Marion

[Savage58]

Do you understand the concept that even if a player is good, someone else might be better?

Umm yeah... Do you realize this thread is calling him worthless, how ******** is that? Are you in this cluster of haters who thinks Marion is worthless? That's just ridiculous!!

Pure hate, I just don't get it.

 

[Chaplin]

Umm yeah... Do you realize this thread is calling him worthless, how ******** is that? Are you in this cluster of haters who thinks Marion is worthless? That's just ridiculous!!

Pure hate, I just don't get it.

You obviously don't get it.

There are people that are tired of a few things:

1) His tendency to disappear in the playoffs

2) His attitude pretty much the entire year

But those same people still appreciate:

1) His hustle

2) His athletic ability

Now, we have a thread that discusses these pros and cons of Marion, and you call it hate. There is some here, but this whole thread isn't "worthless", as you so eloquently put it (and, I might add, have also contributed to).

There is a possibility, however remote, that Kevin Garnett might be traded this summer. Are you saying that you prefer Shawn Marion over Garnett? If so, that's your right, but why don't you detail WHY you think that, rather than whine about others that prefer Garnett over Marion, and who have detailed those opinions on this thread?

 

[elindholm]

Umm yeah... Do you realize this thread is calling him worthless

It is?

how ******** is that?

I don't know. How ******** is it to be unable to understand the basics of what you're reading?

Are you in this cluster of haters who thinks Marion is worthless?

Of course not.

 

[Savage58]

Trade his worthless playoff hide as soon as we possibly can.

You may have missed this part of the first post by the OP. Pay attention to that one. There are others in the thread equally as hateful. This thread started out as hate, how can you deny that? But I do understand frustration. So if you want to live in that world, go right ahead, I will call'em as I see'em.

Now, I do appreciate that you aren't a Marion hater, but you have to take the good with the bad, he's a top 20 player in the NBA easily IMHO. Trade him immediately but for what? Some folks saying Garnett eh, are we deluding ourselves, I think so. We'll see.

Now, we have a thread that discusses these pros and cons of Marion, and you call it hate. There is some here, but this whole thread isn't "worthless", as you so eloquently put it (and, I might add, have also contributed to).

Then you obviously know who I am talking about.

Calling a top 20 NBA player worthless is hate anyway you look at it. That or stupidity. I'm not calling any posters out, it's just the hate that it brings forth, and I just don't get it, we're IN THE PLAYOFFS, up 2-1 and on our way to the conference finals, get a grip.

As for Garnett for Marion straight up, I might be convinced to pull that trigger, but you want to start throwing in LB and others and I think it starts to take away from the team, yeah we could have Stat and KG next to each other, who would care if we don't have a team around them to help out. Stud players need a supporting cast, and I think we're REAL close to being Champs, we don't need an aging KG, we could use him, but we definately don't need to trade away great young players for him IMO. If Amare wasn't injured, do you think this would even be a realistic thread?

Healthy Amare = NBA Champs imo, he was that good. Injuries are hampering us this playoff season, not Marion. I think we should hang on to that one.

 

[TBaslim]

Are you saying that you prefer Shawn Marion over Garnett?

Yes. I will say that.

Why?

Chemistry.

It is incredibly underrated in pro sports. This Suns team has it in spades. They all seem to like each other. The lockerroom vibe appears to be one of the best in the league. And it is a key component of their success.

Marion is a huge part of that. His skills and personality fit exactly what the Suns need. He does all sorts of stuff on the court most players cannot, and he's generally mellow and laid-back off the court. He's the perfect compliment to Nash and Amare. Those 3 are the foundation.

KG is a heck of a talent, but the guy is wound WAY too tight. He must squeeze out a diamond every day. How many ex-Twolves reported that it was a fun place to play? They all seemed to portray a miserable lockerroom.

So, for this Suns team (all healthy, of course), Marion > KG.

Also, people are undervaluing Barbosa's worth. In another year or two, with more age and experience, he's going to be a total stud. Like Marion, you can't teach his athletic gifts. Fastest guard in the league AND solid shooter? Money.

 

[joshstmarie]

can score when he wants too

hardly, when you talk about a guy that can score when he wants too, a few names that come to mind are Lebron, Wade, Tmac, Ray Allen, Kobe and even to a lesser extent Nash, Manu ect.

 

[Chaplin]

Yes. I will say that.

Why?

Chemistry.

If we were talking about any other level of talent other than Kevin Garnett, you'd have a point. But this isn't a Shawn Marion for Luke Walton trade--this is a Shawn Marion for Kevin Garnett trade.

Also, people are undervaluing Barbosa's worth. In another year or two, with more age and experience, he's going to be a total stud. Like Marion, you can't teach his athletic gifts. Fastest guard in the league AND solid shooter? Money.

That's right he's money--too much money in the long run, probably.

 

[elindholm]

You may have missed this part of the first post by the OP. Pay attention to that one.

Fair enough. In fact, the "trade Marion for Garnett" chatter has been rampant on this board since the playoffs started, but you're correct that this particular thread started out more "hateful" than the others.

Since you joined the conversation late, I'll bring you up to speed on the major points of the "pro-trade" camp:

1. The Suns can't afford to keep all of their players anyway. The extensions to Diaw and Barbosa will put the team deep into luxury tax range in 2008-09, and that doesn't even count the guaranteed contracts of the first-round draft picks.

2. Garnett makes more than Marion, but he makes less than Marion, Barbosa (once extended), and the two picks combined. Thus the trade actually saves money for the Suns, or is roughly a wash if you figure that they'll have to fill out the roster with some other cheap players.

