Skelton

[az1965]

Put the whole package together of BOTH players since they started in Arizona last year! Not even close dude!!! The stats as you show, say so! Again, Kolb isn't a stud, but he's light years better than Skelton!!! Always will be.

Kolb may be overall better, but slightly... and that has been my point that some of the posters are over reacting.

 

[Russ Smith]

That's funny because that's exactly what Skelton was better at as he replaced Kolb last year and suddenly we rediscovered Andre Roberts and Doucet... Skelton was distributing the ball while Kolb was locking in on Larry. Kolb seemed to improve this year in this regard but reverted to some of the same problems during the two game losing streak.

He did later in the year yes. It was the first SF game, his worst game, that apparently taught him that. Having the announcers tell us that SF said they didn't have to gameplan for Skelton because he just stared down Fitz and would throw the ball to them if they waited seemed to finally open his eyes and as you said he did get better.

Problem is so far this year he's not that guy, he's the guy before that game who doesn't seem to know what to do if the first guy is covered, which he usually is since it's so obvious Fitz is that guy.

I strongly hope that last stat padding drive got Skelton's confidence back he actually did have to make a few reads on that drive find an open man because Fitz wasn't open. He actually rediscovered Roberts. Really hope that continues next week and beyond.

 

[Buckybird]

I'm looking at this year when both QB's had full off season to work with.

Your saying Skelton has played even remotely as well as Kolb this year!

 

[az1965]

Another thing is, our offense is so struggling and the margin of error is so small... early things went our way and we won:

SEA: Last drive to score a TD and then very strong defensive stand with multiple opportunities from within red zone due to interference penalties. If it had been an experienced QB and not rookie Wilson (who is bad), we could have lost there.

NE: Last second missed FG by NE after we fumble in side 30.

MIA: Last second 4th and 10 TD throw to send to OT.

So except for a solid performance against Eagles, we could have been easily 1-3 in the first four games instead of 4-0.


Last three games, things did not go our way and it really has been 2-3 plays here and there on offense or ST that could have changed the results and we could have been 3-0 in the last three games.

If Skelton had not thrown that pick six... we would be talking a great win and more than decent performance by Skelton:

Today: 25/36 (69.4%); 262 yards; 7.3 avg; TD 1; Int 1 (killer); Rtg 88.0

Tell me that stat line is not above decent if you take that one pick six away...

 

[az1965]

Your saying Skelton has played even remotely as well as Kolb this year!

With stats to show and not emotions like your... YES.

 

[az1965]

He did later in the year yes. It was the first SF game, his worst game, that apparently taught him that. Having the announcers tell us that SF said they didn't have to gameplan for Skelton because he just stared down Fitz and would throw the ball to them if they waited seemed to finally open his eyes and as you said he did get better.

Problem is so far this year he's not that guy, he's the guy before that game who doesn't seem to know what to do if the first guy is covered, which he usually is since it's so obvious Fitz is that guy.

I strongly hope that last stat padding drive got Skelton's confidence back he actually did have to make a few reads on that drive find an open man because Fitz wasn't open. He actually rediscovered Roberts. Really hope that continues next week and beyond.

I think both our QB's have struggled with that last year and some this year... but I also think both showed they can do better. Skelton last year improved and Kolb first four games this year.

Here are Skelton's distributions today:

Roberts 7/103
Housler 5/54
LSH 4/45
Fitz 4/29
Doucet 3/19
Floyd 1/7
Powell 1/5

Certainly not locking on Fitz, though I would have liked to see couple of more throws to Fitz to exploit matches... there was their rookie CB at times on Fitz.

 

[Buckybird]

If Skelton had not thrown that pick six... we would be talking a great win and more than decent performance by Skelton:

Today: 25/36 (69.4%); 262 yards; 7.3 avg; TD 1; Int 1 (killer); Rtg 88.0

Tell me that stat line is not above decent if you take that one pick six away...

You do realize that Skelton is averaging over a pick per game in his career 16 games right? Thats absolutely horrible...worse than Jamarcus Russell bad!!!

Think about that one!

 

[Jetstream Green]

Put the whole package together of BOTH players since they started in Arizona last year! Not even close dude!!! The stats as you show, say so! Again, Kolb isn't a stud, but he's light years better than Skelton!!! Always will be.

absolutely

 

[PJ1]

Here are Kolb's talented pinky finger gems:

NE: 15/27 (55.6%); 140 yards; 5.2 avg; TD 1; Int 0, Rtg 82.3
PHI: 17/24 (70.8%); 222 yards; 9.3 avg; TD 2; Int 0; Rtg 127.4
MIA: 29/48 (60.4%) 324 yards (it took 48 throws inc OT!); 6.8 avg; TD 3; Int 2; Rtg 84.0
STL: 28/50 (56.0%); 289 yards (it took 50 throws!); 5.8 avg; TD 0; Int 0; Rtg 72.8
BUF: 14/26 (53.8%); 128 yards (thru 3+ quarters); 4.9 avg; TD 1; Int 1; Rtg 64.3

You forgot the Seattle game when he bailed us out with a winning drive.

