough said there.

Then Kareem hunt on $6m with 455 yards this year.

I don't think anyone can look at the running back salary table as it stands and not say Conner is exactly where he should be. And frankly its nuts to judge him on this years stats with what he has had to work with on the O line.

What do you think he was going to get paid? $3-4m? You're dreaming. His absolute floor was $6m per year so the arguing he's getting $7m is a waste of time.

The first part of this statement fits well with the latter part

It's not a good contract. Most people on here know that.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

I'm with Dreamcast here. It's not a bad deal at all whether you look at it over 2 or 3 years.

The whole "Paid as a top 10 running back" thing is misleading because so few running backs make it to big money 2nd contracts with the team that drafted them. A lot get injured or burn out depending on their age coming into the league. They get ridden hard and dumped. Which is what happened with Conner and Fournette.

There are only 8 starting running backs in the league on 2nd contracts with the teams that drafted them and they are the 8 highest paid.

Ignoring Barkley that is on his 5th year option that next highest paid RB's are Aaron Jones and Joe Mixon on $12m per year. There is a $5m gap with Conner on $7m per year with Fournette. I think it's safe to say Conner has outperformed him.

Next is Nyheim Hines on $6.2m who barely played for the Colts and now barely plays for the Bills. He has 33 yards rushing on 24 attempts despite being healthy all year.

Then you have Ekeler who is the only outlier here on a deal he signed nearly 3 years ago at $6.125 per year.

Then Chase Edmunds on $6.05m. Enough said there.

Then Kareem hunt on $6m with 455 yards this year.

I don't think anyone can look at the running back salary table as it stands and not say Conner is exactly where he should be. And frankly its nuts to judge him on this years stats with what he has had to work with on the O line.

What do you think he was going to get paid? $3-4m? You're dreaming. His absolute floor was $6m per year so the arguing he's getting $7m is a waste of time.

Rarified air