3. The "chemistry" on the current Suns team is overrated. It's clear that Marion resents his position as the second or third brightest star in the constellation. Teams with great chemistry don't have a star player who complains to the media at least once a month about how under-appreciated he is.

4. The offensive skills of Stoudemire and Garnett would complement each other perfectly.

 

[Cheesebeef]

As for Garnett for Marion straight up, I might be convinced to pull that trigger,...

MIGHT be convinced - dude - all credibility goes out the window here.

And HEALTHY AMARE ain't happening for at least a couple years - to think otherwise is incredibly myopic.

 

[George O'Brien]

You may have missed this part of the first post by the OP. Pay attention to that one.

Fair enough. In fact, the "trade Marion for Garnett" chatter has been rampant on this board since the playoffs started, but you're correct that this particular thread started out more "hateful" than the others.

Since you joined the conversation late, I'll bring you up to speed on the major points of the "pro-trade" camp:

1. The Suns can't afford to keep all of their players anyway. The extensions to Diaw and Barbosa will put the team deep into luxury tax range in 2008-09, and that doesn't even count the guaranteed contracts of the first-round draft picks.

2. Garnett makes more than Marion, but he makes less than Marion, Barbosa (once extended), and the two picks combined. Thus the trade actually saves money for the Suns, or is roughly a wash if you figure that they'll have to fill out the roster with some other cheap players.

3. The "chemistry" on the current Suns team is overrated. It's clear that Marion resents his position as the second or third brightest star in the constellation. Teams with great chemistry don't have a star player who complains to the media at least once a month about how under-appreciated he is.

4. The offensive skills of Stoudemire and Garnett would complement each other perfectly.

I have no doubt this would be a good trade for the Suns assuming KG agrees to it. My doubts are entirely on the Wolve side.

Would KG fit. Granted he hasn't done well with other big men, but mostly because they didn't work hard enough. KG plays well away from the basket, so he wouldn't interfer with the Nash to Amare pick and roll. The only real issue would be whether he could deal with not being the main man, but after years of futility he's probably ready to blend in with an already top team.

 

[elindholm]

My doubts are entirely on the Wolve side.

Yes. In case anyone missed it the first twelve times I wrote it, this speculation makes sense only if Minnesota decides they need to move Garnett this summer. If they want to keep him, no offer is going to make any difference.

 

[boisesuns]

I think most of the people who want to trade Marion would only trade him if we can get KG. To me, if KG is there, you take it.

If KG is not there, Marion is worth keeping around. He already fits in well, and does great things for the team. BUt given the CHOICE between the two, which is all we are talking about, KG's strengths would put this team over the top.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I think most of the people who want to trade Marion would only trade him if we can get KG. To me, if KG is there, you take it.

If KG is not there, Marion is worth keeping around. He already fits in well, and does great things for the team. BUt given the CHOICE between the two, which is all we are talking about, KG's strengths would put this team over the top.

that's just it - but for some reason, people take such offense to an criticism of Marion that they completely blow whatever is said out of proportion as if they're feelings are hurt - that doens't make sense to me.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Cheese,

Please lighten up on your posts. Tone down the rhetoric.

You can say what you have to say without coming off like you do. Seriously man. The goal is to keep traffic on the board, not drive it away.

 

[SirStefan32]

I think Cheese's posting is just fine.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Cheese,

Please lighten up on your posts. Tone down the rhetoric.

You can say what you have to say without coming off like you do. Seriously man. The goal is to keep traffic on the board, not drive it away.

Chris - I already tried to get banned... then flat out asked you to ban me... you didn't... we reap what we sow... just get it over with and ban me already if you don't like my posts - I won't hold it against you as I've already told you.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Chris - I already tried to get banned... then flat out asked you to ban me... you didn't... we reap what we sow... just get it over with and ban me already if you don't like my posts - I won't hold it against you as I've already told you.

No...I like you too much to ban you unless you REALLY push the envelope and I would rather you didn't.

Rag on Marion all you want, just try not to destroy your fellow posters while doing so =)

 

[Joe Mama]

Cheese, are you still pulling this "save me from myself" bullcrap?

Joe Mama

 

[Cheesebeef]

Cheese, are you still pulling this "save me from myself" bullcrap?

Joe Mama

you know it Joe! I leaked a little bit and the floodgates broke wide-open and now I'm addicted again... *********.

 

[Nasser22]

This thread=locked until the end of the playoffs please. Marion doesen't deserve this **** after everything today. He got hurt twice near the end and was still in their playing defense down low and helping us win. I love Marion!

 

[az1965]

Matrix was just HUGE! That looked like a bad twist but he came right back in... Big heart, big game.

 

[jibikao]

Marion had an A game but those soft misses (or blocked) and 2 missed FT in the 4th Q were huge. Both he and Nash collapsed in the end. I hate that Nash's 3pt to win the game.

 

[devilalum]

Marion had an A game but those soft misses (or blocked) and 2 missed FT in the 4th Q were huge. Both he and Nash collapsed in the end. I hate that Nash's 3pt to win the game.

Marion missed those free throws because he just got the crap knocked out of him on Brands FLAGRANT foul.

Anybody that still says Marion is a playoff choker is crazy. He may not put up All Star numbers every night but he has now had a few monster games. Even his so called bad games have really been ok.

 

[TucsonDevil]

Not only was Matrix HUGE, but his stock continues to rise. If we did decide to trade him, we could maximize our return.

 

[Chaplin]

This thread=locked until the end of the playoffs please. Marion doesen't deserve this **** after everything today. He got hurt twice near the end and was still in their playing defense down low and helping us win. I love Marion!

Come on. Why are you twisting the whole reason for this thread?

There's not one poster on this board that won't say that Marion was unbelievable tonight. I just wish he could do it every night--or at least come close to it every night.