 

[Russ Smith]

I think both our QB's have struggled with that last year and some this year... but I also think both showed they can do better. Skelton last year improved and Kolb first four games this year.

Here are Skelton's distributions today:

Roberts 7/103
Housler 5/54
LSH 4/45
Fitz 4/29
Doucet 3/19
Floyd 1/7
Powell 1/5

Certainly not locking on Fitz, though I would have liked to see couple of more throws to Fitz to exploit matches... there was their rookie CB at times on Fitz.

5 of those catches by Roberts were on the last 2 drives of the game, 4 on the last one including the TD. During the main part of the game when it was close Fitz and housler were being keyed on and Roberts was silent. I asked it 2-3 times on the game thread when is Skelton going to find Roberts.

Most of the catches by Doucet and Floyd were screens, set plays, not the QB spreading it around but the OC designing plays to get someone else the ball.

 

[az1965]

5 of those catches by Roberts were on the last 2 drives of the game, 4 on the last one including the TD. During the main part of the game when it was close Fitz and housler were being keyed on and Roberts was silent. I asked it 2-3 times on the game thread when is Skelton going to find Roberts.

Most of the catches by Doucet and Floyd were screens, set plays, not the QB spreading it around but the OC designing plays to get someone else the ball.

So why exclude the last two drives?

That is not QB's fault if OC is designing specific plays.

Targets:
Roberts 9
Housler 7
LSH 5
Fitz 7
Doucet 6

Seems pretty even.

 

[Russ Smith]

So why exclude the last two drives?

That is not QB's fault if OC is designing specific plays.

Targets:
Roberts 9
Housler 7
LSH 5
Fitz 7
Doucet 6

Seems pretty even.

Because the last 2 drives were not indicative of the real game. Especially the last one where they were in a prevent. Even on that drive Skelton was routinely running the play clock down before the snap for no apparent reason.

You don't seem to get it you said he was spreading the ball around, I was pointing out HE wasn't, the OC was with designed screens. When the play wasn't specifically designed to go to someone else, Skelton almost always went to Fitz or Housler or tried to. At least 5 of those targets to Roberts were the last 2 drives. the rest of the game when the game was won or lost, he barely used Roberts.

There was one play in the 3rd quarter a first down play action where he threw to Housler with FOUR defenders around him. How it didn't get picked I don't know, I actually do he of course missed him and luckily the 4th defender was not able to get it. had the throw been closer to Housler it likely would have been picked.

I REALLY hope that last drive was an eye opener for him and he plays well next week I don't think I can take 4 losses in a row.

Especially since the first 3 were all winnable games if we got any kind of play out of the QB position and just a little better OL play.

 

[az1965]

You forgot the Seattle game when he bailed us out with a winning drive.

I did not include it since it was just one drive. But, yes, that was a big win!

 

[az1965]

Because the last 2 drives were not indicative of the real game. Especially the last one where they were in a prevent. Even on that drive Skelton was routinely running the play clock down before the snap for no apparent reason.

You don't seem to get it you said he was spreading the ball around, I was pointing out HE wasn't, the OC was with designed screens. When the play wasn't specifically designed to go to someone else, Skelton almost always went to Fitz or Housler or tried to. At least 5 of those targets to Roberts were the last 2 drives. the rest of the game when the game was won or lost, he barely used Roberts.

There was one play in the 3rd quarter a first down play action where he threw to Housler with FOUR defenders around him. How it didn't get picked I don't know, I actually do he of course missed him and luckily the 4th defender was not able to get it. had the throw been closer to Housler it likely would have been picked.

I REALLY hope that last drive was an eye opener for him and he plays well next week I don't think I can take 4 losses in a row.

Especially since the first 3 were all winnable games if we got any kind of play out of the QB position and just a little better OL play.

Yes, I don't get it because to me the last two drives were part of real game whether prevent or not. Fitz was mostly doubled and Roberts was getting open so he went to Roberts. Housler throw with four defenders around was bad.

 

[Totally_Red]

If anything John Skelton has regressed this season. He still can't seem to go through progressions and find an open receiver if his initial read is covered. His accuracy is inconsistent. And his turnovers are fatal.

He's not the only problem with the Cardinal offense, but he is one of the worst quarterbacks in the National Football League IMO. I'm not sure if Richard Bartel would be an improvement, but this season is going to [continue to] go south in a hurry if the offense doesn't improve.

 

[RugbyMuffin]

So it's just a complete coincidence again that our line play improves two years in a row when Skelton is in there?

When Kolb backpedals on almost every play and allows those easy angles then him getting less time is on him. Kolb sucks, Skelton is atrocious. Why can't people see this?

Give it up. This is a pro-Kolb board.

When Kolb sux its the OL. When Skelton sux it is the QB.

Nothing changes that.

Double Deuce played pretty poor yesterday & I leave the analysis at that. No want to debate bais anymore and attempt to talk about the situation since it won't be porductive.



Sent from Rugbymuffin's Super Phone

 

[Russ Smith]

Yes, I don't get it because to me the last two drives were part of real game whether prevent or not. Fitz was mostly doubled and Roberts was getting open so he went to Roberts. Housler throw with four defenders around was bad.

Because they weren't playing a prevent most of the game. Once they did he took the open plays to Roberts. Against their actual real defense, he didn't look for Roberts at all.

Fitz was mostly doubled the whole game but Skelton continued to try and get the ball to him until the last 2 drives.

 

[Southpaw]

He is proving why he was a reach in round 5.

 

[Russ Smith]

Give it up. This is a pro-Kolb board.

When Kolb sux its the OL. When Skelton sux it is the QB.

Nothing changes that.

Double Deuce played pretty poor yesterday & I leave the analysis at that. No want to debate bais anymore and attempt to talk about the situation since it won't be porductive.



Sent from Rugbymuffin's Super Phone

You are entitled to that opinion but I disagree. When Kolb was playing we had threads game after game about all the missed throws, the holding the ball too long etc. We had huge threads dissecting potentially big plays he missed after every game.

Skelton started so he's getting the scrutiny and because we were throwing the ball so short yesterday, it's even more obvious he struggles with accuracy. When you see Doucet almost diving to catch a screen thrown right, or falling down because he had to turn to catch a short pass to the left, that's lack of accuracy because the passes are so short and run after catch is totally dependent on the ball being thrown well.

He was rusty and will hopefully be sharper next week, if he's not we're in big trouble you can't win with that inaccurate a QB running a short passing attack you basically need 2 completions to move the chains.

 

[john h]

Master of the foot throw. Now if out WRs could only catch with their feet! DD you suck!

Kolb Skelton or Skelton Kolb it makes no difference. We are never going far with either. Kolb will never last a season without an injury and is just a C- player at best. Skelton can have a good game or a bad game but is probably tough enough to last a season. He is probably a D+ QB. Fact is we do not have a NFL starting QB on this team. Not now or 2 years from now. These QBs are what they are. Neither is an NFL starting QB or worth arguing which is the best. QB is clearly our greatest need and we should draft one first every year until we someday find one. I understand we need OTs, etc but first and foremost you start building a team with a QB. Who is the last real QB we had that we drafted. I think it was Neil Lomax which has been a long time ago. That was one of our best draft years as I recall. We got an A or A+. How many good QBs have we passed on since then? No clue but probably several. We will likely draft in the top 10 this year. If Tyler Wilson is there then take him. He want last out of the first round and is NFL ready having played his full college career in the SEC.

Here we are 7 games into the season and we all know our season, as far as the playoffs is concerned, is over. Even with a 4-3 record.

 

[Bobcat]

Shane you are so wrong about Johns performance today. Ya it is OK for both Manning, and Drew B. to fumble away balls have 6 int's in a game but our QB Skelton get his arm hit while running for his life with his arm going forward
in which the play should have been reviewed and revised. please don't tell me any different on my 65 inch 1080I HDTV' I really saw it up close.

John has now played about 16 NFL games if even that many. He is doing a lot better than Vick Sanchez, Palmer, Minn's QB, et al.

Our Offensive Line SUCKS big time as we all know. Grimm must go and go NOW not at the end of the year, BUT NOW...!!! His 1980 OL play doesn't work in the NFL today, ZONE BLOCKING schemes is what works in todays NFL . JUst look at Denver's, Houston's, Washington's, Seattle's, all use Zone Blocking. Best running teams in the league oops I forgot Titan's.

WE hew on this forum ME included seem to point fingers, but in this case you are really wrong. Skelton had a QB rating of 88.0 yesterday with 292 passing Yards.

GRIM must GO, and John just requires time to figure things out.

 

[Bobcat]

he threw several good passes, and it's never all on one player.

#19 gave a good effort today.

With that said, KK should be put back in the starting role asap.

Yes he did, with the worst OL in the NFL. THank you for noticing this today.

 

[b8rtm8nn]

I mostly agree john - but I think there is a slight difference - with Kolb and a better OL, I think we can get into the playoffs; I don't think that is possible with Skeleton. Everyone thinks we start next year with Skeleton, Lindsey and guy 3, but so far, I see Kolb Lindsey and guy 3. I think Skeleton is not good enough to be the backup on THIS offense, and will likely be a journeyman backup like McCown for a few years.

And the Cards have shown that they will likely eat some dollars on Kolb next year if he returns and is stable enough to compete for the starting role.

 

[Mulli]

I have lost faith in both Kolb and Skelton.

I have a question for Skelton apologists.

What excuse do you have for the plays when Skelton had lots of time to throw, but he bounced the throw to the receiver?

It happens?
All QB's throw balls into the dirt?

 

[kerouac9]

7.2 YPA by my calculation is hardly taking short checkdowns to pump up his completion % at the end of the game.

Skelton is a limited player and doesn't have the ability to become a top quarterback in this league. There's no hate involved in that, it just is what it is. He didn't get help from the OL in terms of having a pocket to step up in and drive the ball to receivers, and he's not as nifty as Kolb at finding different angles to deliver the ball through.

Remember: All offseason was focused on developing Skelton's mechanics to make him a more accurate passer.